My very best wishes (talk | contribs) |
EdJohnston (talk | contribs) →Sahrin: Closure box. Warning and reminder to User:Sahrin |
||
(One intermediate revision by the same user not shown) | |||
Line 215: | Line 215: | ||
== Sahrin== |
== Sahrin== |
||
{{hat|1=[[User:Sahrin]] is warned for personal attacks and reminded that edits about gun control are expected to be neutral. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 20:41, 7 September 2016 (UTC) }} |
|||
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br>Requests may not exceed 500 [[Word count#Software|words]] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small> |
|||
===Request concerning Sahrin=== |
===Request concerning Sahrin=== |
||
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|Jytdog}} 05:10, 2 September 2016 (UTC) |
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|Jytdog}} 05:10, 2 September 2016 (UTC) |
||
Line 321: | Line 320: | ||
{{quotebox|Yeah, this is what I'm talking about. Continued harassment doesn't change the integrity of the process, nor does it change the facts of this issue. I'm not sure why you think threatening me is going to help settle an editorial dispute. I'm not sure why intimidation is your solution to an editorial dispute. It'd be great if instead of continually attempting to brigade the article in question and get people "on your side" you'd stick to following the editorial process. Not a single comment on the content...just more threats and intimidation. *sigh* Sahrin (talk) 03:48, 2 September 2016 (UTC)}} |
{{quotebox|Yeah, this is what I'm talking about. Continued harassment doesn't change the integrity of the process, nor does it change the facts of this issue. I'm not sure why you think threatening me is going to help settle an editorial dispute. I'm not sure why intimidation is your solution to an editorial dispute. It'd be great if instead of continually attempting to brigade the article in question and get people "on your side" you'd stick to following the editorial process. Not a single comment on the content...just more threats and intimidation. *sigh* Sahrin (talk) 03:48, 2 September 2016 (UTC)}} |
||
::–[[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 04:30, 6 September 2016 (UTC) |
::–[[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 04:30, 6 September 2016 (UTC) |
||
:*Closing: [[User:Sahrin]] is '''warned''' that further personal attacks, or charges of socking or 'brigading' that are made without evidence, may lead to a block for disruptive editing. Your edits related to the topic of gun control are expected to be neutral. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 20:39, 7 September 2016 (UTC) |
|||
{{hab}} |
|||
==Orasis== |
==Orasis== |
Revision as of 20:42, 7 September 2016
Arbitration enforcement action appeal by No More Mr Nice Guy
Consensus is to grant the appeal. The restriction is lifted effective immediately. Seraphimblade Talk to me 16:11, 3 September 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found here. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action. To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see WP:UNINVOLVED).
Statement by No More Mr Nice GuyIt has been 3 years and this sanction was imposed for a one time incident on my otherwise completely clean record. It is not serving any preventative purpose per WP:BLOCKPREVENTATIVE at this point so can only be punitive. @The Wordsmith: I didn't have any particular participation in mind, to be honest. It's just that not only is this the only blot on my record, which I would like removed, I also got a little tired of people trying to use it against me, like here. It's been 3 years, this sanction can't possibly be serving a preventative purpose, if it even did to begin with. No More Mr Nice Guy (talk) 18:43, 1 September 2016 (UTC) @Zscarpia: Thank you for illustrating the chilling effect this sanction has had on editors' willingness to complain about certain types of harassment. I didn't connect the two until now. Statement by SandsteinPlease refer to my comments on my talk page linked to above. I haven't followed AE for some time now and leave it to more active admins to determine whether any grounds for granting this appeal exist. I haven't seen any so far. Sandstein 05:38, 1 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by KingsindianSurely a sanction imposed three years ago ought to be removed without any requirement to grovel. Compare WP:SO. Kingsindian ♝ ♚ 12:32, 1 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by NomoskedasticityPerhaps there's no need to grovel, but given the nature of the contribution(s) for which NMMNG's AE ban was imposed, it might help to know what sort of recent discussions NMMNG would have wanted to contribute to if he had been able. I'm not sure AE discussions are suffering from lack of input from highly-partisan editors, and it might well be worth looking for evidence that the nature of the proposed contributions would in fact be different from what we saw. Nomoskedasticity (talk) 14:23, 1 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by