![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
User | Talk | Articles | To Do | Toolbox | Subpages | DYK | Awards |
Welcome to my talk page. Leave me a message!
I'm sporadic on Wikipedia these days, but feel free to email me where you will probably get a fairly swift response.
![]() | This user is stalked by friendly talk page staplers. | ![]() |
Bureaucrat chat - invitation to participate
The RfA for MB has gone to a bureaucrat chat. Please join in the discussion. Primefac (talk) 15:02, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
hackers targeting persons that don't convey into their schemes
Who does a victim turn too 2001:5B0:4ED0:1968:74CE:44D9:B8E4:10D3 (talk) 11:02, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
- That would very much depend on the location - but I would recommend contacting your local authorities. WormTT(talk) 11:32, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
ARCA 2024
Regarding the complete removal per User:SilkTork in 2024 and the topics I'm interested in.
- Civil parishes, are presumed notable except perhaps pre 1974 urban parishes. I should create all other than perhaps the pre 1974 urban parishes but I need to make sure the articles have sufficient content etc.
- BUAs/BUASDs, are probably notable though some that aren't settlements may fail WP:GEOLAND in terms of "other areas not commonly recognized as a place are not presumed to be notable". I could probably create quite a few of those that are settlements.
- Domesday places, most are likely notable but like BUAs they could fall under areas not commonly recognized as places, see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Caldecote, Buckinghamshire for an example of an AFD. I could probably create some at least those that are/were settlements.
- Villages, are generally presumed notable, almost all villages will have been legally recognized in some way at some point. I can probably create most of the few that don't exist yet.
- Hamlets, are controversial, some feel all can exist some while others feel they should generally be included in the parish they are in. I probably shouldn't create many hamlet articles.
- Islands, are generally notable unless very small. I could probably create some but make sure their notable.
- Listed buildings, are controversial, at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/172 High Street, Elstow (2nd nomination) its been argued that all listed buildings are notable per WP:GEOFEAT and years ago I argued that all are notable but actually I don't think that should be the case. There are around 300,000 Grade II listed buildings in England and many don't have much sourcing/significant outside the listing so I'd argue that all should be included on Wikipedia but most shouldn't have standalone articles but rather as I previously suggested with a bot to have a list for each parish/unparished area like Listed buildings in Dalston, Cumbria. I would even go as far as to say I don't think most Grade II* listed buildings will be notable I'd I'd further say that while more than half of Grade I listed buildings are likely to merit a standalone article that they may not be inherently notable. I plan soon to start a discussion on this.
I think as long as I mainly stick to presumed notable/likely notable topics and don't create many topics that may well not be notable I should be fine. Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:43, 27 February 2023 (UTC)
- Hi @Crouch, Swale. I don't expect to be on the committee for ARCA 2024. I have also made my position quite clear. You should not be mass creating articles. You should not be creating articles with "presumed" notability or "probable" notability - but instead only creating articles that you personally can establish notability and therefore write a non-stub article about. Therefore, were I on the committee, I would oppose any change to the topic ban, which I believe suits its intended purpose. WormTT(talk) 08:55, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- Crouch, Swale, I think it is worth noting that "presumed notable" means that if there are sufficient reliable sources attesting to the existence of a place that such an article will likely survive an AfD. There does, however, need to be reliable sources cited when creating an article. SilkTork (talk) 10:55, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- @SilkTork: by "presumed notable" I was referring to topics that are inherently notable such as municipalities and species. As Wikipedia:Notability says a topic can be presumed notable if it either satisfies GNG or a subject-specific notability guideline unless excluded by WP:NOT. If the topic is inherently notable it will generally be kept at AFD unless an exception applies. If the topic isn't inherently notable (or may not be) then generally significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the topic must be presented otherwise the topic is deleted or merged. My point about listed buildings is that despite the guideline apparently suggesting their notable I have doubts and that they would be better covered in a list like the one presented above or see Listed buildings in Helbeck for a small one (of which I created the parish-Helbeck) as 172 High Street, Elstow now does as I suggested at the AFD. Just remember per WP:ARTN that there isn't a requirement that the sources are currently in the article but I would make sure they were. To give an example of a place that would be inherently notable, see Stanwix Rural which is a unit with its own local government would be notable even if significant textual coverage doesn't exist but per WP:GEOLAND for places without that like Heavy Woollen District (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heavy Woollen District) they generally need to pass GNG but even if inherently notable I need to create articles with reasonable content. