Policy | Technical | Proposals | Idea lab | WMF | Miscellaneous |
- Table of contents
- First discussion
- End of page
- New post
The technical section of the village pump is used to discuss technical issues about Wikipedia. Bug reports and feature requests should be made in Phabricator (see how to report a bug). Bugs with security implications should be reported differently (see how to report security bugs).
Newcomers to the technical village pump are encouraged to read these guidelines prior to posting here. If you want to report a JavaScript error, please follow this guideline. Questions about MediaWiki in general should be posted at the MediaWiki support desk. Discussions are automatically archived after remaining inactive for five days. | ||||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||
« Archives, 169, 170, 171, 172, 173, 174, 175, 176, 177, 178, 179, 180, 181, 182, 183, 184, 185, 186, 187, 188, 189 | ||||||||||||||||
Two man rule
Nothing's going to break if we move Template:Twomanrule to a gender-neutral name, right? WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:04, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sure, as long as you fix the double redirects quickly enough, but even then there is currently only one redirect which is used by only one page, so you may also let the bots do it and expect little disruption. Nardog (talk) 00:08, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Nothing will break. When I last checked templates could even handle double redirects (couldn't find the phab ticket responsible for it though). I would start an RM though. I have no idea what to move this to since I don't understand the purpose of it. --Trialpears (talk) 01:01, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- On a side note, can anyone explain the history of this template and why it displays "Review"? I presume there's some process that it's used for? isaacl (talk) 00:13, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- The broken what links here prevents any reasonable investigation, but an example of the template in use is here. It appears to be a way of saying "Here is my opinion, but a second person should also review this so there at least two of us". Perhaps people at WP:Peer review could be asked to review the title. Johnuniq (talk) 01:35, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for the example! Some very random clicking around the archives didn't turn up more examples, and I don't see any mentions of the template or a two-person process in the instructions for peer review. isaacl (talk) 04:08, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- The broken what links here prevents any reasonable investigation, but an example of the template in use is here. It appears to be a way of saying "Here is my opinion, but a second person should also review this so there at least two of us". Perhaps people at WP:Peer review could be asked to review the title. Johnuniq (talk) 01:35, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- @WhatamIdoing: there seems to be <500 transclusions, shouldn't be a big deal. Certainly maintain a redirect. So if someone wants to change "tWOMANrule" to "tpersonrule" I can't see any technical problems that can't be overcome. ;) — xaosflux Talk 10:51, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- I admit that the delightful ambiguity in the name makes me hesitate, too.
;-)
WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:55, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- I admit that the delightful ambiguity in the name makes me hesitate, too.
- Personally, I would send it to TfD, to be merged/replaced with {{Reviewed}}. {{Twomanrule}} in its code has nothing to do with multiple reviewers and it's exactly as it looks.--Gonnym (talk) 10:58, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- I don't think that would be the right target. This is a request for a second opinion, not a statement that it's already been reviewed.. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:56, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- It really isn't. It's a template that prints the word "Review" with an icon. Whatever else you think it does, it doesn't. --Gonnym (talk) 16:47, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- I assume that the template was used that way somewhere once, in some process, but the documentation for the template is unrevealing. Just showing "Review" doesn't seem to be very helpful for that purpose, and no category is being added to help people find uses. If someone can figure out a way to algorithmically categorize the <500 uses, that would be helpful. isaacl (talk) 23:10, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- I don't think that would be the right target. This is a request for a second opinion, not a statement that it's already been reviewed.. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:56, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Are there any other processes where the two-person concept is in effect? –xenotalk 13:15, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Perhaps when a second opinion is requested at DYK or GA review? Not strictly analogous (and it has its own dedicated template), but pretty close. Sdrqaz (talk) 13:20, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Xeno: Sometimes in admin bot approval. The approving BAG (if a crat) often isn't the crat that flags. But it's not a strict rule afaik. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 13:52, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- One might hope that getting a second set of eyes on your changes would be standard practice by anyone changing sitewide CSS or scripts. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:57, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Xeno, Informally, when the copy patrol tool is working, and I identify an article which appears to be substantially all a copyright violation, I typically tag it and let somebody else do the actual deletion on the theory that it doesn't hurt to have at least two people looking when an article is about to be deleted. S Philbrick(Talk) 18:51, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
As for searching uses, wouldn't Special:search/insource:Twomanrule do the work? --CiaPan (talk) 13:35, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
Global contributions not working
Is this a known issue? See this example. Nick Moyes (talk) 14:23, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- It seems that the entire Toolforge is down (at least for me). Kleinpecan (talk) 14:26, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Known issue caused by performance work that either can't be fixed or simply was not. AIUI Xtools provides a similar view, so I think it was a time and not feasibility problem. Previously tracked at phab:T282557. Izno (talk) 15:02, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- It's been about a week, but you can use this in the mean time. Can't range search on this one though. YODADICAE👽 15:06, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Probably should have MA steal some code from Krinkle's tool heh. Izno (talk) 15:15, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- Task is phab:T279041. I would have implemented this years ago but meta:IP Editing: Privacy Enhancement and Abuse Mitigation put into question whether the effort was worthwhile. It seems the IP masking project is still a long, long ways from being done, so I'm going to use the extra time I have this week to hopefully get full IP range support in XTools. — MusikAnimal talk 18:48, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Praxidicae @Izno @Nick Moyes As I'm sure you've noticed, GUC is working again and faster than ever! But I wanted to let you know that I did get proper IP range support added to XTools. I could use a hand with testing, if anyone is interested. It's live now on the staging server, i.e. https://xtools-dev.wmflabs.org/globalcontribs/ipr-174.197.128.0/18. See also IP range support in the Edit Counter and everywhere else in XTools! Only the Pages Created tool is lacking support (for now). If you're wondering why the URL has the IP ranges prefixed with