Sir JosephI think this appeal should be granted. A 3 year ban from AE for a very weak reason is enough time served in my opinion. Looking at past AE actions, I can see many actions that should not have been brought and not sure why this one warranted a block. Regardless, even if it were 100% warranted and NMMNG was a horrible rotten person, it's been three years and it's time to give him a break. Sir Joseph (talk) 19:33, 1 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by NishidaniI would have preferred not to comment, but Four Deuces below more or less espouses NMMGG's endlessly repeated thesis that I am a Jew baiter. That has been exhaustively reviewed, and dismissed, and protesting the decision is not material to NMMGG's request, which I have no problem in endorsing. Modern legal process, since Cesare Beccaria has rightly buried the religious idea that punishment is eternal, and even permabans, as in my case, can be revoked. I would appreciate however that The Four Deuces read my evidential reply to the nonsense jerry-rigged in the original complaint. This is no place to rehearse it, but it was so unfocused that, NMMGG could claim as evidence of my having symptoms of that pathology things like:
the cornerstone of Judaism: the idea of bechira. We believe that we are an am hanivchar, a chosen people, an am segula, a treasured people. I believe collectivist statements like this are incorrect, since it is obvious that there is no such thing as an ideologically inclusive definition of ethnicity, meaning 'Jews/Arabs/Eskimos/Americans/Russians/Chinese/Catholics/shamans all think or do this or that' are hot air, vapidly empty propositions, diagnosed as a category mistake with perduring inciveness by Gilbert Ryle in his masterpiece, The Concept of Mind. For several years, NMMGG has repeated his conviction that wiki arbitrators are tone-deaf to anti-Semitic utterances, most recently here and here, and is keen to rally back users disenchanted with the place, I don't know whether to that end or not. Precisely because sanctions, however harsh, should have a use-by expiry date if evidence exists of an ability to return and participate positively in constructing Wikipedia, and because refusal to repeal this would probably only confirm the, I believe, parlously flawed conviction arbs are intrinsically 'anti-Zionist' and complicit with anti-Semitic people (like, in his view, myself), the appeal should be accepted.Nishidani (talk) 10:32, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by ZscarpiaSpeaking as an editor whom No More Mr Nice Guy seems to be currently lining up for accusations of antisemitism [2], perhaps this is what he means by his current ban serving no useful purpose. (Apologies for the slightly tongue-in-cheek nature of this comment) ← ZScarpia 13:47, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by No More Mr Nice GuyThe original ban does not seem to make any sense. No More Mr Nice Guy had complained about an editor for "Jew-baiting, trolling and soapboxing." In their first example, the editor referred to Jews as the "Chosen People." It was an ironic reference, since s/he was mocking the Jewish claim to Israel. He called the Jewish holiday Purim a "a double story of attempted and successful genocide." S/he makes many other allusions references to Nazi Germany when discussing Israel, thereby implying that what Israel does today is the same thing. While a comparison could be made between racial policies of Israel and Nazi Germany, they are only relevant in a talk page if there is a proposal to add them to an article. Otherwise they are merely intended to provoke other editors. I do not know if the edits were so objectionable they should have resulted in action by AE. But at least they were sufficiently inflammatory that a reasonable editor could complain about them. TFD (talk) 03:54, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Result of the appeal by No More Mr Nice Guy
|
SashiRolls
SashiRolls topic banned from Jill Stein and related pages for six months. NW (Talk) 19:30, 3 September 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning SashiRolls
These edits are all at Jill Stein (clearly in scope for American politics): Violation of 1RR restriction on GMO content:
Against a background of repeated slow edit warring: And POV-pushing:
Continues WP:Battleground after this AE has opened, blames everyone except self:
I leave it to the patrolling administrators to assess how much SashiRolls is self-aware about the issues here, how well TFD understands what was determined about DS for GMOs after such a very long struggle, and whether there is any truth to the silly claims that I have been disruptive at the Stein page. --Tryptofish (talk) 13:56, 2 September 2016 (UTC)
