→symbolic unblock request: OK, that's enough. Thanks for allowing it to be here for a few days, and for not removing my talk page access, although I wish Bwilkins responded my question. Still I thank him for posting. |
Jax the Great (talk | contribs) →Who owns Hitler?: new section |
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Allan <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Aburch11|Aburch11]] ([[User talk:Aburch11|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Aburch11|contribs]]) 01:51, 7 December 2011 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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== Who owns Hitler? == |
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This is pure vandalism, meant to annoy an arrogantly ignorant elitist admin named Gwen Gale. |
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Relax, we probably don’t know you, your name was probably on a list. You can disappear this, or some admin probably will, anyway. |
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If you want to contact us privately, you can try theplutonpack@gmail. Otherwise, we probably won’t bother you again. Thanx. |
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== "And pretend that he just doesn't see?" == |
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This is long, and mostly garbage, I expect almost no one to make it through. I hope that someone will skip down to the closing, though. |
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'''Admin abuse damaging an article?''' |
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The first part of this was posted in Jan 2011. There are two additional sections, one from Nov 2010, one from Mar 2011, and a closing. Sorry about the formatting, (losing Bold and Paragraphs): |
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Should Wm5200 be blocked? Here is some background, edited for length and with some words bold for emphasis. Please check the originals for accuracy. |
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Posted under Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler--random questions-- |
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I am not a scholar, I read Wiki but would not think of editing it. But I was disappointed in this article, and many points in the discussion, so I am asking some questions. Perhaps someone else will read and address them... 99.41.251.5 (talk) 01:27, 5 August 2010 (UTC) As to sources, the last books I have read are The Murder of Adolph Hitler by Hugh Thomas (sort of shaky) and The Last Days of Hitler by Anton Joachimsthaler (English translation, I buy much of this). |
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As the article lead says... This said, this talk page isn't a forum for talking about personal views or questions on a topic, it's meant for talking about sources and how to echo them in the text. I say this because the article seems to already cover, with thorough citations, most if not all of what you've brought up. Gwen Gale (talk) 09:45, 5 August 2010 (UTC) |
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I would like to direct people to the work of Ian Kershaw in general, and specifically to Hitler, 1939-1945: Nemesis ISBN 0393322521. Chapter 17 and the epilogue relate to this article. Please pay attention to his notes and sources. Be warned, his book Hitler: a Biography is a kind of digest which does not include these wonderful resources. |
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In view of this information, and hopefully with the help of Gwen, I propose edits similar to the following...Reference others may include Trevor-Roper and Beevor. Wm5200 (talk) 16:36, 7 August 2010 (UTC) |
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Posted under Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler--aftermath-- |
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The first paragraph...claims. Wm5200 (talk) 22:39, 9 August 2010 (UTC) |
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Everything in that section is sourced and/or highly verifiable. Gwen Gale (talk) 14:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC) |
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Have you read either Kershaw or Joachimsthaler? Wm5200 (talk) 14:42, 10 August 2010 (UTC) |
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Why do you ask? Gwen Gale (talk) 14:50, 10 August 2010 (UTC) |
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If I had read Kershaw's Nemesis Chapter 17 note 156 and Epilogue note 1 I wouldn't have wasted your time. You can't get much clearer than that. Should be required reading. Perhaps someone else should read them, and possibly edit the article. Thank you for your time.99.41.251.5 (talk) 17:48, 6 August 2010 (UTC) The source Joachimsthaler is basically an English translation of a German's analysis of 1950's post-Soviet interviews of bunker survivors. The original transcripts must be available somewhere. There are many other bunker interviews, some with questionable intent, and not all agree. Wm5200 (talk) 16:36, 7 August 2010 (UTC) I would like to direct people to the work of Ian Kershaw Hitler, 1939-1945: Nemesis ISBN 0393322521. Chapter 17 and the epilogue relate to this article. Please pay attention to his notes and sources. Be warned, his book Hitler: a Biography is a kind of digest which does not include these resources. In view of this information, I propose edits similar to the following:Wm5200 (talk) 14:55, 10 August 2010 (UTC) |
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Posted on Talk:Wm5200--Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler-- |
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Article talk pages are not meant as general forums or question boards about a topic. Moreover, they are not meant as outlets for your original thoughts on topics, even if you put those thoughts as questions. Please either start citing sources (along with thoughts about how to echo those sources in the text), or stop posting to Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler. If you would like to know more about how to deal with (and skirt) plagiarism worries on en.Wikipedia, you might have a look at Wikipedia:Plagiarism. Gwen Gale (talk) 20:31, 12 August 2010 (UTC) |
