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*When [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Jaqeli&diff=615732792&oldid=615515119 lifting] the previous topic ban from matters that relate both to Armenia and Georgia, I warned Jaqeli to "make sure to refrain from confrontational or otherwise disruptive editing in this topic area, such as edit-warring or assuming bad faith on the part of others." However, the evidence shows that Jaqeli did continuously edit war at {{la|Mesrop Mashtots}} and {{la|Georgian scripts}} since July. The topic ban is accordingly reinstated. <p>Because Tiptoethrutheminefield has also edit-warred with Jaqeli on the same articles, they are, for three months, restricted from making more than one revert (as defined at [[WP:3RR]]) per page in any 24 hour period with respect to pages that relate to the history of Armenia or Georgia. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Sandstein|<font style="color:white;background:blue;font-family:sans-serif;">''' Sandstein '''</font>]]</span></small> 16:14, 15 August 2014 (UTC) |
*When [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Jaqeli&diff=615732792&oldid=615515119 lifting] the previous topic ban from matters that relate both to Armenia and Georgia, I warned Jaqeli to "make sure to refrain from confrontational or otherwise disruptive editing in this topic area, such as edit-warring or assuming bad faith on the part of others." However, the evidence shows that Jaqeli did continuously edit war at {{la|Mesrop Mashtots}} and {{la|Georgian scripts}} since July. The topic ban is accordingly reinstated. <p>Because Tiptoethrutheminefield has also edit-warred with Jaqeli on the same articles, they are, for three months, restricted from making more than one revert (as defined at [[WP:3RR]]) per page in any 24 hour period with respect to pages that relate to the history of Armenia or Georgia. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Sandstein|<font style="color:white;background:blue;font-family:sans-serif;">''' Sandstein '''</font>]]</span></small> 16:14, 15 August 2014 (UTC) |
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==Wickey-nl== |
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<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br>Requests may not exceed 500 [[Word count#Software|words]] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small> |
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===Request concerning Wickey-nl=== |
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; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|Shrike}} 11:18, 18 August 2014 (UTC) |
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; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Wickey-nl}}<p>{{ds/log|Wickey-nl}} |
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<!--- Here and at the end, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. ---> |
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;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: [[Wikipedia:ARBPIA]] : |
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<!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced ---> |
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; [[WP:DIFF|Diffs]] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it : |
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#[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Wickey-nl&curid=17467858&diff=621755839&oldid=621637224 18 August 2014] Breach of the topic ban i.e talking about "hasbara network within Wikipedia", "Zionist sinners state" and "Gazacaust" |
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; Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any : |
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#[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Wickey-nl&diff=621372733&oldid=620494370 15 August 2014] Topic ban |
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;If [[Wikipedia:AC/DS|discretionary sanctions]] are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see [[WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts]]): |
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<!-- The following are examples. Write "Not applicable" or similar if this is not a discretionary sanctions enforcement request. Otherwise, fill out at least one line that applies and delete the rest. If you wish to request discretionary sanctions but none of these situations apply, issue an alert yourself instead of making this request, see the link above. --> |
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*Previously given a discretionary sanction for conduct in the area of conflict on [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Wickey-nl&diff=621372733&oldid=620494370 15 August 2014 ] by {{admin|Sandstein}}. |
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* |
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; Additional comments by editor filing complaint : |
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; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested : |
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<!-- Please notify the user against whom you request enforcement of the request, and then replace this comment with a diff of the notification. The request will normally not be processed otherwise. --> |
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<!--- In the line below, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. ---> |
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===Discussion concerning Wickey-nl=== |
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<small>''Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 [[Word count#Software|words]] and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. <br>Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.''</small> |
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====Statement by Wickey-nl==== |
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====Statement by (username)==== |
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===Result concerning Wickey-nl=== |
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<small>''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''</small> |
Revision as of 11:18, 18 August 2014
Wickey-nl
Wickey-nl is indefinitely banned from the topic of the Arab-Israeli conflict. Sandstein 16:28, 15 August 2014 (UTC) |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Wickey-nl
Its clear that user violations of WP:NPA, bad edits like restoration of WP:COPYVIO, false edit summaries and not properly attributing advocacy organisations clearly shows that user came here not to edit in neutral way. Kingsindian It really doesn't matter who put it in the first place every one is responsible for their own edit and it doesn't matter if it revert or something else.There was more problems with this edit that its cherry-picking the source to present only one piece of information though it discuss the issue at large.--Shrike (talk)/WP:RX 03:57, 11 August 2014 (UTC) @@Bbb23 and Sandstein: Even in this AE thread the user continue his violation of WP:NPA [2] by calling other users "hasbara activists" and their "mates". I must agree with Robert McClenon on this regard some admin action is need to stop the disruption.--Shrike (talk)/WP:RX 15:31, 15 August 2014 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Wickey-nlStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by Wickey-nl
--Wickey-nl (talk) 09:27, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
@Bbb23
--Wickey-nl (talk) 14:04, 14 August 2014 (UTC) @Bbb23: Wrong conclusion. While this is not the place to evaluate the system, I do not say that I will not take into account the reality of the existing dominant interpretations. I will do, I only say these interpretations are not obvious. Some are trapped by the use of a single word, not even present in the request of the submitter. I do not have evidence, so I should not have used the c-word, and I striked it out. Having said that, I view the threatening with a topic ban inconsistent with the conclusion that the very submission of this complaint is poorly substantiated. You cannot simply say: the arguments filed by the submitter do not justify a sanction, but Wickey-nl is a problem, or even Wickey-nl [have not] "the competence required to edit productively and collaboratively in this topic area".