@Laser brain: Please note that I just added diffs of continued edit warring today, and weigh that in whether a warning will prove effective. Also, although I accept that, in terms of possible sanctions, AP2 is more central that GMO, please consider that GMORFC was intended to put an end to arguments, and without a clear statement now at AE, some editors will continue to argue that anything goes on pages other than the pages listed at the RfC. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:52, 2 September 2016 (UTC) A warning will be fruitless, and ANI would be a drama-fest of arguing content. Either DS mean something, or let's shut AE down. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:18, 3 September 2016 (UTC)
Discussion concerning SashiRollsStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by SashiRollsGiven Snoogannsnoogans' invective laden and patently false accusations, I will ask until Monday at 17:00 to respond completely, as Snoogannsnoogans hasn't really understood that Tryptofish may well be making a larger WP:Point, not entirely involving me, by bringing me here. Snooganssnoogans first censored me on the 13 Aug, here. Between the 11 Aug and 16 July he made 16 reverts (all of other people). His first revert on the page was the 29th of June. His reverts are of two types: to delete content that he feels support a positive image of Stein, or to do defend as the status quo content that he feels support a negative image of Stein. These are the facts concerning the user's interventions on the article. Concerning Tryptofish's assertion that the 1RR applies in the GMO section, I solicited input from the closing admins of the GMO debate who declined to comment. The Four Deuces and I both looked into his assertion and do not find it credible. Tryptofish, who is apparently somewhat famous, is clearly a very experienced Wiki-warrior given his past interactions with the Arbitration Committee. Having learned this from a google search trying to find clues as to what the "trypto" could mean, I decided to proceed cautiously, including the entire "proposition 1" of that debate in the article (3-4 lines of texts with lengthy references), because Tryptofish seemed like he wanted to create trouble in that section. He reverted this commonsense peaceful solution here. I'm also not sure why s/he wanted to include this article ("Media coverage thin for presidential candidates’ science awareness and views"), almost entirely about Clinton & Trump (with one sentence dismissing his own Weissmann reference) and pointing fingers at ScienceDebate.org to support his claim that many articles are calling Stein "contrary to science" (diff). This, in the context of a great deal of pushback concerning normal wikipedia spin-off procedures for political candidates pages (afd that he encouraged, but hasn't yet voted in (4 delete, 3 keep, currently)...) POV-pushing (ref-name change): Tryptofish's 2nd and 3rd diffs in this section do not refer to my edits (cf. the chaotic (& snarky) removal of material and vast operation of multiple reference renaming, which added confusion to the page (I was not involved in these decision to snark with significant chunks of content). In sum I changed one reference name in the first "diff", waiting for the "stray link fixed bot" to come and pick it up. I stayed on the page to see if it would. It didn't. I fixed what I had done by replacing all 16 references to the same article, introduced all in one edit by another editor here. I admit this was to make a point after having seen yet another bit of (what I consider to have been) trolling cluttering the head of a sub-section that has caused much grief and hard work in the last month with a gossipy quote that had nothing to do with anything: (diff). I figred if Tryptofish could troll with impunity I could draw attention to a serious problem: Snooganssnoogans's particularly lopsided edit here, in which introductions and conclusions of Jill Stein's arguments were cited, but the argument itself strangely disappeared from at least some of the 16 quotes s/he added from the WaPo. (cf. talk here). Tryptofish does not mention this context of consistent disruptive editing, nor does he mention his own, somewhat more troubling, history of it: he came to the Jill Stein thread on the 20th of August, with very pointed stated goals (vaccines, GMOs and pesticides interventions in the article) and added lots of "menacing" warnings about AE in his/her participation in the talk thread. I will not comment on the POV that Tryptofish may or may not be pushing, as I don't understand his actions. Regarding the diffs that are said to relate to "slow edit warring". In an environment of (occasionally) diametrically opposed viewpoints, and on a page where one editor has been going up to 3RR frequently on a regular basis in July and August (I came to the thread only in August myself), it is not surprising to find that I made 2 reverts on a section recently marked by another user as non-neutral precisely because of the text concerned. Repeated requests have been made to the editor to rework the paragraph he has added and reworked over time, to no avail. [5]. I have likewise had to remove an unreliable source that the user deliberately smuggled back into the article at [15:10 27 Aug 2016, after admitting the source had failed a basic fact-check talk 15:04 27 Aug 2016 and should not be included.
