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and everyone else's input is merely an obstacle to overcome is an accurate summary of how you ended up in this position.
Basalisk inspect damage⁄berate 4 August 2013
Well said!Liz Read! Talk!
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20 March 2023 |
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Recommended reading for editors who are upset RIGHT NOW!:
Tips for the angry new user - Gamaliel
Staying cool when the editing gets hot!
If you came here just to insult me, I will delete your comments without a reply.
And if I wasn't involved, personal attacks clearly warrant a block.
You have. mail. The format of the project has changed since my last email (to anyone), so my apologies if this is inelegant or incorrect. --Anthony Bradbury"talk" 15:40, 1 March 2023 (UTC)
This category is based on the ongoing WikiProject Taiwan 1000 and will be tagged with entries through the {{WikiProject Taiwan 1000}} template. I am sorry that my English is not good and I could not find out how to raise it on the relevant page, I hope can get help, thank you! -- NHC、not NPC!。:.゚(*`・ω・)ゞ:。 16:28, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
Deletion review for Sean Bielat
An editor has asked for a deletion review of Sean Bielat. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Interestingfinds12 (talk) 17:34, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
Undelete request: List of Verbotene Liebe characters
Hi, are you able to undelete List of Verbotene Liebe characters so I can take a look at the content? I will promptly redirect it to the main article, Verbotene Liebe. All of the poorly sourced, plot heavy individual character articles are currently being PRODed and I'm planning to redirect all of them as well. I'd like to get an overall picture of the existing content to strategize if and how any character info should be reintroduced, perhaps in the main article or as a sourced list. Thanks in advance.— TAnthonyTalk 21:05, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, TAnthony,
Done As a contested PROD, I have restored the page. If I remember rightly, there were a lot of redirects to this page but if you are just going to redirect the list to another article, then it doesn't make a lot of sense to restore the redirects to point to another redirect. Of course, if you want to recreate any of them, feel free but just be selective. Glad I could help. Liz Read! Talk! 21:14, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks so much. Yes I won't restore any of the redirects to this page.— TAnthonyTalk 21:30, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, TAnthony,
- I was looking at upcoming PRODs (at User:DumbBOT/ProdSummary) and there are quite a few that concern Verbotene Liebe. You might want to consider those listed. Liz Read! Talk! 23:50, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks so much. Yes I won't restore any of the redirects to this page.— TAnthonyTalk 21:30, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
Thank you
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The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar | |
With much appreciation for your thoughtfulness and help. Ppt91talk 23:58, 2 March 2023 (UTC) |
You deleted this as G13, even though the last human edit appears to be October 21, 2022, which is less than 4 months ago. This was found via Wikipedia:Database reports/Possibly out-of-process deletions#G13, which you may want to keep an eye on (it updates every 3 days). * Pppery * it has begun... 04:37, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, * Pppery *,
- Thank you so much for bringing this mistake to my attention. I'd say that 99.99% of the CSD G13 page deletions are identified as eligible by a bot, SDZeroBot, specifically. The bot is always accurate, to a fault. It's when drafts are tagged by human editors that mistakes happen. There seems to be a lot of confusion over the G13 criteria because I think the majority of CSD G13 taggings by human editors are incorrect, the editor doesn't look carefully at the "last edited date" or they think any old, abandoned User page is eligible. I should have caught this one.
- Thanks for letting me know about Wikipedia:Database reports/Possibly out-of-process deletions#G13, I'll check it regularly from now on. Again, I appreciate the notice. Have a good weekend. Liz Read! Talk! 04:47, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
- The same report seems to have caught two other bad deletions you performed: Draft:Seat (car) (not G13 eligible for another week), EXPO Communications, Inc. (dba ExpoTV) (was deleted as R3 despite having been around for a decade and that criterion only applying to recently-created pages). * Pppery * it has begun... 23:26, 10 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, * Pppery *,
Done Restored. I think Draft:Seat (car) got caught up in an otherwise normal batch delete which is sometimes done in early morning hours when the G13s have accumulated overnight. We have a great editor Josh who tags all of the drafts that have expired during the middle of the night and it can lead to dozens of tagged drafts. During the day and evening (at least on my clock), we stay on top of them as they expire but in the middle of the night, we have few editors paying attention to them and they can pile up in large numbers.
- But I have no explanation for how I came to delete EXPO Communications, Inc. (dba ExpoTV). That was just an outright mistake. I might nominate it at RFD but I've found that sometimes redirects I think are awkward or not useful are seen as valuable to RFD regulars. Thanks again for bringing these to my attention. It's nice to know that there is a safety net for admins when errors happen. Liz Read! Talk! 23:40, 10 March 2023 (UTC)
- I see there was also Draft:J O E which was tagged too early. I know I do a lot of page deletions so a couple of mistakes is to be expected but this is still disconcerting to me. I'll think about what might be going on over the weekend. I'm glad we have this database list. Liz Read! Talk! 23:45, 10 March 2023 (UTC)
- The same report seems to have caught two other bad deletions you performed: Draft:Seat (car) (not G13 eligible for another week), EXPO Communications, Inc. (dba ExpoTV) (was deleted as R3 despite having been around for a decade and that criterion only applying to recently-created pages). * Pppery * it has begun... 23:26, 10 March 2023 (UTC)
Drafts
Can you please stop deleting my drafts. 𝕱𝖎𝖈𝖆𝖎𝖆 (talk) 00:43, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, 𝕱𝖎𝖈𝖆𝖎𝖆,
- Every day, we get a list of drafts that have not been edited in at least 6 months and they are deleted when they expire. They are considered "abandoned" because no editor is working on them. It is not personal, it happens with all drafts no matter who created them. If you edit them at least every six months, they will not be deleted. It's very simple and I left you a talk page message about this a while ago.