ipr-
, it was a necessity due to how the routing system works (otherwise it could mistake the /18 as referring to namespace with ID 18). Hopefully that's not too confusing for users, because you can enter normal CIDR notation in the form at https://xtools-dev.wmflabs.org/globalcontribs and it will do the conversion for you. Here on the wiki, we have a separate interface message for IP ranges, so we can link to Global Contribs for IP ranges easily. Templates that link to XTools may require some special handling, though. — MusikAnimal talk 05:03, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Praxidicae @Izno @Nick Moyes As I'm sure you've noticed, GUC is working again and faster than ever! But I wanted to let you know that I did get proper IP range support added to XTools. I could use a hand with testing, if anyone is interested. It's live now on the staging server, i.e. https://xtools-dev.wmflabs.org/globalcontribs/ipr-174.197.128.0/18. See also IP range support in the Edit Counter and everywhere else in XTools! Only the Pages Created tool is lacking support (for now). If you're wondering why the URL has the IP ranges prefixed with
- Task is phab:T279041. I would have implemented this years ago but meta:IP Editing: Privacy Enhancement and Abuse Mitigation put into question whether the effort was worthwhile. It seems the IP masking project is still a long, long ways from being done, so I'm going to use the extra time I have this week to hopefully get full IP range support in XTools. — MusikAnimal talk 18:48, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- Probably should have MA steal some code from Krinkle's tool heh. Izno (talk) 15:15, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
- It's been about a week, but you can use this in the mean time. Can't range search on this one though. YODADICAE👽 15:06, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
Deleting searches
A reader wants to know how to delete old searches. My guess is that removal of cookies might do it but that's just a guess. Can anyone confirm whether my guess is correct or if not how it should be done?--S Philbrick(Talk) 17:11, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Old searches... where? Their browser bar? Yeah, sure, deleting their history/cache/cookies would do it. Izno (talk) 17:14, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Izno, Not the browser bar, the "search Wikipedia" box in the upper right. I confess that
heaven some kinI had no idea that my prior searches are saved until I just tried an example and noticed that some of my prior searches show up under some conditions. I think this is distinct from auto fill which tries to guess once you start typing something in. S Philbrick(Talk) 19:57, 15 May 2021 (UTC)- Probably should still be clearable by killing cookies etc. Those searches aren't cached on Wikimedia's side. Izno (talk) 20:14, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Izno, I'm not 100% sure what "a reader" is referring to, but I'm assuming they mean when you start typing a search into the wikipedia search box, it executes it on the fly, before you even hit return. If you're running Chrome, open up the Developer Tools window, click the Network tab, and select "XHR". Then start typing a search. You'll see it make a sequence of calls to https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=opensearch, with progressively longer prefixes of your search. If that's what we're talking about here, I'm not aware of any way to turn that off. -- RoySmith (talk) 21:14, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- It's not cookies. This is "form history", not to be confused with browsing history. Most browsers allow these to be cleared; perhaps together, perhaps independently. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 15:53, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- RoySmith, A reader means someone who is reading Wikipedia, as opposed to trying to edit. S Philbrick(Talk) 18:44, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sphilbrick, Yes, I understand this is a reader, but I'm still not sure what behavior it is that you're trying to describe, i.e. what it means to "delete old searches". Perhaps a screenshot would help. -- RoySmith (talk) 20:13, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- RoySmith, Screenshot provided S Philbrick(Talk) 21:47, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sphilbrick, Hmmm, I don't get that. I'm using MacOS and tried all of Chrome, Safari, and Firefox. I assume this is something browser and/or platform specific. -- RoySmith (talk) 22:28, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- RoySmith, I'm using Chrome in Windows. The list appears when I click a mouse in the box on the desktop, or touch the box on the laptop. The lists are different, reflecting that I have done different searches on the 2 devices. The entries disappear as soon as I type a character. S Philbrick(Talk) 22:51, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sphilbrick, Hmmm, I don't get that. I'm using MacOS and tried all of Chrome, Safari, and Firefox. I assume this is something browser and/or platform specific. -- RoySmith (talk) 22:28, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- RoySmith, Screenshot provided S Philbrick(Talk) 21:47, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sphilbrick, Yes, I understand this is a reader, but I'm still not sure what behavior it is that you're trying to describe, i.e. what it means to "delete old searches". Perhaps a screenshot would help. -- RoySmith (talk) 20:13, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Izno, I'm not 100% sure what "a reader" is referring to, but I'm assuming they mean when you start typing a search into the wikipedia search box, it executes it on the fly, before you even hit return. If you're running Chrome, open up the Developer Tools window, click the Network tab, and select "XHR". Then start typing a search. You'll see it make a sequence of calls to https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=opensearch, with progressively longer prefixes of your search. If that's what we're talking about here, I'm not aware of any way to turn that off. -- RoySmith (talk) 21:14, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Probably should still be clearable by killing cookies etc. Those searches aren't cached on Wikimedia's side. Izno (talk) 20:14, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Izno, Not the browser bar, the "search Wikipedia" box in the upper right. I confess that
User:Eizen/PageCreator and User:Eizen/LastEditor scripts
These two user scripts have stopped working and the author has not been active since 2017. They show the page creator and last editor in the upper-left side, I came to rely on it. Is there anything else like it? -- GreenC 18:15, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Eizen: -- GreenC 18:26, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Hey there; I changed my username from "Eizzen" to "Eizen" a few months ago, so I expect this may have wrecked a few script imports around here. If you adjust the import in your common.js file to reflect the username change (i.e. change
User:Eizzen/LastEditor.js
toUser:Eizen/LastEditor.js
), these scripts should work as intended. Cheers! Eizen (talk) 18:35, 15 May 2021 (UTC)- Oh, awesome, and easy.. thank you! I imagine a check of the backlinks and talk page notification would be appreciated by some users. -- GreenC 18:39, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Btw it's a technical issues, related phab task phab:T272297. ‐‐1997kB (talk) 05:43, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, awesome, and easy.. thank you! I imagine a check of the backlinks and talk page notification would be appreciated by some users. -- GreenC 18:39, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
- Hey there; I changed my username from "Eizzen" to "Eizen" a few months ago, so I expect this may have wrecked a few script imports around here. If you adjust the import in your common.js file to reflect the username change (i.e. change
Is it possible to fetch a parameter value from a template call?