I have responded at length on my talk page and at Talk:Jill_Stein#WP:DUE + cite Talk:Jill_Stein#from_WP:Edit_warring + diff of earlier menacing thousand-year comment from notifier, which I chose to remove from my talk page. SashiRolls (talk) 15:29, 3 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by clpo13I take full ownership of this edit. In my defense, SashiRolls felt that the interview was accorded undue weight, so I figured I'd see what all would have to go if the source wasn't used. Turns out there was a lot. Well, I put it all back and received a (rightful) admonishment about being WP:POINTy, which I've taken to heart. Anyways, SashiRoll's original complaint was vague, and a follow-up response clarified that the real issue was WaPo's apparent bias against Sanders (and by extension Stein, I guess). But that still comes across as "WaPo doesn't like my candidate so we shouldn't use it as a reference". It took a fair bit of needling to get any further explanation. I can understand the sentiment that no Wikipedia article should rely so much on a single article, but this wasn't a good way to go about making an objection since it wasn't clear to many people what the issue actually was. As a final note: relying on the bot to fix the reference names probably wasn't the best idea, since over an hour passed between the first change and my fix, during which time the source was inaccessible to readers. clpo13(talk) 23:37, 1 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by The Four DeucesJill Stein is not a "page[] relating to genetically modified organisms, commercially produced agricultural chemicals and the companies that produce them, broadly construed." Earlier, it was determined in a request for clarification in which Tryptofish participated, that Bernie Sanders was not a page related to GMOs. (See: Wikipedia talk:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically modified organisms.) Both Stein and Sanders are or were 2016 presidential candidates who are critics of GMOs. Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Genetically modified organisms applies to 11 named articles and "will be implemented, broadly construed, for other articles in the subject area." Furthermore, there is no template for GMO on the talk page, although there is one for "American politics 2." 1RR is not part of U.S. politics general sanctions[6] and would be too draconian for such a wide topic area. Trypofish falsely claimed at Talk:Jill Stein, "I want to make it very clear to editors that the content that I reverted violates the [GMO] Discretionary Sanctions linked above, because it alters the language that was established in the community RfC about GMOs. Editors must not make up alternative language, and doing so will result in Arbitration Enforcement." [20:55, 27 August 2016[7]] While the closing adminstrator determined the consensus of the RfC and set discretionary sanctions, those sanctions were not for disgreeing with the determination of facts in the RfC. Ironically, Stein has not said that currently manufactured GMO food is unsafe. The articles in The Washington Post and others are cited in the article as the opinions of their authors, not as statements of fact. While SashiRolls unfortunately says the paper is not rs, he actually argues that it is biased, and provides an article originally published in Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting ("Washington Post Ran 16 Negative Stories on Bernie Sanders in 16 Hours") as a source.[8] [22:43, 31 August 2016[9]] The paper's editorial board has called Trump a "clear and present danger."[10] although it has not yet endorsed Clinton. It is not a stretch of the imagination to assume that at least some of the opinions expressed in the paper have a partisan tinge. The article by Steven T. Corneliussen, ""Media coverage thin for presidential candidates’ science awareness and views", in Physics Today, does not "clearly agree[] with the criticism" of Stein, as Tryptofish says. [1 September 2016[11]] It says only, "An opinion piece at Slate dismissed Green Party candidate Jill Stein as “a Harvard-trained physician who panders to pseudoscience” concerning genetically modified organisms, pesticides, “quack medicine,” and vaccine efficacy. If anything it draws into question the extensive concentration on science issues that Trypofish has shown. Tryptofish was an involved party in Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically modified organisms. It appears that his interest in that topic has brought him to the Jill Stein article and blurs his neutrality. S/he has not provided edits on any Green-related articles except to add opinions that they are anti-science. TFD (talk) 00:03, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by Timothyjosephwood
Statement by snooganssnoogansThe user SashiRolls has for the last few weeks engaged in constant disruptive editing on the Jill Stein page. I'll try to limit this text to just recent examples of disruptive behavior. The user repeatedly:
References
- Snooganssnoogans (talk) 16:38, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by NeutralityI agree completely with Snooganssnoogans and Timothyjosephwood others who have commented. On Stein and Stein-related articles, SashiRolls' sustained course of conduct has been completely unacceptable, and the array of problems is broad: everything from casting aspersions to personal attacks to POV-pushing. I also agree with Timothyjosephwood that it would be wise to act on this report relatively rapidly. If this file weren't open, this matter might well be up at ANI for discussion of a possible topic ban of SashiRolls. Neutralitytalk 18:24, 3 September 2016 (UTC) Result concerning SashiRolls
|
Sahrin
User:Sahrin is warned for personal attacks and reminded that edits about gun control are expected to be neutral. EdJohnston (talk) 20:41, 7 September 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Request concerning Sahrin
The following starters are from the EWN case just a couple days ago the EWN case closed just a day ago
The EWN notice resulted in Sahrin being blocked for edit warring by User:Someguy1221. First three contribs upon returning:
I took at shot at talking with them, ignoring the attacks and strangeness: dif
I have to imagine that this is why Arbcom sets up enduring DS on this topic; I don't even edit gun topics, but I am a "Gun zealot"? It is crazy. Every edit they have made since this started has been laden with personal attack and emotion; typical of these issues that have DS on them. But this is over top; there is no room to work here. I don't want to bring content into this, but there is also a WP:CIR thing going on here, as the Dickey Amendment doesn't say what Sahrin thinks it does, - this is really simple;
It is/was not even a hard issue to resolve in some ways. I ~think~ maybe Sahrin wants to say something about the effect of the Dickey Amendment on researchers but with all the aggression, attacks, and demands, and tangle, I can't figure out what that might be. The behavior and approach to other editors makes working it out way uglier than anything has to be in WP and there is no reason to put up with this. This is what DS are for; please apply them.