- Alternatively, you can move your drafts out of Draft space into your User space and do not submit them them to WP:AFC (or remove any AFC tags) and then they won't appear on the list of expiring drafts. We don't make individual exceptions, it's all up to you, either actively edit your drafts regularly or move them to your User space and out of Draft space. But you can't create draft articles and abandon them and expect them to be kept. It's an agreed upon speedy deletion criteria that we all live with. Liz Read! Talk! 01:00, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
User:Ckirby9
Hey Liz, I saw that you deleted User:Ckirby9 for using it as a web host. Can you tell me if the content was the same as Draft:Pro 32's or Draft:World Cup Simulations? Gonnym (talk) 14:54, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Gonnym,
- No, it was a standard personal profile that many new editors post on their User page but it was of a minor and included some personal information. It was not an article draft. Liz Read! Talk! 17:46, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
Undelete Request: User:Daniel Jackson 2001/sandbox
Greetings,
My personal sandbox was nominated for speedy deletion and has since been deleted. I've made a decision to contest the speedy deletion, and I wish to make a second appeal. Since I became a user on Wikipedia, I've constantly messed around and toyed with my personal sandbox, without any serious intention of publication. I've always been interested in alternative history, and using the vast amount of infoboxs, I've created alternative World War I or World War II scenarios. I've also created alternate versions of real-life countries, and even created scenarios of future versions or alternate versions of real-life royalty or politicians. I've done this for years, it is quite clearly fictional, and I do not understand as to why it would constitute an issue now. I have had no intention of spreading false information or hoaxes, this was my personal sandbox and not an actual article.
~~~~ Daniel Jackson 2001 (talk) 14:52, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Daniel Jackson 2001,
- I see you are talking about User:Daniel Jackson 2001/sandbox and I was stunned to see that there are almost 3,000 edits to this page and that's about as many edits as you made during your entire time here! Are you contributing at all to building an encyclopedia or improving existing articles or are you just playing around in your sandbox? Ordinarily, I'd restore a page upon request but I think you are using Wikipedia as your personal webhost and not creating factual articles in your User space which is the purpose on this project.
- There are other alternate history platforms where you can take your speculation about future kings of England but this is a clearly fictitious article that has no place on Wikipedia.
- If you have questions about creating appropriate pages on Wikipedia, please bring them to the Teahouse. Thank you. Liz Read! Talk! 17:41, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- I would be remiss if I didn't let you know that you can appeal this deletion decision at Wikipedia:Deletion review. Liz Read! Talk! 17:42, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
Redirects to moved GA talk pages
Hi -- I see you're deleting redirects to moved GA talk pages. I've been doing a lot of these moves recently, and I have been in two minds about the usefulness of the redirects, but Chipmunkdavis asked me to leave them in place when doing the moves as they believe they are useful. (I'm not an admin but as I have the page mover right I can avoid leaving redirects when I do the moves.) Is there a standing consensus that these redirects should not exist? Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 17:30, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Mike Christie,
- No, I don't think there is any agreed-upon understanding of what to do with these redirect pages, they just showed up on Wikipedia:Database reports/Orphaned talk subpages and usually pages that show up on database reports like this are deleted unless there is some outstanding reason to keep them. I guess you can restore them if you believe it's appropriate. Sorry for any confusion these page deletions caused. Liz Read! Talk! 17:33, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- No apology needed; I'm not even sure they shouldn't be deleted. I guess if there's some agreement they shouldn't be then we need to keep them out of the relevant database reports in some way. Chipmunkdavis, what do you think Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 17:38, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- The concern with such deletions is that they break existing links. For example, Talk:2009 Northwest Airlines Flight 253/GA1 is linked to in the article history of Talk:Northwest Airlines Flight 253, so as it has been deleted there is no link to the GA review on the talkpage. CMD (talk) 01:24, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
- No apology needed; I'm not even sure they shouldn't be deleted. I guess if there's some agreement they shouldn't be then we need to keep them out of the relevant database reports in some way. Chipmunkdavis, what do you think Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 17:38, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
Redirect
Hello. Could you create redirect List of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Max Verstappen to Max Verstappen#Complete Formula One results and connect to list of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Max Verstappen (Q111507070). Eurohunter (talk) 19:50, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Eurohunter,
- I can create a redirect from List of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Max Verstappen to Max Verstappen#Complete Formula One results although I'll need to protect it afterwards. But what do you mean by "connect to list of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Max Verstappen (Q111507070)"? We can add a category to a redirect page but I'm not sure what is involved with connecting a page to another Wiki project other than creating a soft redirect. Please clarify what additional steps you want me to do besides creating the redirect and I'll see what I can do. Thank you. Liz Read! Talk! 19:55, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks. Just link redirect to Wikidata item - I will do it myself then. Eurohunter (talk) 18:59, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
Kowalski’s Market
Can you reverse your deletion of my Wikipedia page? There’s no reason for that. It was notable, had sourcing and someone mistakenly moved it to a draft space so I moved it back. TheUSConservative (talk) 21:05, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, TheUSConservative,
- The only page I deleted was Wikipedia:Kowalski's Markets and that is because articles do not belong in Wikipedia/Project space. Wikipedia space is for policy pages and noticeboards. So, I moved it back to Draft space. No content was deleted from your article, the only edit on Wikipedia:Kowalski's Markets was the page move there and back to Draft space so there is no deleted content to restore...everything is in the version in Draft space. I recommend you submit the draft to Articles for Creation for review so you can get the opinion of some experienced editors on it so it is less likely to be deleted. But, if you want, you can move it directly to main space/Article space. But there is no reason to restore a redirect from Wikipedia space to Draft space.
