- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. ✗plicit 23:34, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
Essência
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Another non-notable entry by an editor known for their controversial take on WP:N. Here, WP:NOTGUIDE again. A "star" in a travel guide plus promotional entries in local press are insufficient for the relatively high bar of WP:NCOMPANY. — kashmīrī TALK 18:21, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Food and drink and Hungary. — kashmīrī TALK 18:21, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- Delete: Source examination below:
- 1. The Budapest Business Journal article contains no in-depth coverage at all, focusing instead on minor trivialities:
Gwendal Poullennec, the Michelin Guide's international director, said both restaurants are "marvelous examples of Budapest's dynamic restaurant sphere" that "offer outstanding courses while paying tribute to Hungarian culinary traditions".
The guide calls Essencia, run by Portuguese chef Tiago Sabarigo and his Hungarian wife Éva, "a bright, warmly run and deliciously different restaurant".
It praises Salt, the brainchild of chef Szilárd Tóth, for its "intricate, exquisitely constructed dishes".
The Hungarian capital is now home to seven Michelin-starred restaurants. The others are Babel, Borkonyha Winekitchen, Costes, Costes Downtown and Stand.
The latest edition of the Michelin Guide has added six "Michelin Plate" restaurants - a designation for establishments that have neither a star nor a Bib Gourmand - in Budapest, bringing the total to 18. They include Hoppá! Bistro, Felix, Stand25 Bisztro, Spago by Wolfgang Puck, Rumour and Pasztell.
- 2. The Chef & Pincer article is entirely an interview, making it non-independent & very primary.
- 3. The Hungary Today article is a list of many restaurants and lacks in-depth coverage. It's also very short:
Also in Budapest is Essência, run by a Portuguese chef living in Hungary, Tiago Sabarigo and his wife, Éva Sabarigo. The menus available here, titled At Home Here, and at Home There, refer to the mixed-ethnicity couple, with ingredients including octopus, mackerel, cod for the Portuguese menu, and traditional potato dumplings (dödölle), a traditional brown meat sauce (vadas), and Hungarian honey cake for the Hungarian one. The five-course menu is also priced at 34,900 forints (EUR 85), wine pairing is also available, bringing the price to 52,900 forints (EUR 130), and guests should expect to pay a 15 percent service charge as well.
- 4. The Travel Guys article is negative in coverage and also focuses on minor trivialities, lacking any information on the actual restaurant, its history, its cultural impact, or any other meaningful aspect; the review instead analyzes someone's dislike of the food served:
As part of a family lunch in Budapest, my wife and I chose a starred restaurant in the city, Essencia, located near the basilica and its very nice Christmas market.
A look back at this disappointing experience. As a reminder, here is the itinerary followed:
The recently starred restaurant is based on a Hungarian-Portuguese fusion. Interesting on paper.
The decoration of the restaurant is very pleasant. Totally up to date, it is composed of light wood furniture, and Portuguese reminders distributed in the restaurant like a beautiful wall of azulejos.
Having visited the restaurant at lunchtime, the property offers a lunch menu, with a choice of 2 or 3 courses.
We will opt for the 3 courses formula for a little more than 17€ (yes, in a starred restaurant…) but with many supplements for some dishes.
As a starter, I choose the Mangalicsa ham, a very high quality pork, served with a toast of sourdough bread and black olives. Good, but very far from the level expected from a Michelin-starred property.
For the main course, I choose the sea food rice, which is quite good but rather nauseating. Flavors that don’t play well together.
For dessert, I chose a lemon tart, which was certainly good, but not particularly dazzling.
The service is very good and attentive.
The restaurant was almost deserted when we visited, but we had a good time with our family.
A beautiful place, but a very disappointing culinary experience. Not at all worthy of a Michelin star.
- 5. This YouTube source from Michelin Guide's channel isn't reliable and is an interview.