Discussion concerning SahrinStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by SahrinI can only laugh bemusedly at this entire affair. From day one Jytdog has behaved aggressively and harassed me. Based on the evidence that is available in the logs, it can be seen that Jytdog's initial and repeated effort was to revert a consensus version of the article that was achieved a few weeks before this incident. He was saved from a 3RR violation only by brigading the article (ie, summoning either a like-minded user, or a sock puppet account to revert so that he did not jeopardize his own account). I admit I was not aware of the "bright line" 3RR rule, but overturning an existing consensus (which contained both the content of the law in question; as the initial 'other side' advocated; as well as the actual cause of the controversy (the effort to censor researchers) seemed grounds for aggressive action. I was banned, and was wrong to revert three times without logging into an alt account as Jytdog did. The issue began, though, when Jytdog, after seeing my reverts, initiated an aggressive program of harassment - making three separate edits to my user talk page (all evidenced in his links above so I won't reproduce them) in response to a *single edit.* His every effort appeared to be to entrap me into a 3RR violation, including very strong language in comments in edit notes like "This is not optional." I admit, I was frustrated, and reverted three times. But the notion that anything is being done but normal revision of an article that is being interfered with by Jytdog is absolutely hilarious. His behavior has gone over the line time and again, and when this is pointed out to him (that he is harassing me and brigading an article) he responds with "personal attacks! personal attacks!" That's all fine, but the evidence just isn't there for that behavior. With the exception of the 3RR I have remained civil and results oriented at all times, meanwhile Jytdog seems to be interested in carrying out a personal vendetta against me...why I cannot say. There are a number of problems with Jytdog's version of events:
In short, I don't have a comprehensive understanding of all the WP:Policy bits. I made an error before in the 3RR situation, and I apologize for that. But what going on here is a very passionate editor has lost perspective on a situation, and is trying to push his own feeling too far. I've been editing WP for...13 years now, I believe. If the Arb committee decides it's my time to go, then it's my time. Thanks for the good times, it was a fun project to contribute to.
Added 21:30 UTC: So I have reviewed Jytdog's block log. It appears he has been banned permanently on two separate instances for similar behaviors, only to be unbanned after appealing to the Arb Committee. I can't see into the committee's deliberations myself, but if I've ever heard of a case of misplaced aggression/transferrance this appears to follow it to a textbook. In my entire history with WP I have never had any interaction with Admins or disciplinary groups, until Jytdog. Sahrin (talk) 21:32, 2 September 2016 (UTC) Added 2016-19-05 1746 UTC: Comment on the admin's page *was not about this issue.* This was stated several times and for the record above. Comments regarding neutrality of other editors were made only after my neutrality was questioned, and repeated reverts were made without substantiation for the revert. As I noted, I became frustrated and committed the 3RR. I have already backed away from the dispute; I made a further comment on the talk page which failed to achieve consensus and have not said anything further on the topic. The evidence for "whitewashing" is readily available - there were repeated attempts to remove factually true information from an article to present a particular viewpoint (that there was no controversy), I must admit I find it frustrating that the admins in question have not seen this in the record; if agreeing to remove myself from the situation is what causes this to blow over then I'm totally down with it. As far as de-escalating, I will not have anything further to do with the topic or certainly the editor in question. I have received messages from several other editors criticizing the neutrality/behavior of the editor in question in the past, and need no further convincing that he is not someone I want to be involved with. Sahrin (talk) 21:51, 5 September 2016 (UTC) Added 2016-09-06 1000 UTC: The editor in question did not follow the editorial process. If it is against Wikipedia policy to point this out, it seems like it would be impossible for me to end up in this situation (ie, accused of not following processes). This is the point that is unclear to me, and the reason that such comments can't be 'withdrawn.' The evidence is strong, and while I'm eager to work with all editors I can't ignore strong evidence. My question is: If it is acceptable for the editor in question to accuse me of violating wikipedia policy, why is it unacceptable for me to do the same? An answer from any neutral party could profitably resolve the dispute. Failing an answer, as I have said I will have nothing further to do with the editor in question so it's a moot point in either case. Sahrin (talk) 10:04, 6 September 2016 (UTC) Statement by OIDPlease note in the above statement where Sahrin accuses Jytdog of socking to avoid 3rr ("I was banned, and was wrong to revert three times without logging into an alt account as Jytdog did."). Dont think anything more needs to be said. Only in death does duty end (talk) 14:24, 2 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by (username)Result concerning Sahrin