- If you have questions about article creation, deletion policy, namespaces or editing on Wikipedia, please bring them to the Teahouse. I hope this addresses your concern. Liz Read! Talk! 21:14, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
Thanks. I fixed it. TheUSConservative (talk) 21:21, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
Soft delete?
Wouldn't Spider-Man and Batman: Disordered Minds be eligible for soft delete rather than relisting? FWIW, since you relisted it, there have been two comments favoring deletion. Just Another Cringy Username (talk) 04:01, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Just Another Cringy Username,
- I'll consider your suggestion and review the discussion later. Thanks. Liz Read! Talk! 04:12, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks for the quick response. I'd make a similar request for Batman & Spider-Man: New Age Dawning once it finishes its AfD period. It's the sequel to Disordered Minds and the AfD is showing a similar lack of participation. Just Another Cringy Username (talk) 05:59, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
Drafting
It's an entirely new problem which has really only started cropping up in the past week. What happens is that if somebody adds categories to the page while it's still in draft, and then moves the page into mainspace shortly thereafter, then the redirect created by the page move somehow lingers in an incategory search of the categories that the page was filed in, even though the categories aren't present on the redirect and the title isn't visible in a direct look at the category itself. The primary issue was with Category:Living people in particular — because that category has over a million articles in it, it can't be searched for WP:DRAFTNOCAT or WP:USERNOCAT violations just by eyeballing the category, so I have to use an incategory search to check it rather than scanning it directly off the polluted article reports, and thus was seeing them. And they weren't clearing on their own either, as about seven or eight of the ones that showed up last week were still lingering in the search this morning.
Even though I've been doing an incategory search on that category at least once or twice a day for years, I had never seen this happen at all before this year — there was one isolated case in January, the first time I had ever seen it at all, but then after that the problem didn't recur again until last week, when suddenly there were about 20 of them all at once. But I'm sure that "add categories to the draft just before moving the page into mainspace" isn't a new thing that people just suddenly started doing last week, and hadn't already been doing for years without incident, so it's very clearly a new problem.
I already reported it to WP:VPT last week, who advised me to file a bug report at Phabricator — which I did, and it looks like the issue may now have been solved, as none of the pages that were in the incategory search this morning are still there now. So hopefully I won't have to do that anymore, because it was really irritating to try to fix them all manually (which is why I only moved about half of them yesterday before giving up and going to bed while leaving the rest to be dealt with later.) But if it does recur again, at least now you have some context for what I was talking about. Bearcat (talk) 04:25, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
A kitten for you!
Thanks for contributing so much to Wikipedia!
STB (talk) 01:36, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
Hello Liz!
I'm the admin for the draft Cumulative Dis-Advantage (CDA). You deleted the page on 21:18, 7 January 2023 and I can't seem to tell why. I do understand that it was incomplete, but I didn't notice the draft's deletion until today when I came to communicate with the fine folx at Wikipedia, and add more sections to beef it up. I am working with a few other PhD students, and as you can imagine, getting people to agree on what's important and what's not is, well, trying.
Cumulative Dis/Advantage is the only actual theory in my field, which is Life Course Sociology. One of the first responses to the page submission was that it was too similar to The Matthew Effect, so we were trying to come together and figure out a way to differentiate it from CDA.
Before realizing the page had been deleted, I wanted to ask you guys if you had any specific recommendations on how the page could be written and/or organized better, if empirical examples would help, that kind of thing.
Would you consider reinstating the draft so my colleagues and I can continue working on it?
Thank you kindly,
Micah Micaharafah (talk) 03:20, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
- (talk page stalker). @Micaharafah, the article was not deleted. What Liz deleted was a redirect to Draft:Cumulative dis-advantage, which is the page's current title. Star Mississippi 03:27, 10 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you @Star Mississippi!! Micaharafah (talk) 13:04, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
Vilikesa AfD
I think you knew this was coming... I strenuously disagree that this was closable as "keep". All arguments on what constitutes SIGCOV aside, WP:YOUNGATH is a guideline that makes it very clear coverage must be prolonged to count towards notability, and this is a 15-year-old who has never played even semi-professionally, nor for a national team, so two interviews in local news (most interviews and local news also both being inadmissible per YOUNGATH) published in the same week are objectively unacceptable for establishing notability. Can you please relist? JoelleJay (talk) 18:35, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, JoelleJay,
- Yes, I expected to hear from you. Ordinarily, I would refuse your request as I believe the consensus was clear to "Keep" this article even if some of the Keeps were Weak Keeps. But I expect then you would go straight to Deletion review and I think it is less disruptive to just allow a relist for another week or until another closer wants to bring the discussion to an end. Now I expect other editors will come here and complain about a relist so it's one of those sports-related decisions that doesn't make everyone happy.