Once I apply msgnw
to a template, is there a way to unbrace the template parameters so that I can fetch one of its parameters (much like {{getalias}} does to {{country data}} templates, but without having to reengineer the source template to accommodate the parameter call--which typically involves replacing the template name with {{{1|TemplateName}}}
in the template heading)? Say I want to fetch the inventors
parameter from {{Infobox Saxophone}}:
{{Infobox Instrument
|
— 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 10:28, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've seen two approaches to doing this. One of them is {{Template parameter value}} (
{{Template parameter value|Template:Infobox Saxophone|Infobox Instrument|1|inventors}}
produces Adolphe Sax, which works in this case but, per the warning in it's documentation boxis still buggy, and only works when pulling simple values, such as numbers and unformatted strings. Parameter values that include a pipe (e.g. values with links) cannot be pulled with [it]
}). Another approach, which I believe I invented a while back, is to use the wikitext parser, resulting in something like{{expand wikitext|{{replace|{{#invoke:Page|getContent|Template:Infobox Saxophone|as=raw}}|Infobox Instrument|pst1{{!}}inventors}}}}
(output: Adolphe Sax), which is a bit uglier and doesn't work if the page you're getting data from contains more than a template call and some<noinclude>
d values, but can handle piped links. I should probably get around to documenting that second approach and turning it into a proper template someday. * Pppery * it has begun... 16:37, 16 May 2021 (UTC) - Note that {{getalias}} does not use either of the above methods, but instead relies on the cooperation of the source template(s), which you said you don't want to do in this case. * Pppery * it has begun... 16:38, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- I see from context that you are intending to do this in Lua rather than Wikitext, in which case you can probably implement the pst1-based approach in a way that seems less ugly and isn't subject to the limitations of my example. I'd be happy to help you with than if the {{template parameter value}}-based approach doesn't work out for you. * Pppery * it has begun... 16:42, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, Pppery. This is what I wanted it for (in this instance). I ended up using your frst approach there, simply bc it was the first one I tried, and it seemed to work satisfactorily, so I left it at that. But you're right: ultimately, I want to produce this table with a module, so that it can be kept up-to-date with the most imported scripts, as a more comprehensive and less vetted alternative to WP:USL, using the Module:User script table row/data ingest the data. Any help is much welcome. Cheers. — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 12:33, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Does {{Get parameter}} implement your method, Pppery? — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 23:57, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes. I've made some minor tweaks to the documentation, but otherwise it looks good. * Pppery * it has begun... 00:32, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Here is a stress test of your method. It didn't do too well, at least for this purpose. It failed (or featured?) in not following redirects, and broke very early on, at the 35th call (whereas {{tmpv}} goes up to 494). — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 03:21, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Guarapiranga: What a very interesting corner case. You're misusing both {{get parameter}} and {{template parameter value}} in those examples because the pages don't transclude the template you are asking for data from and furthermore don't meet the requirement of only containing a call to the template and
<noinclude>...</noinclude>
d values for {{get parameter}}. In this specific corner case, {{template parameter value}} returns nothing since it can't find the template, and {{get parameter}} ends up using up a ton of post-expand include size and eventually returning the entire wikitext of the page. This isn't really a proper stress test, since neither template does anything useful (but it was very interesting as a parser debugging challenge ) * Pppery * it has begun... 04:18, 20 May 2021 (UTC){{template parameter value}} returns nothing since it can't find the template
- It does here. — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 04:59, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Valid point. I still think that {{template parameter value}} is better for what you are trying to do that {{get parameter}}, but it was worth experimenting with both anyway. * Pppery * it has begun... 13:11, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Guarapiranga: What a very interesting corner case. You're misusing both {{get parameter}} and {{template parameter value}} in those examples because the pages don't transclude the template you are asking for data from and furthermore don't meet the requirement of only containing a call to the template and
- Here is a stress test of your method. It didn't do too well, at least for this purpose. It failed (or featured?) in not following redirects, and broke very early on, at the 35th call (whereas {{tmpv}} goes up to 494). — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 03:21, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes. I've made some minor tweaks to the documentation, but otherwise it looks good. * Pppery * it has begun... 00:32, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I see from context that you are intending to do this in Lua rather than Wikitext, in which case you can probably implement the pst1-based approach in a way that seems less ugly and isn't subject to the limitations of my example. I'd be happy to help you with than if the {{template parameter value}}-based approach doesn't work out for you. * Pppery * it has begun... 16:42, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
Education program namespace removal
The education program namespace is an unused namespace since 2018 when it was made obsolete by the Programs & Events Dashboard. It was uninstalled for a few months before being reinstalled since there were around 1,500 talk pages that were made inaccesible by uninstalling the namespace. Recently there have been a bit of discussion on this matter at phabricator with it being mentioned at T217137 that the namespaces should be removed if there were no more pages in it. If we want to delete the namespace it should be as simple as moving all the pages to Wikipedia space (presumably as subpages of Wikipedia talk:Education program). The titleblacklist item would also have to be updated if this is done.
I think it would nice to get this over with and finally remove the namespace, but of course there has to be consensus for it. --Trialpears (talk) 20:38, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Notably, deleting pages is also a solution if the information is fairly useless (e.g. Education Program talk:Colgate University/TEST100 (Fall 2013)/Course description, Education Program talk:Bucknell University/Too Much Information (Fall 2014), Education Program talk:Texas State University/POSI 5336 (Fall 2013)/Grading). For example, not sure any of those pages are needed to improve or maintain the encyclopedia. — xaosflux Talk 20:48, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- (edit conflict) Some of them, such at Education Program talk:Abaarso School of Science and Technology/Contributing to the World's Knowledge: Editing Wikipedia (Computer Science 11th Grade) (2) have actual content, although I guess all of them technically qualify for G8 deletion, since their subject pages vanished into the ether (literally, not even admins can undelete them) when the extension was uninstalled. (The data is still available under https://dumps.wikimedia.org/other/educationprogram/, and https://gist.github.com/urbanecm/8a090da58429b121067bf491d1e9a510 exists to re-export it as wikitext, but it will need some tweaking for various software changes over the years). * Pppery * it has begun... 21:00, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- This seems eminently sensible. Archive anything that could be of value, delete the rest, remove the namespace. ƒirefly ( t · c ) 20:50, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Much in the namespace isn't good for anything but I would not like to filter that out. I think the easiest solution would be moving first and MfDs later if someone is so inclined. --Trialpears (talk) 21:34, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
- Many of these are CSD worthy - why bother moving the page if it is a CSD? Just delete it. — xaosflux Talk 18:46, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- In most cases it wouldn't but in this case it wouldn't be possible to undelete or view deleted history of these pages if they weren't moved first. Moving could be done automatically as well meaning that it in practice wouldn't be not much more effort at all. --Trialpears (talk) 19:54, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- Is it possible to find and correct links to these pages from other areas of Wikipedia if they are moved? Graeme Bartlett (talk) 06:03, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yep, it's easy to find and fix those, here's a list of links for all non-talk pages: list. --Trialpears (talk) 06:23, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Is it possible to find and correct links to these pages from other areas of Wikipedia if they are moved? Graeme Bartlett (talk) 06:03, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- In most cases it wouldn't but in this case it wouldn't be possible to undelete or view deleted history of these pages if they weren't moved first. Moving could be done automatically as well meaning that it in practice wouldn't be not much more effort at all. --Trialpears (talk) 19:54, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- Many of these are CSD worthy - why bother moving the page if it is a CSD? Just delete it. — xaosflux Talk 18:46, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
Ok, so it seems a lot of them are merely a greeting from the teacher, like [1]. I think those could likely be deleted as uncontroversial housekeeping.
But others have fairly significant discussion, such as at [2]].
Also, some refer to a specific article they are editing, and in particular list and discuss references which were added. I think that that info has a fair amount of value for editors to look back over such things.
Would it be possible for a bot to list all the talk pages that are not merely the initial instructor greetings, to make it easier to try to go through them to see what could be kept? - jc37 06:30, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Something like this lists pages with less than 2 timestamps (so no discussion, Sinebot should have dealt with missed sigs) and less than 1000 characters wikitext. I quickly checked a bunch and almost all of these 658 should be G6 able. There are probably a significant amount of others that are deletable but this is a good start. I still feel like they should be moved first though per the above. If I were an admin implementing this I would probably try using AWB to delete if I determine it's deletable and otherwise skip. I'm not familiar with exactly how AWB deletes work though. --Trialpears (talk) 13:43, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- If we have a very high probability that a sub-list doesn't need to be reviewed, we can just use something like twinkle p-delete to delete an entire list of pages. — xaosflux Talk 14:37, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've checked enough of that list to be comfortable with batch deleting it and this one with 87 very short pages. --Trialpears (talk) 14:50, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- For p-delete need a wikilinked list (like in a sandbox) , can't use search results. — xaosflux Talk 14:53, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- User:Trialpears/sandbox/1 --Trialpears (talk) 14:58, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- "Very short ones" have been nuked so far. — xaosflux Talk 15:31, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've added a list of support subpages. These just say supported by WikiEd (+ long cats hence not being caught in the last batch). It is a subset of the no discussion batch. --Trialpears (talk) 22:25, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- "Very short ones" have been nuked so far. — xaosflux Talk 15:31, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- User:Trialpears/sandbox/1 --Trialpears (talk) 14:58, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- For p-delete need a wikilinked list (like in a sandbox) , can't use search results. — xaosflux Talk 14:53, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've checked enough of that list to be comfortable with batch deleting it and this one with 87 very short pages. --Trialpears (talk) 14:50, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- If we have a very high probability that a sub-list doesn't need to be reviewed, we can just use something like twinkle p-delete to delete an entire list of pages. — xaosflux Talk 14:37, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
Why doesn't the search bar take you directly to an article?