|
Orasis
Orasis (talk · contribs) is banned from the WP:ARBPIA topic area, broadly construed, for 6 months. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 22:36, 6 September 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Orasis
Discussion concerning OrasisStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by OrasisI will not appeal shit, I will change my IP. The fact that only the Israeli view is allowed here is apparent. I will return, eat shit. Statement by (username)Result concerning Orasis
|
Philip Cross
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Request concerning Philip Cross
- User who is submitting this request for enforcement
- Nomoskedasticity (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 10:55, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
- User against whom enforcement is requested
- Philip Cross (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log
- Sanction or remedy to be enforced
- DS 1RR restriction on Jeremy Corbyn [19]
- Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
- 5 Sept, 10:57, "Reverted good faith edits by MShabazz (talk)" revert obvious in the edit summary
- 6 Sept., 10:04 "+ citation about Corbyn's association with alleged antisemites & Holocaust deniers (*one^ sentence on this issue, plus citation, is not tendentious one would have thought)", is a revert by virtue of restoring mention of Corbyn's alleged "anti-Semitism", previously added twice by Philip Cross on 2 Sept. e.g. here (immediately following deletion by a different editor). The edit summary of this most recent edit shows awareness that there have been previous attempts to add something along these lines.
- Additional comments by editor filing complaint
The second revert uses a different source (i.e., not the same as with his first attempt to add this material on 2 Sept.). But it is a revert all the same insofar as it attempts to have the Jeremy Corbyn article include implication of the idea that he is an anti-Semite (has been accused of, is indifferent to, etc.). Different sources and different ways of expressing the idea don't hide the underlying impulse here. Also worth noting is that the issue is under discussion on the talk page ([20]), where it's entirely evident that there is no consensus to add a particular passage along these lines.
Finally, attempt to raise the point with the editor on his talk page did not succeed: [21].
- Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested
Discussion concerning Philip Cross
Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.
Statement by Philip Cross
Most of the other users on the talkpage opposing any mention of the issue of Jeremy Corbyn and the antisemitism issue are stonewalling in my opinion, and unable to acknowledge any other viewpoint as being valid. The citation Nomoskedasticity mentions was on 2 September, not within the last 24 years. In the 2 September addition, I did not claim Corbyn is "indifferent" to the issue in the article itself, nor make a direct claim about his attitudes. The objection of other users is to a tweet I added by the Times journalist Oliver Kamm (cited to a reliable source) and is a matter of interpretation over which there is disagreement. The issue of Corbyn's past association with (quoting from my edit today which Nomoskedasticity cites) "alleged antisemites and Holocaust deniers" has repeatedly been referred to in the British media, and internationally, yet other editors cannot accept this is notable and should be included in the main Corbyn article. My new mention of this issue consists of one sentence, and a citation. Hardly excessive. There is a related issue concerning the talkpage discussion. Many editors are unwilling to countenance the inclusion in the article of the issue of online sexist and homophobic, as well as antisemite abuse, by people who claim to be Corbyn's supporters. The issue of Corbyn's apparent inability to deal with the abuse issue has again frequently been raised. For instance, by many of the former shadow ministers who resigned from Labour's shadow cabinet last June, other Labour MPs who were among the 172 who supported a motion of no confidence in Corbyn, and commentators in the media. Since this complaint was filed, I have added Corbyn's responses. I usually add opposing views, or opinions I do not share, in such instances. The Labour Party is split over the issue of Jeremy Corbyn's leadership, probably the most serious crisis the party has faced in more than 80 years (the party had a major split in 1931, and a more minor one in 1981), with a new split being openly discussed because of Corbyn's leadership, yet this article barely touches on any of this. Philip Cross (talk) 12:47, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by (username)
Result concerning Philip Cross
- This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
Volunteer Marek
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Request concerning Volunteer Marek
- User who is submitting this request for enforcement
- The Four Deuces (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 23:20, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
- User against whom enforcement is requested
- Volunteer Marek (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log
- Sanction or remedy to be enforced
- Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/American politics 2#Discretionary sanctions (1932 cutoff) : request 2 month topic ban on articles related to the 2016 U.S. elections.
- Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
- 00:39, 15 August 2016 "...your previous source - the Clinton Cash book - has been shown to be fringe nutjobbery."