- However, I ask that you not do any canvassing about this discusion. You might be offended by even the suggestion of you doing this but it's always a possibility in these lopsided discussions where there is a lone dedicated editor whose opinion is not aligned with everyone else in the discussion. Liz Read! Talk! 19:26, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hi Liz, thank you very much for considering the relist. I understand your rationale and also why you would want to caution against canvassing. I did start a conversation with SpiderOne at his talk before I saw your reply, but as he's already !voted I don't think that's a problem? JoelleJay (talk) 19:38, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
- I thought I'd also mention the reason this is getting more attention now is probably from my mentioning the backlog at AfD on the NSPORT talk page before asking for a relist (i.e. not from me canvassing anyone). JoelleJay (talk) 22:37, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hi Liz, thank you very much for considering the relist. I understand your rationale and also why you would want to caution against canvassing. I did start a conversation with SpiderOne at his talk before I saw your reply, but as he's already !voted I don't think that's a problem? JoelleJay (talk) 19:38, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
The deletion tag seems a bit premature. Doesn't it say the category has to be empty for 7 days? Someone who's wrong on the internet (talk) 01:37, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Someone who's wrong on the internet,
- Well, you are right and wrong. As soon as an empty category is found, it is tagged CSD C1. Then it sits for 7 days. If it wasn't tagged, then we'd have no idea when the 7 day period was over. The tagging starts the 7 day period. If it is no longer empty during that week, the tag is removed. If it is still empty after a week, it is deleted. Liz Read! Talk! 04:41, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
- Makes sense. Thanks! Someone who's wrong on the internet (talk) 05:13, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
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Adam Odufuye sandbox
Hi, I tagged the user subpage User:Adam Odufuye/sandbox for G11, not U5. The subject of the page is an obvious immediate family of the user and the page is blatantly promotional. Fancy Refrigerator (talk) 19:47, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
- This is not a plausible draft. The page speaks highly of the person and is completely business related, not a genuine biography. Fancy Refrigerator (talk) 19:54, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
Agree
I read your closing statement at WP:Articles for deletion/Shiho Yano with interest, and head-nodding. I guess it is better than outright deletion, as you said, but damn, I hate tacking a woman's lives onto the husband's article as though she is merely a fleshy appendage. There are a couple of entries like that on the never-ending list of AfD-merges that can just sit there until they rot. I'm not going to merge them. Joyous! Noise! 22:17, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
Aissatou Barry
User:Raymarcbadz removed the redirect for this article (it was closed as a redirect last year). IS this an appropriate edit? Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 03:45, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Sportsfan 1234,
- No, it's not appropriate to change a redirect resulting from an AFD closure back into an article but it happens. It's not rare but usually the editor waits a few weeks or months before they try to circumvent the AFD decision. Typically, if another editor notices, it goes back for a 2nd AFD unless the article recreation is a vast improvement over the original article and the AFD results in a deletion rather than a redirect. Liz Read! Talk! 22:39, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
- Is there away to compare the articles? Am I allowed to redirect it again, or does it need to go to AFD again? Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 22:44, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
Expiring drafts
Hope you're having a good weekend. Re this deletion, what happened to the bot that used to give a warning? No issue with the deletion, of course, and I'll restore it if I find sourcing, but I feel like the process had a hiccup here. Star Mississippi 22:13, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Star Mississippi,
- No, no hiccups, unfortunately this worked according to the current system. Firefly Bot gives a 5 month warning ONCE which I think you received in September 2022. It doesn't give a 2nd or 3rd 5 month warning. I've asked Firefly if they could have the bot give out 5 month warnings no matter how many times it's been given out before but the bot still doesn't do this and I don't know why this can't be arranged. Maybe if you could also recommend it to them, my suggestion might get more support. It's not unusual for an editor to have to go to REFUND 2, 3 or even 4 times when their drafts keep getting deleted every six months. For a handful of editors who produce a lot of drafts (like in the hundreds), it can be tricky to keep track of which ones are close to their expiration month so I wish Firefly Bot would give out regular 5 month notices even if they have already been given out once.
- But I am surprised that I didn't leave a personal message to you. I usually add a personal note when I see that the draft creator is an admin or a long-time editor but I'm playing catch-up today with the time change and I guess this slipped by me. I don't like posting template messages like this to experienced editors but there is typically anywhere from 150-225 drafts and User pages expiring each day (although it can get up to 400+ drafts) and so handling them all in a timely way can get a little mechanical just due to the numbers. Hey man im josh helps out on weekdays but it's just me on the weekends now that Explicit seems to have semi-retired. Luckily, unlike vandalism, BLP- or copyright-violations, old drafts are not an urgent issue to deal with and I get to them when I get to them. Liz Read! Talk! 22:34, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
- Oops, indeed it did. I guess I also didn't realize how long it had been since I started that draft. No worries on the lack of a personal note. Hard to know at a glance who created something, especially with the volume of draft expirations. It does seem that a second set of reminders would be helpful. Not sure how taxing it would be to the bot, but I'll raise it with Firefly. Thanks again for the explanation. Star Mississippi 23:33, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
Abandoned RfA
Hi Liz, I recently did some idle rummaging around WP:Database reports/Unfiled RfAs and noticed WP:RFA/Ronjohn, which someone tagged for speedy deletion in 2021 and which you then untagged because the criteria didn't apply. However, you also asked Ronjohn whether he'd be okay with deletion at User talk:Ronjohn#Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Ronjohn 2, to which he both emphatically and belatedly answered last November. Technically, that does count as a U1, no? Dr. Duh 🩺 (talk) 15:37, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
ME to forestall G13 status – an interesting wrinkle, re: copy attribution
Thanks for being on the lookout for some of my close-to-expired drafts and saving them from oblivion, such as these two saves at Draft:Grievance politics. In the case of this draft, I've merged everything I care about into Grievance politics and am content to let it go, and was going to G7 it to save you wasted effort in the future. But then I noticed this edit summary with copy attribution naming the Draft page, so in theory, now it *mustn't* be deleted! But that puts us in a quandary, because of course it will be/should be deleted.