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'''Is this the way you were welcomed to Wiki?''' |
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'''Look at the talk page. Did Wm5200 bring up valid points? Did he attempt to reference them? Did he try to improve the article?''' |
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It is now January 2011. Wm5200 has been permanently blocked for trying to introduce Sir Ian Kershaw to Gwen Gale. Gwen Gale has collected more stars. Kierzek and Farawayman fixed up the article some, but still no Kershaw acknowledgment by Gwen Gale. |
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Is this how you think Wiki should work? Should Wm5200 be blocked from improving the article while Gwen Gale is rewarded for not assisting him? |
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Or should Wm5200’s block be reconsidered? |
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This is not about outing Gwen Gale, as some say. No one cares who Gwen Gale is. This is about holding her accountable for things she has said and done on Wikipedia and signed Gwen Gale to. Hiding behind those who have a real reason to hide is a bit hypocritical, don’t you think? |
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Does this conflict have political overtones? Wm5200 says “Cabal” and “they” and is ridiculed. But Farawayman has been blocked, and others have been intimidated. Be careful. |
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In November 2010, under the heading “Lead In”, the following was posted: |
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That greyfalcon source is indeed trash. Gwen Gale (talk) 17:21, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Going "with scholarly books" (that are balanced and objective, as far as secondary sources/authors can be) has always been my aim on Wiki; and as to this article, specially; Farawayman, who has worked hard of late, herein, I am sure would agree. "Time" and other duties are something that keeps many of us from more Wiki editing/writing and cross-checking at a more expedient rate. So, present what you will for consensus; there is plenty of "time". Cheers, Kierzek (talk) 19:05, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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I'm not offering [1] it as a source, Gwen. Only to demonstrate that a lot is floating out there. There's enough trash being passed off as sources in this article as it stands, without any more needing to be added. What the article especially needs to do is to bring forth that seventy years after the fact, the exact circumstances regarding the event remain uncertain and are contested. Naturally the scholarly "consensus" needs to be presented. The WP article on Hitler deals with the generalities regarding his death. This article needs to also deal with the subject's controversial nature. Not cigarette smoking. Dr. Dan (talk) 20:52, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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My main worry here is that there is utterly zero, aught evidence, that Hitler or Braun were alive after the late afternoon of 30 April 1945, however they died and the lead should steadfastly echo this, one way or another. Gwen Gale (talk) 21:13, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Gwen, maybe I am missing something.... the lead currently says "Adolf Hitler committed suicide by gunshot on 30 April 1945 in his Führerbunker in Berlin..." Surely that "steadfastly echo's" death on the 30th April. Why is it necessary to pertinently state that he was dead by the afternoon? Farawayman (talk) 21:37, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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For starters, the Russian autopsy bore overwhelming evidence he not only shot himself, but bit down on a cyanide capsule. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:02, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Slow down, one thing at a time!!!! Above, you insist the lead must "echo" that he was dead by the afternoon of the 30th. Explain? Farawayman (talk) 22:06, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Can you cite any meaningful sources that he was alive after that afternoon? Gwen Gale (talk) 22:28, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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I removed the Beevor quoted cite; per points stated above; not needed, anyway. With that said, as for hearing the shot, yes, the two you mentioned are on record as having heard it, but Günsche and Linge are on record as NOT hearing anything; although Linge has changed his story on that point. In the famous "The World At War" T.V. series on DVD (originally from the 1970's), Linge stated he heard it; but in his book on page 199, he wrote: "I smelt the gas from a discharged firearm...Hitler had shot himself in the right temple with his 7.65-mm pistol..." As for the evidence of the "Russian autopsy", that bears close scrutiny through the published works. Kierzek (talk) 22:24, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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WP:OR. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:28, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Gwen, I am not talking about "original research"; I am talking cross-checking and putting forth what the published reliable sources state; as I refer to above in my reply to Dr. Dan as to editing on Wiki and this article, in particular. Kierzek (talk) 22:38, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Whatever you may be talking about, I'm talking about your own original research. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:41, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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I am NOT doing OR; I am editing an article to try and improve it; enough said. Kierzek (talk) 22:59, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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So at the very least Gwen the circumstances shouldn't be "steadfastly echoed" as they currently are.correct?.70.28.7.229 (talk) 22:31, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Your rhetoric is lacking, IP. Please cite sources or stop now. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:33, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Gwen...... The lead says he was dead by the 30th! No-one is disputing that! Who said he was alive after the late afternoon of the 30th? I recommend a good Brunello, I'm having one too! Set this aside, and lets move to a thorough copy edit of the first section. Farawayman (talk) 22:39, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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All I'm saying is, I think the new lead is not on. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:41, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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That's what I'm saying.Why the hostility?.70.28.7.229 (talk) 22:49, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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Gwen, we had a grey, green, yellow, blue and dark blue (whatever) version of the lead in the above section! I agree its not perfect in terms of prose, but its factually correct! I concur, it needs polishing to make it read better, so why not give us your version - That's much more constructive. Farawayman (talk) 23:06, 11 November 2010 (UTC) |
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On 12 Mar 2011 , under the heading “When making large edits please be careful with citations: the following was posted: |
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(OD) While I agree ... This was further complicated by certain editors constantly preventing information that they objected to being placed in the article, which IMO, somewhat bordered on violating the guideline concerning ownership of a Wikipedia article. Rejecting information that was sourced and then demanding "sources" for information that was objectionable to them. Thankfully things have calmed down a bit. ... Dr. Dan (talk) 23:13, 12 March 2011 (UTC) |
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Closing. |
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Using “Dr. Dan (talk) 23:13, 12 March 2011 (UTC)” is not really fair, he does not name anyone. And neither he, Kierzek, or Farawayman have been contacted or informed of this post. Gwen, either. |
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Unblocking the Wheelman is a moot point, he’s long gone. But we do not see where Gwen has ever apologized to Dr Dan, Kierzek, or Farawayman, either. She was clearly counterproductive to the article, but there has been no sign of accountability. |
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This is hardly her first dispute. Does the average admin have this amount of conflict? |
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Thank you. |
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'''P.S.''' Clearly the above is outside the rules, we expect this account to be rolled up. But while you were ignoring us, another person posted the same kind of crap on our favorite admis’s talk page. And once the numbers change, we will be back. Power to the people, not the elite.[[User:Exwheelman5200|Exwheelman5200]] ([[User talk:Exwheelman5200|talk]]) 13:28, 8 November 2011 (UTC) |
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[[User:Jax the Great|Jax the Great]] ([[User talk:Jax the Great|talk]]) 18:13, 12 December 2011 (UTC) |
Revision as of 18:13, 12 December 2011
archives 1 |
Thanks for the inspiration!
Inspiration for real-life creativity award | |
Hey there! I saw your article, Dead Women Crossing, Oklahoma, on DYK a while back. My goal this summer has been to write six short plays, and your article proved to be an intriguing basis for the first of six that I wrote, aptly titled Dead Women Crossing. It turned out to be an exciting mystery, and though I changed many of the details and, in fact, assigned the blame for the crime to someone other than the person to whom the article assigned it, it still proved a very solid and mysterious basis in fact. I just wanted to give you props for starting the article that inspired this one-act. Thanks so much, and keep it up! BobAmnertiopsis∴ChatMe! 03:11, 23 July 2011 (UTC) |
- Thank you so much for letting me know my work was useful for you! It is the best award any wikipedia contributor could get. Good luck with your work.--Mbz1 (talk) 03:16, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
- You're so welcome. It was an intriguing article. BobAmnertiopsis∴ChatMe! 03:26, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
Blocked
Per your email request today, I've indefinitely blocked you. Take care, Rd232 talk 10:15, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Bluff erosion in Pacifica 2.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on July 26, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-07-26. howcheng {chat} 02:45, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
Congratulations
Congratulations on getting today's feature picture on the main page. I'm also sorry to see that you've allowed the bullies push you into despair to leave the project. You are a valued editor and have contributed more in several days than they have since they registered. I understand that you are leaving the project because of trolls and administrators that are acting on their behalf. I'm hoping to see you back when you are ready. --Shuki (talk) 06:19, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for kind words, Shuki! Actually I was going to leave the project for quite some time because I am busy in real life, and not because of trolls and wikihounds. Leaving the project because of trolls and their pet administrators acting on their requests means allow them to win. It is not for me. But you are right about trolls taking over the project. In June of 2005 RickK, who I believe was an administrator had this to say: "There is a fatal flaw in the system. Vandals, trolls and malactors are given respect, whereas those who are here to actually create an encyclopedia, and to do meaningful work, are slapped in the face and not given the support needed to do the work they need to do." It is sad that now in July of 2011 (6 years after it was said) I could sign under each statement RickK made. I also could sign under this comment that definitely is true concerning quite a few administrators: "The way you dish out blocks is worse than any admin I've ever seen, but you cannot or will not accept that there is a problem. You lack the judgement, and the thickness of skin, to do the job properly; you lack the compassion, humanity and humility to admit it when you fuck up". OK, I guess I'd better stop here :-) Best wishes, and happy editing to you,Shuki.