Statement by (Kingsindian)As an editor involved in 2 of the 6 diffs above (number 3 and 4) directly, and one indirectly (number 1), perhaps I should say something. The good part: About diff 4, the copyvio was inserted by another editor, in the beginning, User:Shrike reverted it, and as a sort of compromise, I moved the essence of the edit to another section while keeping out the copyvio. User:Wickey-nl reverted me, I explained the edit and he did not revert it again. The bad part: Seems that User:Wickey-nl has a habit of accusing others as sock-puppets and other personal attacks, and has a very strong bias in his edits in the I/P area. I do also have my own bias (and rather in his direction), but I try to keep it under control (I hope with some success). With the recent events in I/P, tempers are inflamed everywhere. I do not know what WP policy is regarding these things (this is my first post to Noticeboard), but perhaps these are things to keep in mind. Kingsindian (talk) 18:47, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
Statement by BrewcrewerPlease review these additional diffs:
In summation, besides for the 1rr violations and personal attacks (mentioned in other reports), more importantly, Wickey-nl has exhibited a pattern of pov-pushing disguised as proper editing while not holding himself to the same standard he demands of others. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 04:06, 9 August 2014 (UTC) Statement by ZeroThis report is unusually weak. Sandstein identifies this edit as "problematic" and indeed it is. But it is just a commonplace mild copyvio that is easily fixed by some paraphrasing. This should have been done by Shrike instead of removing it wholesale, since it is obviously relevant and well sourced. Identifying this edit alone as sufficient cause for a topic ban seems extraordinary. (Problematic content suppressed instead of struck, Sandstein 03:15, 11 August 2014 (UTC)) Zerotalk 00:02, 11 August 2014 (UTC) @Sandstein: You wrote that I made "personal attacks" but in fact I made comments on editing behavior. Your words are a clear violation of WP:ASPERSIONS and I invite you to remove them. Zerotalk 04:24, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
@Robert McClenon : As an administrator who sometimes blocks people, I expect that some of them will give me lip for it. But I think it is a right to be able to criticise an administrator's actions (within some generous limits) and administrators should be able to take it. Once we start blocking people for being angry when they are blocked, we will look like a bunch of power-freaks and community respect for administrators will plummet. Zerotalk 14:29, 11 August 2014 (UTC) Statement by IRISZOOMI can't see what makes this a case for sanctions as it looks like to be normal disagreements, except for the copyright issue which easily could have been fixed - even by Shrike instead of making a case of it. Regarding Wickey-nl's response here, I think one word or so is unacceptable but he seems upset over the 48h block mentioned in the same sentence. That wording shouldn't be used but I certainly don't agree that he can't collaborate with others, as I think he has proven it, like being very active in talk pages, and doing many improvements on articles. A topic ban would be very hard to understand. --IRISZOOM (talk) 06:19, 11 August 2014 (UTC) Statement by NishidaniI've disagreed with Wickey-nl in the past (I thought he could not spot an evident POV for example), but generally find that he is a very good wikipedian. Unlike most editors, he actually goes through pages diligently from top to bottom, expanding them significantly (see Beit HaShalom. Edit warriors can be identified easily. They don’t build pages (too much work) they tend to intervene to revert, or to add some succulent piece of information that tells against one side. They are morbidly interested in AE report: they appear to spend a lot of time watching selected editors’ contribs, and reporting people. I can't see anything, rather than the trivial BBC diff in Shrike's original report. This fits some profiles here: it does not strike me as appropriate to Wickey-nl. Brewcrewer's report is wrong from the outset (dragging up stale diffs, never reported at the time if they were believed to be serous, rather than content disputes):