I've raised this interesting case in discussion at WT:Copying within Wikipedia. You may be interested in that discussion, and your feedback there would be appreciated. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 06:29, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
Short articles?
I just read your point that articles being short is not a valid reason for deletion. I'm still pretty new to Wikipedia so I humbly ask about how to proceed with extremely short articles. Given that stubs exist, if an article is too short, shouldn't it be a stub? Or are there exceptions where a proper article can be as short as a stub? Or is it that maybe the recommendation for an AfD only failing because of size should be to transform into stub instead of delete?
Thank you in advance! Irecorsan (talk) 06:44, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
Rev del requested
On User talk:Shahabali839898 All three of this user's edits after Dan's creation of the talk page (with a declined review message) were a copyright violation of worthax.com (specifically https://www.worthax.com/2023/01/patimat-rasulova-bio-wiki-wife-height.html and likely other worthax pages as well) and was a partial recreation of this user's sandbox (db-copyvio nom'd by me) and of their identical draft (db-g12 nom'd by Dan). Talk page Rev dels requested for these three edits. Thank you. Zinnober9 (talk) 07:24, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Zinnober9,
- Thank you for bringing this to my attention, I took care of it earlier today. Liz Read! Talk! 00:05, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
Are we absolutely sure this isn't a reverse copyvio? I'm pretty sure the New York Public Library doesn't have forks of Wikipedia articles. It's just this article has been around with the plagiarised text, for over a decade. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 23:39, 15 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Ritchie333,
- The content had been in the article since it was created in 2011. Do you think NYPL would use Wikipedia content to describe their collection without attribution? I'm not sure but I think I have more faith in the NYPL curators and a Wikipedia editor. I'm not against restoration but, as I said, this content has been part of the article since it was created and it forms a large part of the article. What do you think? Liz Read! Talk! 00:04, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
- It looks like a G12 to me, and I deleted it as such. I just noticed it was on the main page and nobody spotted it. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 00:09, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
- Well, Ritchie333, I only came across this article after reading about a terrible B-movie from the 1960s where they mention that Carter was in the film, playing a woman. I was curious about a person being a drag artist in the 1950s and 1960s since it was more unusual then and then I wanted to read more so I was looking at the references to read more about his life. Then I saw the exact language surrounding the cause of his death in both places so I did a page check. So, it's just a random sequence of events that caused me to even notice and tag this article. I always tag G12s and don't delete the articles myself because I'm not sure about instances when the copyright violating content can just be removed (with some revision deletions) but it didn't seem like that was possible here. Too bad, I hope we get another article on this fellow. Liz Read! Talk! 00:16, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
- It looks like a G12 to me, and I deleted it as such. I just noticed it was on the main page and nobody spotted it. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 00:09, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
New Article Submission Problems
{{You've got mail}}
New Article Problems
In August of 2022 I finally took the plunge and submitted my very first article. I crafted it to be almost identical to [[List of federal political scandals in the United States]]. When I submitted it, there were no red flags on my sandbox.
Six months later, an automated filter box appeared saying it had detected [[Deprecated sources]]. I checked and found I had used none of the listed 47 depricated sources listed. And none of them showed up in my sandbox, just the warning. I asked for help at the [[Help Desk]] where two editors were baffled by the use of the warning, but one editor mentioned 8 references which he considered questionable, but not deprecated, so I removed them to be safe.
However, when I asked for more examples he declined, but suggested I redo the templates for all the references, and now I see my sandbox article has been flagged with 125 consecutive references for [[Template:Cite news]], when their seems to be nothing wrong with the previous 1500 references. I also checked [[Citing sources]] which states, ‘While you should try to write citations correctly, what matters most is that you provide enough information to identify the source. Others will improve the formatting if needed.’ Is that right?
I have rechecked for Deprecated sources and made sure all of my references are alive and complete. Is it absolutely necessary for new article submission that every reference be perfect? Can you help? Johnsagent (talk) 07:33, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
Books & Bytes – Issue 55
The Wikipedia Library: Books & Bytes
Issue 55, January – February 2023
- New bundle partners:
- Newspapers.com
- Fold3
- 1Lib1Ref January report
- Spotlight: EDS SmartText Searching
Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Wikipedia Library team --12:45, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
Remove perm
Hi Liz, I don't have enough time or energy to do new page patrolling any more, and I can't imagine NPPing any time soon. Can you please remove the perm from me? — Qwerfjkltalk 20:36, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Qwerfjkl,
Done Thanks for all of your continuing help on the project! Liz Read! Talk! 20:42, 16 March 2023 (UTC)
Hey again. I'd like to have this file undeleted and then taken to FFD again. I asked around at WP:MCQ, and one disagree with me about its copyright status. As I figured, FFD is the safer venue to re-discuss it. George Ho (talk) 08:52, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
Category deletion
Hello Liz, may I ask you why you have deleted Category:Use_Hiberno-English_from_November_2012? I don't think it is a maintenance category and it's not empty either. Thanks --RonaldH (talk) 22:51, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
Recent category speedy deletion noms
Hi, I thought I'd explain here in a bit more detail why I have removed the speedy deletion tag from 7 categories I recently created. The reason is that the categories aren't empty, the pages just havent shown up yet. For Primitive Irish, there's ᚛ᚑᚌᚐᚋ᚜; for Laz, there's Abu River; for Innu, there's Akamassiss; for Alutiiq, there's Alas'kaaq; for Karelian, there's Alavoine; for Alemannic German, there's Alemannisch; and for Classical Mandaic, there's Alf Trisar Šuialia. The pages just haven't shown up in the categories yet. Thanks, greyzxq talk 12:20, 18 March 2023 (UTC)
Undeletion or Draftify request
Hey Liz, you have deleted the page Akkaldhamayile Pennu few days before. The person who raised many deletion points User:Akevsharma has been confirmed as a sockpuppet and has been blocked few days before. So the discussion might be manupulated by him in some form and you can some IP votes in that discussion which says delete, which might be from his side. I request you to undelete the page Jayaram Kailas as the discussion might be manupulated and this is the case or you may draftify it as I wish to work on the article Christopheronthemove (talk) 18:11, 18 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, Christopheronthemove,
- I don't think Akevsharma unduly influenced that AFD discussion on Akkaldhamayile Pennu, if anything, you were bludgeoning the conversation. I also think it's interesting that you thought an IP editor's opinion was suspicious when they had just become active as you jumped into AFD discussions immediately after creating an account yourself which is what led to you being investigated as a possible sockpuppet. As for Jayaram Kailas, you should ask Joyous!, the admin who closed that AFD discussion as I'm not going to overrule another admin's decision to delete an article except for in rare situations.