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:32, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- All articles require sufficient reliable sources. That is the point which I am trying to impress upon you, and which seems to cause you problems. If an article is deemed to be "presumed notable" AND has sufficient reliable sources then it will likely survive an AfD as a stand alone article. If an article does not have sufficient reliable sources but is "presumed notable" then it won't be speedy deleted, but could be taken to AfD for discussion. Any plan of yours for creating articles must include a provision for providing sufficient reliable sources in order to save the community time and effort from discussing each article to establish if it is notable. I am not going to get involved with this issue any further as you have a way, Crouch, Swale, of eating up people's time for little or no return. I will not be responding to any more pings. SilkTork (talk) 18:04, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- Yes all my articles should have sources that will avoid unnecessary trips to AFD/editors time upon creation. Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:09, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- All articles require sufficient reliable sources. That is the point which I am trying to impress upon you, and which seems to cause you problems. If an article is deemed to be "presumed notable" AND has sufficient reliable sources then it will likely survive an AfD as a stand alone article. If an article does not have sufficient reliable sources but is "presumed notable" then it won't be speedy deleted, but could be taken to AfD for discussion. Any plan of yours for creating articles must include a provision for providing sufficient reliable sources in order to save the community time and effort from discussing each article to establish if it is notable. I am not going to get involved with this issue any further as you have a way, Crouch, Swale, of eating up people's time for little or no return. I will not be responding to any more pings. SilkTork (talk) 18:04, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
- @SilkTork: by "presumed notable" I was referring to topics that are inherently notable such as municipalities and species. As Wikipedia:Notability says a topic can be presumed notable if it either satisfies GNG or a subject-specific notability guideline unless excluded by WP:NOT. If the topic is inherently notable it will generally be kept at AFD unless an exception applies. If the topic isn't inherently notable (or may not be) then generally significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the topic must be presented otherwise the topic is deleted or merged. My point about listed buildings is that despite the guideline apparently suggesting their notable I have doubts and that they would be better covered in a list like the one presented above or see Listed buildings in Helbeck for a small one (of which I created the parish-Helbeck) as 172 High Street, Elstow now does as I suggested at the AFD. Just remember per WP:ARTN that there isn't a requirement that the sources are currently in the article but I would make sure they were. To give an example of a place that would be inherently notable, see Stanwix Rural which is a unit with its own local government would be notable even if significant textual coverage doesn't exist but per WP:GEOLAND for places without that like Heavy Woollen District (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heavy Woollen District) they generally need to pass GNG but even if inherently notable I need to create articles with reasonable content. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:32, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
Quick clarification on an Arbcom case
Hey Worm (yay I'm back again :) )
I had a quick question, so figured I'll just ask here instead of making a full statement just to get a clarification.
If I'm reading correctly, here you stated that Black Kite and @Floquenbeam: suggested indef-blocking DBachmann (with caveats/until they reply/etc etc). But best I can tell, Floq did not make such a suggestion at the case request. Am I being confused, or is there another discussion on this I missed? Thanks.
Soni (talk) 12:13, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- On a phone so I can’t link properly, but I suggested that at the bottom of my talk page. I assume wtt, like all cool people, has that on his watchlist. Floquenbeam (talk) 12:17, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hey, that’s where WTT got his “thumb his nose” phrasing! I knew it sounded familiar! Floquenbeam (talk) 12:20, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hi @Soni good to see you back! I knew I had seen it somewhere (and I thank Floq for pointing out where!). For the record, I've also seen JBL make a similar suggestion at the ANI thread. Am quite tempted to write up a potential community desysop process where Admins can block other admins with community consensus - and if it sticks for say, a month, then the bit is automatically removed.
- @Floquenbeam I didn't intentionally quote you re the thumbing nose! I'd clearly read it and it had stuck in my head. G'ah! WormTT(talk) 12:21, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- Happens to me all the time Floquenbeam (talk) 12:24, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
Am quite tempted to write up a potential community desysop process...
- Honestly anything in that direction would be both great and much needed. I've stated it a couple times before and I'll say it again, we need more community consensus based steps for admin accountability, so just that proposal seems to be a massive step up from just Arbcom enforced procedures. I haven't been back long enough to observe enough of the community, but I'd definitely be interested in checking out/being another set of eyes on such a proposal.
- And thanks for the pro tip Floq, I now have you watchlisted as well :) Soni (talk) 13:02, 29 March 2023 (UTC)