Brewcrewer is much taken by content disputes with wickey-nl at Palestinian land laws, where he had edited however only once recently, and over the years never, except recently, used the talk page as against 27 edits by the editor he is reporting. His edit was an egregious piece of POV slanting of the lead, ignoring the historical background in order to prioritize an ethnic sense of those laws, which are mirrored in Israeli law, being offensive. As a glance at the talk page will show, the whole article is a misnomer, the earlier drafts preferred by Brewcrewer showcased the article as evidence that Palestinian land laws are anti-Jewish/Israeli. I think that was one of the purposes of the article. The article gets great attention because of its I/P polemical value: compare the ignored, but parallel article Israeli land and property laws (Background . 93% of the land in Israel is state-owned land originally confiscated from Arabs and held in trust for the Jewish people: of the remaining 7% most is Arab-owned, but even there some is encumbered in a way that only allows the Arab vendor to sell it to Jews). Editors who jump at the Palestinian article to raise a spectre of offensive laws, quietly ignore the other article. NPOV requires we be serenely descriptive of the facts, and not focus on one article of a pair to push a POV. Third point. Yes, Wickey-nl is distressed at this report, you can see that by the unusual intensity of his grammar and spelling errors, which suggests to me he thought, the way things go in here, he's another goner. I don't think fishy reports should function to provoke upset language so that the evidence of being upset substitutes for the original evidence as grounds for conviction. Wickey-nl might well be told to exercise more care, but the original report was both frivolous and instrumental (attempting to remove an editor out of dislike, as is, sadly, often the case recently).Nishidani (talk) 10:45, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
Statement by Robert McClenonWickey-nl was already advised to strike the reference to a "corrupt admin" and has not done so. Maybe Wickey-nl thinks that the Wikipedia admin system is inherently "corrupt" or otherwise abusive; that does not excuse a very strong personal attack on the integrity of an administrator. If there really is evidence of abuse of the admin privilege, let alone "corruption" in the use of the admin privilege, it should be taken to the ArbCom, rather than being used idly to poison discussion of disruptive editing in WP:ARBPIA. Recommend a block for the personal attack, without prejudice to whether a topic-ban is also in order. Robert McClenon (talk) 14:08, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
Statement by EdJohnstonAt 18:27 on 16 June I left a message for Wickey-nl, pointing out a 3RR complaint about editing at Civilian casualty ratio. He was one of the people who had edited, he had seemingly made two reverts, and it would be in his interest to respond: At that time I hoped that he would make a conciliatory response and there would be no need for any follow-up on my part. Instead, at 11:24 on 17 June Wickey-nl added his own comment at the 3RR board, accusing User:Yarron and User:Brewcrewer of various things, but without mentioning the fact he'd been warned about 1RR himself. I considered this an inadequate response by someone who seemed to have made a 1RR violation. After this exchange (or non-exchange with Wickey-nl, since he didn't really respond) a different editor noticed I had warned Wickey-nl and filed a new 3RR complaint naming him for a 1RR violation, and linking to my warning: WP:AN3#User:Wickey-nl reported by User:JungerMan Chips Ahoy! (Result: 48 hours). I blocked Wickey-nl for the 1RR violation per this message on his talk page, at 01:30 on 18 June, i.e. giving him plenty of time for him to respond to the June 16 warning if he wanted to. Wickey-nl made an unblock request, stating It was hard for me to reconcile this claim with my having notified him that he seemed to have broken 1RR at 18:27 on 16 June. Is it possible that he simply overlooked the warning? Certainly I didn't deprive him of 'the opportunity to defend himself.' Does his mention of 'hasbara' (a kind of propaganda effort by the Israeli government) intended to imply that admins are in league with that government? His unblock request timed out without an admin deciding on it because nobody accepted or declined it within 48 hours. After his block expired, Wickey-nl opened a a complaint about my actions at ANI on 20 June.