- Of course, you can always file an appeal at Deletion review if you think a deletion was done improperly. But it can be much simpler to just start a new version of the article from scratch than going through the existing bureaucratic channels. Liz Read! Talk! 17:13, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
Could you temporarily restore this article? I have some concerns related to the creation and acceptance of Megan Euker, and restoring this article would help me explore them. BilledMammal (talk) 11:27, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- I see Megan Euker has now been deleted at AfD (I started exploring this issue a few weeks ago and did not notice the AfD); would you be able to restore that article as well, to draft space or my user space, temporarily for the same reason? BilledMammal (talk) 11:28, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, BilledMammal,
- I like to accommodate reasonable requests like yours but I'm going to have to say No for two different reasons. First, the draft was deleted at the request of the draft creator who is no longer active on the project. It seems odd to ignore their request to delete an article they created. As for the main space version, I'd like to request that you ask Randykitty, the admin who closed this recent AFD discussion. Given your experience on Wikipedia, I'd restore this page to Draft space if I had closed the AFD but I don't like to revert the actions of another admin except for in rare situations, like an AFD decision is being reviewed at Deletion reivew. I don't know their policy on article restoration but if you make a reasonable request, I'm sure they will consider it.
- Sorry not to be able to satisfy your requests. Liz Read! Talk! 16:44, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you for considering the request, and for your explanation of why you cannot do so; would you be able to briefly compare the two articles yourself, and tell me whether they were similar at any point? BilledMammal (talk) 16:47, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Well, BilledMammal, I'm about to head out and so I'll have to do this later. It's tricky looking at deleted articles, I can only easily look at one version at a time, it's not as easy as moving through different edits on an existing article and looking at each version of an article, it would be time-consuming and challenging to look at every single version of a deleted page, depending on how many edits there have been. But I'll look at the final version before deletion or blanking and let you know.
- If I might be so bold, what are you trying to discern here? Liz Read! Talk! 17:04, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- There is no urgency.
- From what I could determine and what I can recall, Draft:Megan Euker was started by an SPA called Mameoppenheim (talk · contribs). Shortly afterwards, they started a second version, Draft:Megan Elizabeth Euker. They completed and submitted that version, but it was rejected by AfC; they then spent a while attempting to change that decision before giving up and requesting deletion of the draft under G7.
- Hours later a new editor came along, another SPA called Atiori Zronkri (talk · contribs), and started composing a draft in their sandbox - I had not noticed this sandbox work prior to writing this post. A day later, they submitted the draft to AfC. Two minutes later it was accepted by a user called TruthGuardians (talk · contribs).
- TruthGuardians acceptance is what caused me to notice it; the editor came to my attention last year after an ANI post regarding concerns about covert canvassing; at the time I looked into it, and became concerned that meatpuppetry or sockpuppetry was taking place, and filed an SPI. The SPI found no relation, but I believe it only considered sockpuppetry, not meatpuppetry.
- Last month, several members of that group of editors popped up on my watchlist, to take a shared position against a proposal on Talk:Michael Jackson. When looking into their contributions, as part of asking Blablubbs if they could take a second look at the report (they were, understandably, too busy), I came across a few other unusual activities; this rapid acceptance of a draft being the most suspicious.
- What I am trying to determine is whether undisclosed paid editing was involved in the creation of that article, and if so whether Atiori Zronkri and Mameoppenheim are unrelated, meatpuppets, or sockpuppets. By looking at Draft:Megan Elizabeth Euker I was hoping to determine whether the article submitted as Draft:Megan Euker was a fresh attempt, or a rehashed version of the initial attempt, which I believe may shed some light on how related those two editors are.
- I am also trying to determine how TruthGuardians was involved; I don't consider a two minute AfC turnaround based solely on chance to be likely, particularly considering that 209 articles were submitted on that day, that TruthGuardians does not review many AfC's, and that AfC more broadly was severely backlogged, and that it takes more than two minutes to review an AfC submission. It also might shed more light on what I thought of as the initial issues with the broader topic of Michael Jackson; if TruthGuardians is involved in undisclosed paid editing in regards to Megan Euker, then it could indicate that UPE is going on, on a much larger scale and time frame, on that topic. This would differ from my initial thought, that it was merely a group of dedicated Michael Jackson fans.