Apologies if this isn't the right place to ask it.
For the longest time, typing an article's title and pressing enter would take you directly to the article. However, recently, I noticed that if I stay on a page for a long time on the desktop site (only on my iPad (iOS 10, Safari); I haven't noticed if it happens on the computer) and then search for an article, it would take me to the search results page instead. It only takes me directly to an article only if I search for it within a few minutes of landing on a page. Why is this? 49.144.205.30 (talk) 02:05, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
Tech News: 2021-20
13:47, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
Update default font stack in Vector for macOS?
The default font stack in Vector chooses a poor default font on macOS Safari, in my opinion. I first noticed this with italic text directly followed by non-italic text (this happens frequently when discussing ships and ship classes, where the ship name itself is made possessive or plural, such as "Enterprise's" or "the many Enterprisees").
The effect is also seen when using {{transl|...|transliterated text}}
with a non-Latin language code. The resulting text looks like it doesn't belong.
However, this problem is not seen in either the mobile Wikipedia app, nor when browsing Wikipedia in iOS Safari. On iOS, the Mac System Font (San Francisco) is used, whereas on macOS Safari, it's either "sans serif" (which is just Helvetica) or Helvetica directly.
How do I get the macOS font stack changed for Vector? — sbb (talk) 19:53, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
Resize and horizontal display of multiple images
My problem is multiple image resizing. Here is my test location: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Multiple_image/testcases Test #18a. I have read through the postings on multiple images and the examples. I have tried many iterations. However I am still puzzled on the correct code to make this work. #wikipedia-en-help suggested I contact you for guidance. Thank you. Scott H Mathews — Preceding unsigned comment added by MathewsSH (talk • contribs) 23:53, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
- @MathewsSH: how about something like this: Template:Multiple image/testcases#Test 18b? Yours didn't work because you were using thumb, when the multiple image template takes care of that for you properly. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 01:14, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Thank you so kindly @Finnusertop. You handily solved my problem.MathewsSH (talk) 21:45, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Blacklist issue
I am trying to publish an article but the system is preventing me from being able to do it as the title does contain a word that is on the blacklist (understandably so because it is a derogatory racial term but I am not using it as such because its the title of a 100 year old song). Is there an admin around whom I will be able to discuss the removal of this title from the list so the article could be created? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 09:40, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- The C of E, I've moved it to mainspace. The blacklist should only stop page creations and not edits for people without the titleblacklistoverride permisson but please confirm that you can edit the page. --Trialpears (talk) 09:52, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Trialpears: Yes I can thank you. Again, I don't approve of that title but it is a revealing snippet of American culture 100 years ago. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 09:55, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
Stray table end marker
Over the last week or so, I have come across a number of new or newish users (not normally the same person twice) adding a stray table end marker to the bottom of an article, such as here and here. Why is this happening, and how can we prevent it? --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 21:35, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Both of those edits were made with the Visual Editor, which has many old and unfixed bugs, and they both included changes to tables (which are much easier to edit in VE than in wikitext, admittedly). I suspect, albeit based on only two data points, that this is a VE bug of some sort. In this case, it is probably caused by the VE parser being unable to locate the unusually formed but valid end-of-table mark, the two characters of which are separated by an HTML comment. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:52, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
Highest numbee
What is the maximum value that can be mathematically computed through expr? I suppose 2^64. --217.213.122.26 (talk) 21:35, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Have you tried it?
expr
accepts floating point values: 3.0E+102 >> 2^64. --Izno (talk) 22:04, 18 May 2021 (UTC) - Even if only integers were allowed, the limit would not be 2^64, but would be either 2^63-1 or 2^127-1 depending upon word length. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:26, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Maybe 1.7976931348623157E+308. It's rounded to 1.7976931348623E+308 in output.
{{#expr:1.7976931348623156E+308=1.7976931348623157E+308}}
produces 0 (not equal).{{#expr:1.7976931348623157E+308=1.7976931348623158E+308}}
produces 1 (equal).{{#expr:1.7976931348623159E+308}}
produces INF (positive infinity).- PrimeHunter (talk) 00:17, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Issue with italic title and PAGENAME
I've encountered an issue that I'm hoping someone here can help with. On a page with an apostrophe in the disambiguation, such as Torpedo (Bob's Burgers), when I write the following: {{Italic title|string=
, it fails to italicize the title, but when I write {{Title disambig text|
|all=yes}}{{PAGENAME}}
}}{{Italic title|string=Bob's Burgers|all=yes}}
, it works ({{Italic dab}} does work but I can't use it). Any ideas? --Gonnym (talk) 22:52, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- It looks like this is an issue with similar titles that contain apostrophes, as evidenced by the population of Category:Pages using italic title with no matching string. I haven't figured out how to get the output of {{Italic title}} to see what is actually happening, but someone else here might know how to do that. – Jonesey95 (talk) 23:00, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
{{Title disambig text|{{PAGENAME}}}}
is actually returningBob's Burgers
instead ofBob's Burgers
, which both look the same in the browser, but are two very different strings. – BrandonXLF (talk) 23:18, 18 May 2021 (UTC)- @BrandonXLF: do you know if there is a template or a module function that knows to convert special characters? --Gonnym (talk) 23:20, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- Gonnym, it's the magic word {{PAGENAME}}. – BrandonXLF (talk) 23:21, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- I meant, after the return value is
Bob's Burgers
, pass that to a template which decodes it toBob's Burgers
. --Gonnym (talk) 23:26, 18 May 2021 (UTC)- My bad I completely misread that. There's none that I know of but it wouldn't be surprising if one existed. – BrandonXLF (talk) 23:28, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- There is mw:Help:Extension:ParserFunctions##titleparts.
{{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}}}
. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:44, 18 May 2021 (UTC)- I also found Module:DecodeEncode which did the trick (saw it before your post so will check yours now). --Gonnym (talk) 23:51, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- There is mw:Help:Extension:ParserFunctions##titleparts.
- My bad I completely misread that. There's none that I know of but it wouldn't be surprising if one existed. – BrandonXLF (talk) 23:28, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- I meant, after the return value is
- Gonnym, it's the magic word {{PAGENAME}}. – BrandonXLF (talk) 23:21, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
- @BrandonXLF: do you know if there is a template or a module function that knows to convert special characters? --Gonnym (talk) 23:20, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
Table content extending outside cells
I am running into an issue where table columns do not always automatically resize to fit their contents, so text or images cross the column dividing line into the next cell. This is occurring in Chrome but not Firefox for me. I reported a bug here (with example images) but was told my issue is invalid and related to fonts or extensions, but it happens even in incognito mode with extensions disabled. Has anyone else seen this issue? Reywas92Talk 00:08, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- When reporting a problem like this, it is always helpful to provide your operating system and the browser versions that you are working with. I just checked it with the latest Safari/Chrome/Firefox for Mac OS, and the columns look fine. – Jonesey95 (talk) 00:24, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
How to search-replace newlines in the source editor?