--Mbz1 (talk) 17:47, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thanks for "compassion, humanity and humility"! I makes me sad to see the best leaving. Looks like I could have written my essay on "rejected" also for you, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:05, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for kind words,Gerda. I've just read some editor's contributions, and it made me sad seeing such interesting content contributor got so desperate that they decided to leave.It was very kind of you,Gerda, to be there for this person, when they needed some words of support. Best wishes, and happy editing.--Mbz1 (talk) 13:05, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thanks for "compassion, humanity and humility"! I makes me sad to see the best leaving. Looks like I could have written my essay on "rejected" also for you, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:05, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
Marvellous photos of natural optical phenomena
I just want to express my sincere gratitude to Mbz1 for making these fantastic photos of spectacular natural optical phenomena publicly available. I used her photos in two of my research papers published in professional scientific journals:
Mishchenko, M. I., 2009: Gustav Mie and the fundamental concept of electromagnetic scattering by particles: a perspective, J. Quant. Spectrosc. Radiat. Transfer 110, 1210-1222
Mishchenko, M. I., and L. D. Travis, 2008: Gustav Mie and the evolving discipline of electromagnetic scattering by particles, Bull. Amer. Meteorol. Soc. 89, 1853-1861
In both cases Mbz1's photos served as vivid illustrations of profound physical laws controlling the interaction of light with small cloud particles suspended in air. I hope Mbz1 will continue to make such photos and post them on the web -- this is a great service to both professional scientists, amateur researchers, and all admirers of nature.
MfD nomination of Wikipedia:The best way to avoid ever being blocked
This discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Wikipedia:The best way to avoid ever being blocked, a page you substantially contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:The best way to avoid ever being blocked and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of Wikipedia:The best way to avoid ever being blocked during the discussion but should not remove the miscellany for deletion template from the top of the page; such a removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. Nikthestoned 08:40, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
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Come back!
Come back! We need you! Your contributions were invaluable!♦ Dr. Blofeld 10:14, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for the kind words, but I am afraid that now after my blocking administrator has retired coming back for me would be quite impossible :-) On a more serious note I am busy in a real life. I might come back one day, but it will not be any time soon. Best wishes.--Mbz1 (talk) 15:44, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
notice
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Tarc (talk) 19:24, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
Mbz1, I've reblocked without talkpage access, as this breaches our informal email agreement on what sort of use of your talkpage while blocked is acceptable. Sorry, but there it is. On the bright side, you now have no excuse at all not to seek out greener pastures. Rd232 talk 19:38, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
- I have no idea why this prolific user would be denied talk page access for saying "trolls" with a pair of cartoons, while this edit summary raised no eyebrows, even as that editor seemed involved with some odd argument about moving around comments on this userpage which doubtless had some role in provoking this response. I'm just glad that Mbz1 and his exceptional photography are still welcome on Commons, which still remembers that content should always be the highest priority. Wnt (talk) 21:03, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
- Wnt, it is actually much worse than that. Do you rememberthis AfD? In your vote you commented on the personal attacks made against the author of the article mbz1. You said " Especially I ask that the ad hominem arguments against the editor who started the article be ignored - I've been running into a glut of these arguments with santorum, Marcus Bachmann, even Bernard Lewinsky ... they are perverting the whole AfD process into a series of political trials, where articles are judged based on "whose side" they were created for and which side can get out the vote as needed. ". Then a few days later an absolutely innocent essays Mbz1 wrote was nominated on deletion. The same user that attacked Mbz1 on AfD now comes to MfD with more personal attacks. When that user is asked by another user to elaborate what she meant, she simply ignores the question. A few hours later yet another user comes up to the same MfD with more personal attacks and more false accusations against mbz1 "This is not reflective of anything other than the personal opinion of one of the worst battleground- mentality pov-warriors to grace the I-P topic area in recent memory. Repeatedly blocked and now indef'ed, this last finger-in-the-eye to the Wikipedia community should not be left to stand." What that user is voting about? Does this humors essay has anything at all to do with I/P conflict not to say that all accusations of that user are very, very far from the reality. The vast majority of Mbz1's articles have nothing to do with I/P conflict, and the ones that do, well, what POV Mbz1 pushed with Allah Made Me Funny or with Yoni Jesner and Ahmed Khatib or with The Mountain of Israeli-Palestinian Friendship or with Arab rescue efforts during the Holocaust? Should I go on with this list? What other editor wrote such articles about the opposite side of the conflict?