- 16:04, 6 September 2016 ""Clinton Cash". A fringe far right conspiracy theory book."
- 05:17, 6 September 2016 "No, the extent of coverage between this and the email "controversy" is tremendous. It's mountain vs. molehill. Most of this article consists of POV laden WP:SYNTHESIS. The only sources really are a single AP story and then several stories slamming that AP story. And yes, the purpose of this article is solely to circumvent consensus on the Clinton Foundation article. The POV is obvious and obnoxious. As is the WP:GAMEing. This is also a cynical attempt to do a run around discretionary sanctions on American Politics articles. The creator of this article - and you as well - know from experience that adding garbage content to an existing article can be challenged, and then it is up to the person wishing to add it to get consensus for inclusion. It's painfully obvious that most of the content of this thing would not get such consensus. So you guys went and created a separate article for all the junk you know you wouldn't be able to get into the legitimate article. This is disruptive behavior, clear and simple, and it's actually fairly stunning in its cynicism and disrespect for Wikipedia policy."
- 14:14, 25 August 2016 "How are we gonna deal with that? Man, this guy makes the life of a Wikipedia editor hard."
- If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
- Gave an alert about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, on 06:35 25 July 2016
- Additional comments by editor filing complaint
The following comments are in explanation of the edit differences provided above:
Clinton Cash is a book by Peter Schweizer and published by HarperCollins. The book was reviewed in the New York Times[23] and other mainstream media. The Times review said, "“Clinton Cash” is potentially more unsettling [than other books about the Clintons], both because of its focused reporting and because major news organizations including The Times, The Washington Post and Fox News have exclusive agreements with the author to pursue the story lines found in the book."
While the author is a conservative and his analysis of the Clintons may differ from liberal observers, there is no suggestion that he is far right, a conspiracy theorist or a nutjob.
Volunteer Marek's tone has also been abrasive and dismissive in speaking about other editors and the Republican presidential nominee.
I asked Volunteer Marek to remove his comments on Clinton Cash,[24] which he rejected.[25]
TFD (talk) 23:20, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
Volunteer Marek, referring to an established journalist and author as a nutjob right-wing conspiracy theorist is in my opinion defamatory or at least a violation of biography of living persons policy since it impugns the integrity or judgment of someone whose career is based on a reputation for integrity and judgment. It is also an attack on the publisher, because reputable publishers do not publish such works, which is why they are reputable and their reputation is a key element in their success. Ironically, your objection to Clinton Cash was that "BLP applies," in that case that we could not "add this junk" which you saw as prejudicial to living persons. (18:16, 14 August 2016) Your comments on Trump ("Man, this guy makes the life of a Wikipedia editor hard.") shows a personal preference against him, yet in the previous edit above, you accuse other editors of being so influenced by political bias that it affects their judgment. TFD (talk) 02:09, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
- Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested
Discussion concerning Volunteer Marek
Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.
Statement by Volunteer Marek
Sigh. So you can get dragged to AE now for criticizing a ... book. While other editors run around Wikipedia creating POVFORKs and game the DS system. Right. Here's links about the book (already provided in relevant discussion plus some more) Clinton Cash Crushed By Facts As Author Admits He Has No Evidence Of Clinton Crimes Clinton Cash: errors dog Bill and Hillary exposé – but is there any 'there' there?, [26]. According to the Guardian "the book is an unrestrained attack on the former president and first lady." Sources - though obviously not all - do call it a "conspiracy theory"
Anyway, why is this even being brought up to AE? Volunteer Marek (talk) 00:13, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
And I genuinely have no idea what is suppose to be wrong in this diff presented by The Four Deuces. I'm sorry, you lost me.Volunteer Marek (talk) 00:19, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Dude, it's expressing an opinion about the quality a source. An opinion which is actually shared by other reliable sources. Stop being silly. Or WP:BOOMERANG for obvious WP:BATTLEGROUND behavior.Volunteer Marek (talk) 02:59, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by Timothyjosephwood
I stalk watch most of these articles. This seems like a silly report mostly for expressing a dissenting opinion, although somewhat lacking in tact. VM has made numerous BOLD but beneficial edits on these and related pages. If we're coming to ArbCom, we should be doing so with more than hurt feelings for talk page posts. TimothyJosephWood 00:16, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by MrX
WP:ARBAPDS remedies are intended to address behavioral issues like edit warring, personal attacks, incivility, assumptions of bad faith, harassment, disruptive point-making, and gaming the system. The diffs presented as violations of these remedies don't nearly justify arbitration enforcement. What I see here is legitimate criticism of sources and pushback on what is arguable a fruit salad of an article, the purpose of which may be to cast a living person in a negative light. While Marek's passion could stand to be dialed down a notch or two, nothing evident here, in the article talk page, or the article edit history, rises to the level of a sanctionable offense in my opinion.- MrX 14:40, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by My very best wishes
I think Marek was right on the essence of the issue. In particular, Peter Schweizer was described by Media Matters for America as someone who "has a disreputable history of reporting marked by errors and retractions, with numerous reporters excoriating him for facts that "do not check out," sources that "do not exist," and a basic failure to practice "Journalism 101." (see here). My very best wishes (talk) 18:29, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by (username)
Result concerning Volunteer Marek
- This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
Makeandtoss
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Request concerning Makeandtoss
- User who is submitting this request for enforcement
- Sir Joseph (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 14:08, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
- User against whom enforcement is requested
- Makeandtoss (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log
- Sanction or remedy to be enforced
- Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Palestine-Israel_articles_3/ :
- Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
- 10:55 Sep 6 First Reversion
- 9:56 Sep 7 1RR from WB to Palestine
- 9:57 Sep 7 Continuing revisions
- 9:57 Sep 7 Again...
- Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
- I am not sure, but I think user was blocked or TBANNED previously.
- If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
- I couldn't find the specific template, but user is aware of sanctions. There was a discussion on his page and Arb. Drmies mentioned it to him. User_talk:Makeandtoss/Archive_1#January_2016
- Additional comments by editor filing complaint
This is about a site located in the West Bank. Since calling it State of Palestine is POV, I changed it to West Bank since that is technically where the location is. I then continued to expand the page finding live links, adding more refs, etc. User then came back with his NPOV edit and edit summary.
- It would be the same POV if I said Israel, which would not be allowed. I even made a suggestion of removing West Bank and just labeling it in the Jordan Valley, since a few sentences down it mentions the West Bank, but calling this part of the State of Palestine, and not even Palestine (region) is extreme POV.
- To Makeandtoss, you violated 1RR not necessarily 3RR. There were also around 10 edits in between your edit and your first reversion. As for the category, that is funny, considering that the article has a Tourism in the Sate of Palestine cat already.
- Tracy McClark is being a little disingenuous with the numbers and reverts. My initial edit wasn't a revert, I then modified it to make it more neutral, and that is not a revert, making two edits in a row is not counted especially since I was improving the neutrality and making small edits to the article. All one has to do is view history to see the truth.
- Nishidani, I added that cat only because there was a cat for the Palestine one. You need both to be NPOV. What Cliftonian suggested on his userpage was a cat for Tourism in the West Bank. It might get convoluted but it should work since anything else is POV.
- Tracy McClark is being a little disingenuous with the numbers and reverts. My initial edit wasn't a revert, I then modified it to make it more neutral, and that is not a revert, making two edits in a row is not counted especially since I was improving the neutrality and making small edits to the article. All one has to do is view history to see the truth.
- To Makeandtoss, you violated 1RR not necessarily 3RR. There were also around 10 edits in between your edit and your first reversion. As for the category, that is funny, considering that the article has a Tourism in the Sate of Palestine cat already.
- Since Cliftonian has published a modified version that is more neutral, I withdraw my complaint. I'm not here to have anyone sanctioned, so this can be closed since the article has a more tolerable and neutral wording.
- Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested
Discussion concerning Makeandtoss
Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.
Statement by Makeandtoss
- I did not revert three times, I reverted once because there are no intermediate edits by anyone.
- State of Palestine is recognized by 136 (70.5%) (more than two thirds) of the 193 member states of the United Nations. Meanwhile, Israeli occupation of West Bank is not recognized by anyone, not even the USA/EU/UN. I fail to see how you can make that resemblance. I fail to see how you think its OK to this as a site in Israel but not as a site in the State of Palestine? Neutral you said? Interesting. --Makeandtoss (talk) 14:23, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Statement by TracyMcClark
How about turning the focus on the filer's 3 reverts within 24 hours?
Initial revert/content here
1st revert here
3rd revert here (added twice today)
Statement by Nishidani
Sir Joe, you have a right to challenge editors who prefer ‘State of Palestine’ for anything in the West Bank. But when you reverting them on this, while adding a cat for Tourism in Israel you are contradicting yourself, and reality. All Israelis know that the West Bank is not in Israel. Nishidani (talk) 17:23, 7 September 2016 (UTC)
Result concerning Makeandtoss
- This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.