I see that \n
is not reserved for matching a newline, and that \n
matches n, and so on, but that .
does not match a newline either (contrary to what it says there), so is there really no way of matching newlines in the source editor (or am I doing it wrong)? — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 03:48, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- The MediaWiki page you link to is about CirrusSearch, which has nothing to do with editing. By "the source editor", do you mean the 2017 wikitext editor? Because I can match newlines with
the default editor'sWikiEditor's search/replace function just fine. Nardog (talk) 04:06, 19 May 2021 (UTC)- ... I have never been able to match newlines exactly, what hackery is this? Izno (talk) 04:10, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- I mean WikiEditor's. Advanced -> Search and replace -> Treat search string as a regular expression. Nardog (talk) 04:30, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Nardog, can you also insert newlines in the replacement? — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 05:09, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- No, but
$1
etc. are supported (source). Nardog (talk) 05:38, 19 May 2021 (UTC)- Right, my workaround is to capture an existing newline with
(\n)
and insert it with$1
or another number. I don't know a solution if there is no newline to capture. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:47, 19 May 2021 (UTC)- The solution is to have regex101 as your wikitext editor of choice (you would be suprised by how many edits I've done that way). --Trialpears (talk) 19:52, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Right, my workaround is to capture an existing newline with
- No, but
- I am aware it can do regex, I was not aware it could find \n. Izno (talk) 16:02, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Nardog, can you also insert newlines in the replacement? — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 05:09, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- I mean WikiEditor's. Advanced -> Search and replace -> Treat search string as a regular expression. Nardog (talk) 04:30, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
The MediaWiki page you link to is about CirrusSearch, which has nothing to do with editing.
- Right, I just assumed they'd be on the same (logic) page (which seems to be the case with the 2017 wikitext editor).
By "the source editor", do you mean the 2017 wikitext editor?
- Right, I have
Enable the editing toolbar (2010 wikitext editor)
checked on my preferences, but what I always see is the 2017 wikitext editor (which looks better, anyway). — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 06:27, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- ... I have never been able to match newlines exactly, what hackery is this? Izno (talk) 04:10, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- I use User:Joeytje50/JWB to find and replace newlines, though it's certainly more of a hassle than being able to do it in the editor. I also use the 2017 editor and much prefer that since it can autogenerate citations from links which 2010 can't – though I didn't realize it did recognize \n! Guarapiranga, you may also have to uncheck New wikitext mode in Beta features. Reywas92Talk 07:10, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
British Museum database links are outdated
I'm sorry if this should be in a different section, but I'm unsure where to put back-end bug reports (or what I'm guessing is a back-end bug report).
I was researching a board game for a project, specifically the Royal Game of Ur. The article's infobox contains a link to an object in the British Museum, specifically 1928,1009.378. The current link currently shows an error page that tells me that the website was updated recently and that I should either try to search for my item or replace www with research in the title, which didn't work. So I manually searched for the object, and I eventually found the new page.
However, when I went to edit it to fix the link, I found that it uses some special syntax to generate a link, I'm guessing server-side. This means that whatever generates the links is outdated. That is the item that needs to be fixed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TealWingGreen (talk • contribs) 21:23, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- Is it possible to map the new URL's to the old ones used in articles? The best place to ask about this is probably Wikipedia:Link rot/URL change requests. 192.76.8.73 (talk) 21:41, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- See Template talk:British-Museum-db for existing discussion on the issue. – Rummskartoffel (talk • contribs) 22:03, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
- I can think of no logical way to translate https://www.britishmuseum.org/collection/search?museum_number=120840 into https://www.britishmuseum.org/collection/object/W_1928-1009-385 — I could not find any clues on the BM website. There are only 41 uses of the template, so I guess that is a fairly quick manual task — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 22:27, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Has anyone attempted making Module:Chart and Module:Graph receive data from wikitables instead of as declared parameters?
This would be a real game changer, as charts would be automatically updated when tables received new data. Here is my first crack at it. The module can be called with a pagename (if not its own), a table id (if not the 1st one), and the columns for labels and values (if not the 1st and 2nd, respectively). It will certainly break if the table is oddly shaped or malformed, but that's minimised by ignoring header rows (as that's where merged cells typically are). The module can then be loaded into Graph and Chart modules with mw.loadData. — 𝐆𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐩𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 (talk) 02:56, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Font sizes all over the place
Anyone else seeing bizarre changes in how Wikipedia displays (since this morning, when all was fine)? Everything that should be small is huge (short descriptions, page data, tab labels, text in edit window etc), while article text is minute, and references even smaller. Vector skin, before you ask. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 19:22, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes. Something has changed very recently. In particular, categories at the bottom are now larger, and every article has a subheading (or by-line?) "From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" in an incongruous font. Certes (talk) 19:30, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Is this a glitch or something? I noticed that the font size became smaller. Can they fix this? Nearly but not perfect (talk) 19:41, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Same issue. Even the watchlist and contribution font sizes are smaller. Mkdw talk 19:42, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Looks like it's Thursday, and already reported at T283281. --rchard2scout (talk) 19:56, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Johan (WMF), you wrote here that a new version of MediaWiki would be on all Wikipedias from 20 May. Can you kindly tell us who gave you that information, and perhaps ask them to respond here? Wikipedia has been rendered virtually unusable without a powerful magnifying glass; if it's as a result of that version change let's hope whoever did it knows where to find the Undo button. Many thanks, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 20:05, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Same for me. I initially thought it was browser's zoom level, but it's 100% in my Firefox. I hope it will be fixed soon. Brandmeistertalk 20:43, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Justlettersandnumbers, there's a new version of MediaWiki here almost every WP:THURSDAY. That was just a routine announcement. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 22:36, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, I'm happy yo help, but I don't have any special insight into most minor changes (that can still cause big problems). I see it's been triaged in the linked Phabricator ticket now.