- Having reviewed the topic further, I am also concerned by some of the editors who !voted keep in the Megan Euker AfD; Carinco Tuck (talk · contribs) was an SPA who created Leo Liu; it was deleted after two AfD's, with the first being flooded by new accounts, and at least one editor expressed concern that Carinco Tuck had an undisclosed financial stake in promoting the topic.
- Myna50 (talk · contribs) has a more extensive contribution history (primarily small gnomish edits), but the overlap with Carinco Tuck is suspicious; their first contribution to AfD for almost a year, and their second ever, was to !vote "Keep" at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rex Dane, an AfD that Carinco Tuck did the same on - Carinco Tuck has only voted on three AfD's, and Myna05 five, so the chance of this being a coincidence seems low.
- The third keep !voter, LocomotiveEngine (talk · contribs) is less suspicious; they voted in three AfD's, for their first and last time, in the space of 16 minutes. It could have been just that they discovered AfD, contributed, and then left.
- My apologies for how extensive this reply is; whenever I look at anyone associated with group it feels like I'm going down the rabbit hole. It's possible that I'm seeing something where there is nothing, but I don't think so - if I was prone to that I think I would find it outside this group as well as inside it, but I don't. BilledMammal (talk) 18:18, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you for considering the request, and for your explanation of why you cannot do so; would you be able to briefly compare the two articles yourself, and tell me whether they were similar at any point? BilledMammal (talk) 16:47, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
Guild of Copy Editors March 2023 Newsletter
Guild of Copy Editors March 2023 Newsletter
Election results: In our December 2022 coordinator election, Reidgreg and Tenryuu stepped down as coordinators; we thank them for their service. Incumbents Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo were returned as coordinators until 1 July. For the second time, no lead coordinator was chosen. Nominations for our mid-year Election of Coordinators open on 1 June (UTC). Drive: 21 editors signed up for our January Backlog Elimination Drive, 14 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 170 articles totaling 389,737 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Our February Copy Editing Blitz focused on October and November 2022 requests, and the March and April 2022 backlogs. Of the 14 editors who signed up, nine claimed at least one copy-edit; and between them, they copy-edited 39,150 words in 22 articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: Sign up now for our month-long March Backlog Elimination Drive. Barnstars awarded will be posted here after the drive closes. Progress report: As of 12:08, 19 March 2023 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 73 requests since 1 January 2023, all but five of them from 2022, and the backlog stands at 1,872 articles. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from our mailing list.
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Review of Deleted page Maria Horne
Hi Liz,
I was part of the group that wrote articles for youth climate activists from Africa and was sad to see the deletion of Maria Horne from Wikipedia. Please could you give some context as to why, even though I did read some of the deletion reasons. And would it be possible to improve the article and request it to be restored? Thank you! Rosesuccess7 RoseSuccess7 (talk) 14:22, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, RoseSuccess7,
- The reasons for deletion are all present in the AFD deletion discussion that is linked to the deleted article. I sometimes will restore the article to Draft space if you have found some additional sources that address the problems brought up in the AFD but if this is moved back to main space without getting approval from an Articles for Creation reviewer, it will just be deleted again. If you want your own copy of the article, I can email it to you if you have email enabled. But I just can't just revert an AFD deletion decision upon request. Liz Read! Talk! 16:34, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Please would you consider restoring to draft space so it can be re-edited accordingly and go through the proper approval process and review for Articles for Creation? I can see why the deletion occurred and hoping to make the necessary edits with additional sources to avoid this happening again. Thank you. RoseSuccess7 (talk) 17:19, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Just as a follow up, if a draft cannot be restored, I do have email enabled. Thank you. RoseSuccess7 (talk) 23:31, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
Sorry to keep bothering you about deletions, but John Savile, 1st Baron Savile (second creation) was not eligible for R3, because This criterion does not apply to redirects created as a result of a page move, unless the moved page was also recently created
. This was found via Wikipedia:Database reports/Possibly out-of-process deletions#Not recently-created, which oddly-enough does not explicitly look for this scenario but instead was confused by the use a WP:PAGESWAP making it appear that the redirect was 10 years old. * Pppery * it has begun... 14:42, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- It is an implausible redirect because the term "John Savile, 1st Baron Savile (second creation)" isn't likely to be searched. That alone makes it elligible for R3. Wikilawyering it won't change the outcome. It has already been deleted before, btw, and also: WP:Wikipedia is not a bureaucracy. R3 makes perfect sense for deleting a redirect under these circumstances, whether or not it was "moved". btw, it wasn't moved main->main, it was incorrectly moved from Draft to main. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 15:29, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Procedural disputes aside, surely the title the article has had for 13 years is likely to be searched? * Pppery * it has begun... 15:31, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Not really. How many would search for John Savile and use the phrase "second creation"? Plus 1st Baron Savile, all together? That is what makes in implausible. As for being here for years, that doesn't really matter, lot of junk doesn't get caught for years, there are millions upon millions of pages here. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 15:35, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Procedural disputes aside, surely the title the article has had for 13 years is likely to be searched? * Pppery * it has begun... 15:31, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- Well, I'm not sure what to do here. Technically, you are correct, * Pppery *. I saw this page move in the Move log and didn't look closely enough into the circumstances of the move to see that this article has been at this page title for years. But I also think it is a terrible page title and one unlikely to ever be searched for. I will see if there are any links to this deleted page.