- I will note that earning a Michelin Star doesn't automatically make a restaurant notable. I will also note that even if a source contains large amounts of text pertaining to the subject, it can only prove notability if it's reliable, independent, and contains significant amounts of in-depth coverage. Notability needs to be demonstrated through the existence of reliable sources that are independent of the subject, and that significantly cover the subject per WP:CORPDEPTH; if the information in a source is very trivial, it can't prove the subject is notable (see also WP:SIRS). —Nythar (💬-🍀) 19:07, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- Keep: additional sources from Daily News Hungary and Hungarian Insider, which are both national publications. Some others (e.g. this BBJ article don't have much coverage, but might still be WP:SIGCOV (which only needs to be "more than a trivial mention"). I think we've got enough for WP:NCORP here: there's room to quibble some of the sources for one reason or another, but in my view, however you slice it, we've got multiple, independent, reliable (enough) sources giving WP:SIGCOV of the subject. I'd suggest that there probably should be some Michelin-star based notability guideline: perhaps not simply having one, but we have similar guidelines for people who receive honours recognising them as at the top of their field. UndercoverClassicist (talk) 19:52, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- Daily News Hungary looks awfully unreliable. It's not just about the comments under the article – editorial oversight was poor – but their entire staff numbers eight journalists[1] who, as can be seen on clicking their names, typically churn out 6–8 articles a day on any topic imaginable. It's as far from quality journalism as it gets.
- Hungarian Insider is dodgy. It's unrelated to Business Insider, even as it steals its logo style and layout. It offers no list of editorial staff, no address, articles don't mention author names etc.[2] The domain is registered in New Zealand and owner's identity is hidden.[3] The website looks dead anyway – the most recent news piece on its homepage dates to November 2022 and most are from 2019, the year the website was started. I have no time to verify whether it carried original reporting or – much more likely – simply reposted news from elsewhere after translating them into English. In any case, having anything mentioned on www.hungarianinsider.com does not confer an encyclopaedic notability in the slightest. — kashmīrī TALK 20:13, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- The Daily News Hungary source lacks significant coverage. This is its entire coverage of Essencia:
Of the two restaurants in Budapest, Essência Restaurant (EUR 25 for a meal per person) got into the top 10, so it was given two paragraphs by Chef’s Pencil. They highlighted that it is run by a Portuguese-Hungarian duo, Tiago and Éva Sabarigo, and guests can enjoy the essence of both cuisines, as Portuguese and Hungarian flavours blend effortlessly in their dishes.
- The Hungarian Insider article also lacks SIGCOV, containing only trivial coverage:
Essência is run by the Portuguese-Hungarian duo Tiago and Éva Sabarigo, according to Chef’s Pencil. Guests can enjoy the best of Hungarian and Portuguese cuisine by choosing the “fusion” tasting menu, which effortlessly combines the two cultures. The cheapest three-course lunch menu starts from EUR 25 per person. You can also choose from a wide selection of Portuguese and Hungarian wines.
- The problem with these sources is that they fail WP:CORPDEPTH. We can't just look for sources and automatically consider them to be SIGCOV.
"The depth of coverage of the subject by the source must be considered. Trivial ... coverage of a subject is not sufficient to establish notability. Deep or significant coverage provides an overview, description, commentary, survey, study, discussion, analysis, or evaluation of the product, company, or organization."
No information provided by any of these sources is actually in-depth and detailed. If they were, they'd perhaps analyze the restaurant's operational history, its ownership history, its cultural impact, etc; they focus instead on minor trivialities like food prices and taste, while other sources are routine in coverage. In addition, to determine notability according to SIRS,"individual sources must be evaluated separately and independently of each other."
Any one of these sources analyzed on its own fails SIGCOV. Nythar (💬-🍀) 20:18, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
- Delete as per Nythar's source assessment. Fails GNG. LibStar (talk) 13:30, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
- Delete per Nythar's source assessment. The person who loves reading (talk) 03:03, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.