- (One can see the deployment calendar at wikitech:Deployments if one wants to.) /Johan (WMF) (talk) 08:38, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Justlettersandnumbers, there's a new version of MediaWiki here almost every WP:THURSDAY. That was just a routine announcement. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 22:36, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Same for me. I initially thought it was browser's zoom level, but it's 100% in my Firefox. I hope it will be fixed soon. Brandmeistertalk 20:43, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Johan (WMF), you wrote here that a new version of MediaWiki would be on all Wikipedias from 20 May. Can you kindly tell us who gave you that information, and perhaps ask them to respond here? Wikipedia has been rendered virtually unusable without a powerful magnifying glass; if it's as a result of that version change let's hope whoever did it knows where to find the Undo button. Many thanks, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 20:05, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Looks like it's Thursday, and already reported at T283281. --rchard2scout (talk) 19:56, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Noticed it right away myself when I logged in this afternoon. I wondered if this were some update that had been in work for some time, but from the looks of things it's at least a bug or it's a new feature rollout that hasn't gone quite right. And yes, I checked my Firefox's zoom level too; it's not uncommon for me to accidentally tweak it, being that I work on a laptop. Zeke, the Mad Horrorist (Speak quickly) (Follow my trail) 20:59, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yeah, something happened a few hours ago - the font size shrank considerably. Note that case/ticket #T283281 has been closed as a duplicate of T283206, so I updated the number in the Phabricator template. PKT(alk) 22:35, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Folks with font-size problems: Are you running Edokter's old MediaWiki:Gadget-VectorClassic.css in Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets? Do you all have the same web browser or OS? Do you have this problem in a private/incognito window? Have you tried mw:safemode? It all looks normal for me (Legacy Vector in Safari+Chrome+Firefox on macOS). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 22:44, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Hello Whatamidoing - to be honest, your questions are very technical to me. What I can tell you is that, in my case, it's on two different PC's - my work machine and my personal one, and I use Chrome on both. I changed nothing ('cuz I don't understand skins and that sort of thing). Oh - and font sizes on other tabs and sites have not changed. PKT(alk) 22:51, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, @PKT. That's useful information. Another thing to check: Do you have "Use Legacy Vector" checked or unchecked under Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-rendering? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:08, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Whatamidoing (WMF): Use Legacy Vector is..........checked. PKT(alk) 21:18, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, @PKT. That's useful information. Another thing to check: Do you have "Use Legacy Vector" checked or unchecked under Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-rendering? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:08, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- I see the same in a private window, even when logged out: large font for categories and the "From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" line. For me it's perfectly usable, just odd. I use Firefox 88.0 (86.0 also tested) on the slightly outdated Ubuntu 16.04. I don't have "Vector classic typography" selected: is that the same thing as Edokter's gadget? Safemode brings a different set of oddities: the top-right panel (infobox, or Wiktionary box on a dab) appears badly formatted top left instead of the "From Wikipedia..." line. Certes (talk) 23:01, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Hello Whatamidoing - to be honest, your questions are very technical to me. What I can tell you is that, in my case, it's on two different PC's - my work machine and my personal one, and I use Chrome on both. I changed nothing ('cuz I don't understand skins and that sort of thing). Oh - and font sizes on other tabs and sites have not changed. PKT(alk) 22:51, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Folks with font-size problems: Are you running Edokter's old MediaWiki:Gadget-VectorClassic.css in Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets? Do you all have the same web browser or OS? Do you have this problem in a private/incognito window? Have you tried mw:safemode? It all looks normal for me (Legacy Vector in Safari+Chrome+Firefox on macOS). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 22:44, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Nice, the choice between ugly fonts or extremely small fonts. Problem is indeed (in human language, not the .css references above) in Preferences, tab "Gadgets", section "Appearance", checkbox "Vector classic typography (use only sans-serif in Vector skin)". If this is checked, the font is since yesterday evening extremely small. If this is unchecked, you get the ugly title font and space-consuming body layout. I have made screenshots of three versions; how it looked like if you had the chackbox marked, until yesterday (good!), and the two poor choices you get now (either way too small, or a lot less on a screen than it used to be). So please, revert this change! Fram (talk) 07:17, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, Fram. Took me a while to find that – for others: it's in the Appearance section of the Gadgets tab, not in the Appearance tab. Now everything is ridiculously over-sized. WMF, please restore the status quo ante. As K/Tommy Lee Jones says in MIB 2, "This one is an example of 'go home and do it again'." Thanks, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 09:11, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, thanks! I have edited my previous post to add the tab page you need to look at, without it this was indeed confusing. Fram (talk) 09:19, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- This is apparently not the only thing messed up by the recent change. After "User contributions" (on, um, User contribution pages) there's now additional text that reads " for [Username]", the same information that's already present in the next line down, which starts "For [Username]" and gives various links. What's the point of duplicating that information? Especially when in the new over-sized font it makes the page heading absurdly long for long usernames. Yesterday I happened to be looking at Special:Contributions/2A02:C7E:120F:700:74BA:8414:ACF7:73B4, and stupidly reloaded the page. Now the page header is 1720 pixels wide and 66 pixels high. I have a small but fairly high-resolution screen; the text "User contributions for 2A02:C7E:120F:700:74BA:8414:ACF7:73B4" stretches more than two-thirds of the way across it. It looks roughly (not precisely) like this:
- User contributions for 2A02:C7E:120F:700:74BA:8414:ACF7:73B4
- except a little taller. What possible benefits does that bring, may I ask? Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 17:51, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- This is apparently not the only thing messed up by the recent change. After "User contributions" (on, um, User contribution pages) there's now additional text that reads " for [Username]", the same information that's already present in the next line down, which starts "For [Username]" and gives various links. What's the point of duplicating that information? Especially when in the new over-sized font it makes the page heading absurdly long for long usernames. Yesterday I happened to be looking at Special:Contributions/2A02:C7E:120F:700:74BA:8414:ACF7:73B4, and stupidly reloaded the page. Now the page header is 1720 pixels wide and 66 pixels high. I have a small but fairly high-resolution screen; the text "User contributions for 2A02:C7E:120F:700:74BA:8414:ACF7:73B4" stretches more than two-thirds of the way across it. It looks roughly (not precisely) like this:
- Oh, thanks! I have edited my previous post to add the tab page you need to look at, without it this was indeed confusing. Fram (talk) 09:19, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Large font for categories in articles
Starting today, the text in the box of categories at the end of articles seems to be a larger font. I'm using Vector skin, and that text is now larger than the article prose or the toolbox and other WP interface text. Who did what this Thursday? DMacks (talk) 23:15, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @DMacks See the section above, #Font sizes all over the place. the wub "?!" 23:27, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
XTools ArticleInfo
The X-Tools Article Info gadget is suddenly appearing very large, and I have no idea why. Chicdat (talk) 10:07, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Possibly related to the problem above: Font_sizes_all_over_the_place. — Jts1882 | talk 10:30, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Jts1882: How can this be fixed? 🐔 Chicdat Bawk to me! 11:02, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Looks like it is a Wikimedia thing. If I understand the above and the phab comments correctly the problem has been found but needs to be deployed with the next Wikimedia software update, but there is a temporary fix that the site admins can apply. Nothing you or I can do. — Jts1882 | talk 11:52, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Jts1882: How can this be fixed? 🐔 Chicdat Bawk to me! 11:02, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Doubly applied margin
In the past day or so it appears that a margin is being applied twice to all of the articles I read, making them very narrow. The issue doesn't appear in safe mode, and appears to be a result of "removal of the "mw-body-content" class from the "bodyContent" block and its addition to the "mw-content-text" block instead" mentioned by Paul_012 above (manually changing some classes around fixes it). Has anyone else had this issue, or any suggestions other than looking through all of my scripts? LittlePuppers (talk) 13:20, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- If you use the Vector skin, see if you have "Use Legacy Vector" checked under Preferences → Appearance. The beta version of Vector currently causes very wide margins if you have a wide screen. – Rummskartoffel (talk • contribs) 13:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Rummskartoffel, I am using the legacy vector skin - the issue is even worse using the new version. LittlePuppers (talk) 22:46, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Coordinates in title dropped down
On two computers and multiple browsers, I'm suddenly seeing the title coordinates display much lower down than before. They nearly overlap infoboxes and the top line of text. Abductive (reasoning) 19:27, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yeah, this happened on new Vector a week ago, phab:T281974. Of course no one thought to look for it being a problem old Vector. :^) Izno (talk) 19:58, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've seen this everywhere as well, you're not alone. I thought it was me. Buffaboy talk 21:40, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- This (and the above font-size problem) appears to be a direct result of the removal of the "mw-body-content" class from the "bodyContent" block and its addition to the "mw-content-text" block instead. Is this a MediaWiki issue or should a "fix" be applied (at least temporarily) to the local CSS? --Paul_012 (talk) 04:25, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- So, a minor update:
- The issue impacting old Vector is indeed phab:T283206, the same as the above. I'm going to punt on updating anything regarding live coordinates since it looks like they are going to try to fix this soonly.