- Also, sorry for how long this talk page has gotten, I stopped archiving messages when a bot was doing so incorrectly and it will take some time to take care of it now. But it is hard to navigate so I'll do it sometime this week. Liz Read! Talk! 16:28, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
- I slept on this for a day to make sure I wasn't making a hasty, emotional response, but I sill see a fundamental misunderstanding of deletion procedures in need of correction here. Wikipedia's deletion policy is not based on consequentialism, but instead based on adherence to process. Hence, the argument you are using, that you are refusing to undelete the page because you think it should be red, is improperly comingling your role as an admin with your opinion as an editor, and an undeletion is necessary. I'm not just saying this because I'm a stickler for deletion process, but because I'm genuinely not convinced that, had the proper protocol been followed and an RfD started, it would have closed as delete - RfD regulars generally give a lot more weight to keeping {{R from move}}s than you and Dennis Brown do. I don't care enough to take this to DRV, but I'll leave that as something to ponder ... * Pppery * it has begun... 02:16, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, * Pppery *,
- Well, I'm also left with a question. I see other admins on that list as ones who have made deletion mistakes. But I only see you coming to my talk page to point out my errors. Why is that? Liz Read! Talk! 02:20, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
- Not true. See User talk:Less Unless#Piotr Napierała, User talk:Charles Matthews/Archive 47#Thomas Lister, 2nd Baron Ribblesdale, User_talk:Kaiser matias#2021–22_Kazakhstan_Hockey_Championship. User talk:Paulmcdonald#Chance Odolena Voda, Special:Diff/1127086384, User talk:Cyrius#تراجم_شعراء_السودان. Remember that not every entry in the database report is actually problematic, and sometimes I decide for whatever reason that a problematic entry isn't worth challenging. I may be slightly more inclined to challenge your deletions because of you thanking me for doing so in the past, but I'm definitely not targeting only you. * Pppery * it has begun... 02:29, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
- I slept on this for a day to make sure I wasn't making a hasty, emotional response, but I sill see a fundamental misunderstanding of deletion procedures in need of correction here. Wikipedia's deletion policy is not based on consequentialism, but instead based on adherence to process. Hence, the argument you are using, that you are refusing to undelete the page because you think it should be red, is improperly comingling your role as an admin with your opinion as an editor, and an undeletion is necessary. I'm not just saying this because I'm a stickler for deletion process, but because I'm genuinely not convinced that, had the proper protocol been followed and an RfD started, it would have closed as delete - RfD regulars generally give a lot more weight to keeping {{R from move}}s than you and Dennis Brown do. I don't care enough to take this to DRV, but I'll leave that as something to ponder ... * Pppery * it has begun... 02:16, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
- It is an implausible redirect because the term "John Savile, 1st Baron Savile (second creation)" isn't likely to be searched. That alone makes it elligible for R3. Wikilawyering it won't change the outcome. It has already been deleted before, btw, and also: WP:Wikipedia is not a bureaucracy. R3 makes perfect sense for deleting a redirect under these circumstances, whether or not it was "moved". btw, it wasn't moved main->main, it was incorrectly moved from Draft to main. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 15:29, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
Eva Vlaardingerbroek (2nd nomination)
Hi, I think you made an error in judgement with relisting. It should have been closed as no consensus to delete. You are never going to get universal consensus to keep on a website of mostly left wingers to want to keep her article. Notability has clearly been demonstrated in the sources written about her and the people who want to delete are clearly ignoring this.♦ Dr. Blofeld 10:12, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
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Two minutes??? re Draft:Seclusion and restraint practices in the U.S. education system
Are you kidding me? I shouldn't get a notification about an abandoned draft at 11:48 and then get it deleted at 11:50. What can anyone do at that point? Is the system broken or are you quickly deleting these without looking? ɱ (talk) 15:57, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
@Hey man im josh: Pinging for your input as well. ɱ (talk) 15:58, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
I know you're going to take the opposing side and just say 'deal with it at WP:REFUND/G13' or similar. Shouldn't there be a period, several days to a week, that a user can act on their talk page notice before an admin swoops in to delete? ɱ (talk) 16:01, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- Hey @Ɱ, I understand how this can be frustrating. Is there any reason you didn't make a minor edit after being notified a month ahead of time by FireflyBot here? Hey man im josh (talk) 16:03, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- I didn't see that one, I usually ignore bot messages. And it seemingly was auto-archived after 2 weeks, which is my mistake. ɱ (talk) 16:06, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- We all miss things from time to time. For what it's worth, some of my G13 nominations often sit for hours at a time and other times they'll sit for just a few minutes. It's always dependent on the timing of admins reviewing the nominations. Hey man im josh (talk) 16:09, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- I didn't see that one, I usually ignore bot messages. And it seemingly was auto-archived after 2 weeks, which is my mistake. ɱ (talk) 16:06, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- I'm sure Liz will undelete even though you didn't ask very nicely, were notified a month beforehand, and had six months to make any edit to prevent its deletion. ––FormalDude (talk) 16:05, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
- To be honest, when I'm deleting G13 without Hey man im josh's help, draft creators don't get any advance notice at all. But all you have to do with G13s is to request restoration and so that's what I've done. You can also ask Firefly to have their bot send 5 month warnings every 5 months...currently, they send a warning message once but not a second or third time. Liz Read! Talk! 16:12, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
Thanks all. Could there be an automated system for a delay, or could admins delay when the G13 nominator puts the talk page notice on? (Look before you leap?) This has happened to me quite a lot. How can I make FireflyBot notify more Liz? ɱ (talk) 16:14, 20 March 2023 (UTC)