This doesn't make a lot of sense to me. It is not unheard of for the blocking admin to leave a comment if someone makes an unblock request. This helps any reviewing admins come to their own conclusion as to whether the block was sound. Anyone may comment on an open unblock request. Wickey-nl has claimed that 'the system is inherently corrupt', in part due to my failure to comment on the ANI. I was out of town when he filed the ANI and it was inconvenient for me to get to a proper computer to make a response. User:Bbb23 wound up closing the ANI with no action on 21 June. He stated "This was a baseless report from the get-go and has not improved since...". In terms of the earlier background: Wickey-nl should be somewhat familiar with how the 3RR board works. A complaint was filed against him back in August 2013 by User:Number 57 for edit warring on Template:Palestinian elections. According to the submitter, he made four reverts. He was warring to keep some West Bank elections of 1972 and 1976 out of the list, asserting in his edit summary that they were 'fake elections.' At that time no block was issued; the article was protected instead by a different admin. EdJohnston (talk) 15:02, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
Before making further comments, I see I have to correct a false attribution to me of the statement that 'the system is inherently corrupt'. Please keep the discussion honest. I did not say that. --Wickey-nl (talk) 09:26, 15 August 2014 (UTC) Result concerning Wickey-nlThis section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above. The NPA and NOTFORUM concerns are, in my view, too slight, on their own, to warrant a sanction at this point. Diff no. 5 seems to be mainly a content issue. I have not evaluated Brewcrewer's diffs because they are undated and many seem to be relatively old. But the BBC copyright issue, Shrike's diff 4, is problematic. And Wickey-nl's response is so incoherent and confrontative that I doubt that they have the temperament and the competence required to edit productively and collaboratively in this topic area. I advise a topic ban. Sandstein 18:22, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
Of the six points mde by Shrike, only two bother me much, #1 and #2. It's not that he violated NOTAFORUM with #2 so much as it evinces bias. As to #1, I'm very tired of editors accusing other editors of being socks in the PIA area, in all fairness, Wiki-nl is not alone in this failing. It's not that they are wrong all the time. But if they have the evidence to prove it, then they should take it to SPI; otherwise, they should not make the accusation. The NPA allegations are close to worthless, and the copyvio is not a big enough deal to merit any sanction. As for the edit-warring claim, he was blocked (and very rightfully) for that, but he should not have to double-pay for his error. At the same time, it does disturb me that many editors who edit in this area don't understand - or at least say they don't understand - policy. It also bothers me that apparently as of June 19, he finally realized that 1RR may be violated if there are two reverts of different material, yet he went ahead and filed a report at ANI on June 20. That's pretty over-the-top. As for no one responding to his unblock request, this was a block per ARBPIA and can only be accepted by the blocking admin or by an appeal by the user, so it's not surprising that no one responded. The majority of the diffs by Brewcrewer are stale. I can't say this editor isn't a problem. He is, and his attitude here doesn't help him, but I would favor a stern warning to be followed by a topic ban if this kind of behavior continues. That said, it's a close call, and I'm interested in what other admins have to say.--Bbb23 (talk) 22:40, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
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Jaqeli
Jaqeli's topic ban is reinstated. Tiptoethrutheminefield is restricted to WP:1RR for three months. Sandstein 16:15, 15 August 2014 (UTC) |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Jaqeli
The disruptive editing covers two articles. On Georgian scripts, the content says an inscription "is dated 430AD". The inscription in question is actually undated, and the cited sources actually say "dates from c430AD". I initially added fact tags for the "dated 430AD" claim, hoping for some sources, but Jaqeli repeatedly deleted the tags. He did the same for the clarification tags I then tried as an alternative. He ignored the reasons I gave for placing these tags. Faced with no sources for the "is dated 430AD" claim, I altered the text to read "has been dated to c430AD" as per the cited sources, but Jaqeli simply reverted to the incorrect version. I have repeatedly tried my best to explain to him that "dated 430AD" is quite different from "dates from c430AD" used by the sources. His only response has been reverts and incivility. On Mesrop Mashtots he has repeatedly deleted referenced content and repeatedly refused to discuss his edits in the article's talk page. All he does is repeatedly state "per Georgian scripts". It has been very carefully explained to him that this "per Georgian scripts" explanation is not valid: editors cannot use talk page content on one article as a reason for not properly justifying content removal on a completely different article. Editors have directed him to the Wikipedia pages giving this advice, but he seems incapable of taking that advice or realising he is in the wrong. Because of his actions and attitudes it is impossible to engage productively with Jaqeli. Jaqeli has been topic banned before. When the ban was lifted it was on the condition that he would not return to edit warring and assuming bad faith on the part of others.[21] The diffs show he has broken that condition. They show he has also ignored his own assertion that he would, in future, "edit constructively, will not edit war and will discuss it in a calm and respectable manner".
Discussion concerning JaqeliStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by JaqeliStatement by (username)Result concerning JaqeliThis section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.
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Wickey-nl
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Request concerning Wickey-nl
- User who is submitting this request for enforcement
- Shrike (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 11:18, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
- User against whom enforcement is requested
- Wickey-nl (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log
- Sanction or remedy to be enforced
- Wikipedia:ARBPIA :
- Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
- 18 August 2014 Breach of the topic ban i.e talking about "hasbara network within Wikipedia", "Zionist sinners state" and "Gazacaust"
- Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
- 15 August 2014 Topic ban
- If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
- Previously given a discretionary sanction for conduct in the area of conflict on 15 August 2014 by Sandstein (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA).
- Additional comments by editor filing complaint
- Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested
Discussion concerning Wickey-nl
Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.
Statement by Wickey-nl
Statement by (username)
Result concerning Wickey-nl
This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.