- The issue impacting new Vector is the phab task I posted in this section.
- It looks like this can indeed be fixed in new Vector also and safely relative to old Vector, I'll just need to learn how relative/absolute styling works.
- --Izno (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Sandbox oddness
Does anyone else see vertical scribble when looking at the histories of Wikipedia:Sandbox and Wikipedia talk:Sandbox? My guess is some sort of transclusion vandalism?-- Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 19:31, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Also here, who is likely the culprit.-- Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 19:33, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Favonian:, who may have an inkling.-- Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 19:36, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I see a slightly wider line for edit 1024206110 at 18:55 UTC today [huge addition; viewing it may mess up your browser]. The edit and its summary contain diacritic modifiers which don't fit on the line. Certes (talk) 19:36, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, this one I see. I suspect something in DefenderPlate sig is causing this. Don't know how to fix it without DefenderPlate's cooperation. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 19:38, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sorry, I said "sig", but "edit summary" is more what I meant. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 19:40, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- The contributor has been indef blocked. The edit and summary don't seem offensive but if they cause technical problems then we could request revdel per CRD 3 (browser-crashing or malicious HTML). Certes (talk) 19:44, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, my idea, too. Didn't know whether "just annoying" qualified for revdels. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 19:46, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I've revdeleted the edit summaries added by DefenderPlate, which did the trick. Thanks everyone!-- Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 19:50, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, my idea, too. Didn't know whether "just annoying" qualified for revdels. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 19:46, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- The contributor has been indef blocked. The edit and summary don't seem offensive but if they cause technical problems then we could request revdel per CRD 3 (browser-crashing or malicious HTML). Certes (talk) 19:44, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- For anyone interested, I think it might have something that is related to the explanation underneath this generator. Pahunkat (talk) 20:39, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I noticed today the vertical scribble on recent changes when using one of my saved criteria filter settings. This persisted even after I deleted the saved filter and manually tried to reset it. Funny this only happened for one setting and for only about 30 minutes and then it went away. Happened approximately the same time I noticed the category fonts size change reported above. Not sure when I first noticed the title coords misplacement. While the vertical scribble is gone, the category font and coords problem still currently persist. Using Chrome on MacOS. --DB1729 (talk) 04:38, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- This is similar to Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)/Archive 189#Strange summary. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 08:55, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Infobox civil conflict and 2021 storming of the United States Capitol
Template:Infobox civil conflict on 2021 storming of the United States Capitol complains:
- Warning: Page using Template:Infobox civil conflict with unknown parameter "timezone"
- (this message is shown only in preview).
- Warning: Page using Template:Infobox civil conflict with unknown parameter "time-end"
- (this message is shown only in preview).
- Warning: Page using Template:Infobox civil conflict with unknown parameter "time-begin"
- (this message is shown only in preview).
No testcases use "timezone". "time-end", or "time-begin". Is Template:Infobox civil conflict broken?
- .... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 20:00, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Just remove (or convert, if appropriate) the parameters from the template invocation on the specific page. Izno (talk) 20:07, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Freenode IRC servers 'takeover'
Background
- https://www.kline.sh/
- https://www.vice.com/en/article/m7ev8y/freenode-open-source-korea-crown-prince-takeover
- https://boingboing.net/2021/05/19/freenode-irc-staff-quit-after-new-owner-seizes-control.html
Traditionally, WMF projects and volunteers coordinated on Freenode IRC servers. Should we migrate (or aim to migrate) these projects to Libera Chat instead? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:13, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Discussion
The question here is to address what we should general aim to try to do. I'm well aware each project is independent and can setup IRC channels wherever they want. However, we could decide that we encourage specific servers and discourage others, and try to migrate the 'official' Wikipedia/Wikimedia IRC channels to Libera instead of Freenode. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:17, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- I don't see that this needs an RFC? Wikimedia group contacts have already announced they will migrate to Libera on meta. Izno (talk) 20:22, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- This affects a lot more than what the WMF does. For example, there's #wikipedia-bag, #wikipedia-en-afc in templates like {{AfC welcome}} (including substed version of it), etc. etc. etc. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:41, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- So, why would we go somewhere else? Who has the knowledge in the community for that? Who wants to volunteer for that? Izno (talk) 20:46, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- See the above articles. As for who has the knowledge, there's busloads of technical users here that can help with this. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:48, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Ok, let me spell it out then: A) We don't need an RFC. An RFC is a waste of the community's time on the point. B) Plain common sense is "go where WMF says they're taking the main channels". Izno (talk) 20:53, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Also see here. -- RoySmith (talk) 21:04, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Ok, let me spell it out then: A) We don't need an RFC. An RFC is a waste of the community's time on the point. B) Plain common sense is "go where WMF says they're taking the main channels". Izno (talk) 20:53, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- See the above articles. As for who has the knowledge, there's busloads of technical users here that can help with this. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:48, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- If I understand correctly, the channels were set up by the individual channel operators? So I suggest they can come up with a proposed plan and publicize it. I imagine most people will be fine with that, but in the event anyone objects, it can be discussed further. (Just as at meta, there may be interest in other chat tools, but that shouldn't stop any transition plan under these specific circumstances.) isaacl (talk) 21:06, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- So, why would we go somewhere else? Who has the knowledge in the community for that? Who wants to volunteer for that? Izno (talk) 20:46, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- This affects a lot more than what the WMF does. For example, there's #wikipedia-bag, #wikipedia-en-afc in templates like {{AfC welcome}} (including substed version of it), etc. etc. etc. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:41, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Wikimedia is migrating to Libera Chat, that was announced by the IRC Group Contacts already. See IRC/Migrating to Libera Chat for some of the technical details, it'll of course take time to update documentation, links etc. Legoktm (talk) 21:43, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- RfC tag removed per discussion above; if this is about notifying as many users as possible rather than inviting feedback, the Signpost and WP:AN are probably better places for a notification. There is one at Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard#IRC_security,_Oversight_notice. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 22:49, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- @ToBeFree: You didn't remove it, you commented it out. There is a difference. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 19:25, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- ...and I had even looked at that section. Thanks for removing it. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 19:27, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @ToBeFree: You didn't remove it, you commented it out. There is a difference. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 19:25, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Can a redirect-anchor be nested to a particular line or cell in a table? help...
The deceased cyclist Niels De Vriendt has a redirect page: here
which contains the following code:
#REDIRECT [[List of racing cyclists and pacemakers with a cycling-related death]] so it redirects to the entire List, not to De Vriendt's entry in a table at that List. So, it should redirect to Vriendt's entry at List of racing cyclists and pacemakers with a cycling-related death with code that looks maybe something like this:
#REDIRECT [[List of racing cyclists and pacemakers with a cycling-related death#Cyclists who died during a race or because of an accident that happened during a race|id="Table row 123"]]
however, I have been testing and testing various permutations in one of my sandboxes and cannot get anything to work. I have been poring over Help:Table#Section_link_or_map_link_to_a_row_anchor and Template:Anchor#Use_in_tables with no success. Please, O Wiki-Coding Experts & Wise Ones, post the solution here so I can learn how to fix it myself for now and for future use. Thanks, Shearonink (talk) 20:33, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- No comment on the idea's merits, nor help in the implementation, but
|id="Table row 123"
doesn't seem too robust to me. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 20:50, 20 May 2021 (UTC) - If you add an ID for them to target, just target that instead?
#REDIRECT [[List of racing cyclists and pacemakers with a cycling-related death#NAME]]
. Izno (talk) 20:51, 20 May 2021 (UTC)- Like this — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 21:04, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for your reply & help but I'd like to point out that I did ask for examples here and also request for folks to let me do the coding/fixing. Yeah, I get that it is easier & quicker for experienced Wiki-code people to just go ahead and fix issues but when that happens it doesn't let Un-techies like me learn. All the coding's been done and there are no steps now for me to go through. I wasn't really asking for someone to do it for me, I was asking to be taught here how to do it myself. Shearonink (talk) 21:33, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sorry. I have undone it. Pretend you never saw it. The salient point is that the anchor name and the fragment text must match — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 21:47, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks. Sorry if I came off somewhat curmudgeonly, I can edit text like a whizbang but Wikicode is basically a different language and often a source of frustration to me. What I do know I have had to hammer into my head, usually by first lifting examples from elsewhere and then filling various parameters in with the new information. Am grateful that anyone responded. Been here for over ten years and am still learning my way around. Cheers, Shearonink (talk) 02:48, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- In a link (whether it be a wikilink or a full URL) containing a hash sign
#
, the part after the hash is known as the fragment. All links, including those in a redirect, may have a fragment. - All HTML elements (without exception) may be given an
id=
attribute which must be quoted if it contains spaces, and in certain other circumstances. This attribute is the same as an anchor. For tables, you can put one id into: the start of the table; the caption; any row; any cell within a row. See my comments in Template talk:Anchor#Multiple anchors in |- table element don't work particularly the example table there. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 09:04, 21 May 2021 (UTC)- Redrose64 Thank you for your reply-post. I did read through that Template talk thread & almost understand it (even though I think my brain kind of hurts from the effort lol) but I guess what I need to know is if the present status of the redirect + the anchor is Wiki-OK. Thanks, Shearonink (talk) 16:16, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Shearonink: I moved the anchor to the start of the row. This is both for semantics and for accessibility reasons. Semantics: what does the anchor apply to - the whole row, or just one cell in that row? Accessibility: if a screen reader user were to follow the link, the text read out to them should begin with the name of the cyclist, not the cause of death - the earlier cells on the row will not be read out. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 17:53, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Redrose64 Ah, ok, yes that makes sense. I'm always concerned about putting bits of code in the wrong place and breaking things around here so wasn't sure. Thank you for writing that all out. Now I will know how to basically proceed in any similar/future situations. Thanks also to GhostInTheMachine, everyone's expertise & explanations here have been very helpful. Shearonink (talk) 19:56, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- @Shearonink: I moved the anchor to the start of the row. This is both for semantics and for accessibility reasons. Semantics: what does the anchor apply to - the whole row, or just one cell in that row? Accessibility: if a screen reader user were to follow the link, the text read out to them should begin with the name of the cyclist, not the cause of death - the earlier cells on the row will not be read out. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 17:53, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Redrose64 Thank you for your reply-post. I did read through that Template talk thread & almost understand it (even though I think my brain kind of hurts from the effort lol) but I guess what I need to know is if the present status of the redirect + the anchor is Wiki-OK. Thanks, Shearonink (talk) 16:16, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- In a link (whether it be a wikilink or a full URL) containing a hash sign
- Thanks. Sorry if I came off somewhat curmudgeonly, I can edit text like a whizbang but Wikicode is basically a different language and often a source of frustration to me. What I do know I have had to hammer into my head, usually by first lifting examples from elsewhere and then filling various parameters in with the new information. Am grateful that anyone responded. Been here for over ten years and am still learning my way around. Cheers, Shearonink (talk) 02:48, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Sorry. I have undone it. Pretend you never saw it. The salient point is that the anchor name and the fragment text must match — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 21:47, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for your reply & help but I'd like to point out that I did ask for examples here and also request for folks to let me do the coding/fixing. Yeah, I get that it is easier & quicker for experienced Wiki-code people to just go ahead and fix issues but when that happens it doesn't let Un-techies like me learn. All the coding's been done and there are no steps now for me to go through. I wasn't really asking for someone to do it for me, I was asking to be taught here how to do it myself. Shearonink (talk) 21:33, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
- Like this — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 21:04, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Make long-links cause side-scrolling not wide margin
If a page has a string of text that cannot be broken and is wider than the display pane, if overflows to the right, creating a large margin (widening the page). Is there a way to retain the page-width and instead have the overflow lead to a side-to-side scrollbar? Common trigger for me is a string consisting of a URL, or a wikilink that uses underscores instead of spaces. Common place it makes a mess is when using regular view (not mobile) on a mobile device (because I need the fuller interface) in . This isn't a new bug, but User:Athaenara's recent ANI edit reminded me to finally post about it. DMacks (talk) 06:02, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- Don't use bare URLs - use the
[https://example.com/ Example]
syntax as a minimum. There should never be a need to use underscores instead of spaces for wikilinks. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 09:07, 21 May 2021 (UTC) - Just adding this diff because it never hurts to have one. – Athaenara ✉ 09:14, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- This is in the realm of 'possible' but it's not pretty, has knock on effects for different resolutions (and sooner/later responsive Vector), and fundamentally is less accessible. Generally better just to fix the offending not-wrapping thing. I try to fix it when I see it. Izno (talk) 14:25, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
style="word-wrap: break-word;"
can break a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong string without adding hyphens. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:06, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
- You can also wrap a
{{force wrap}}
template around the veeeeeeerylooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooongString. This outputs span tags withstyle="overflow-wrap: break-word;"
to make the text wrap — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 22:34, 21 May 2021 (UTC)