- After Mbz1 is personally attacked a few times in the same MfD she responds to the attacks in the only place she was able to do it on her own talk page. One of the attackers takes her to AN, and bah her talk page access is removed without giving her an opportunity to say a single word in her defense. It is much worse than Kangaroo court. Now Mbz1's talk page access is removed and her attackers are not even warned. Way to go Wikipedia. Broccolo (talk) 16:34, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
- Mbz1 was blocked at her request, and as I said there was a private agreement not to use her talkpage while blocked for attacking other editors. Concurrently, it is very bad form to come to a blocked user's talkpage to attack them, so I hope there will be no more of that. But even concerned/interested comments like yours are not really necessary or helpful at this point. Those interested in talking to her can reach her at Commons, where her account is not blocked (though not currently active). Rd232 talk 10:22, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
- Hmmmm... Well, as someone who's had many, many POV differences with Mbz1, frankly I'd suggest her talkpage access ought to be restored. It seems to me that talkpage access being restricted is a rather extreme, "bind and gag" measure, which ought to be reserved for grossly disruptive behavior. Mbz1 may a persistent I-P warrior and the source of constant consternation, but this strikes me as pretty far from grossly disruptive behavior.
- Without trying to appear too critical of Rd232 - "private agreement"s are probably not the best way to operate, particularly in cases where the editor you're going into a "private agreement" with is often the source of wikilawyering. NickCT (talk) 13:18, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
Mbz1, talkpage restored. Please be very careful not to use it make comments which may be construed as attacks on other editors, regardless of what other editors are saying here or elsewhere. Rd232 talk 08:22, 4 August 2011 (UTC)
DYK for Arabic Mein Kampf
PanydThe muffin is not subtle 00:13, 4 August 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for an interesting article! It's now at Portal:Germany. I tell others editors: feel free to place DYK related to Germany there yourself. Feel free?! - I took your caring words above to my heart, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:32, 4 August 2011 (UTC)
Please come back in your own time
I do hope you will come back at some stage, Mbz1. You can be exasperating and high maintenance, and I get really annoyed with how volatile you get and with some of your politics. You are also magnificently off field and deliciously creative. If Wikipedia can't accommodate you, that is a really serious indictment of Wikipedia, not of you. --Epipelagic (talk) 14:07, 4 August 2011 (UTC)
- Yes, that's right, and then Jimbo complains wikipedia is loosing contributors. Broccolo (talk) 19:40, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Request permission to use image
Dear Sir/Madam,
I am writing on behalf of Singapore's National Parks Board. My company is right now at pre-production stage of a multimedia presentation, for the project "Gardens by the Bay" located in Marina South, Singapore. Gardens by the the Bay is a city garden and is currently under construction. Some key features and activities of the garden include conservatories for cool climate plants, mass floral displays showcasing horticulture and floriculture.
We are creating a video (comprising of various photos as well as stock footage of different events and happenings that are a result of climate change and global warming) aims to educate the public on global issues related to climate change. While researching online, I found a picture on this site (http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Glaciers_and_Icebergs_at_Cape_York.jpg) that is perfect for our purpose as we are looking at real untouched pics, documentary-like visuals. Thus I am writing you this email to seek your permission to use the picture.
This exhibition will be completed in June - Year 2012 and we hope you will have the opportunity to visit the site in the near future.
Hope to receive a reply from you soon : )
Jayne Multimedia People Pte Ltd Singapore — Preceding unsigned comment added by 119.75.202.48 (talk) 02:53, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
Great Photos!
I am a professor at the University of Montana Western in Dillon, and I am co-authoring the second edition of the Roadside Geology of the Yellowstone Country with Dr. William J. Fritz. I was searching the web for a photo of Grand Prismatic and found your pictures. The book we are publishing is through Mountain Press, and we do not have budget for purchasing photos. However, we appropriately credit all photos. I was wondering if it would be possible to use a few of your photos from Yellowstone in the book? Thanks for your consideration and I look forward to hearing back from you.
Cordially, Dr. Robert C. Thomas Professor of Geology The University of Montana Western
Well, it is time to say goodby
Image request
Dear Mila,
We are in the course of producing a series of two comprehension books for secondary students and would like to reproduce your picture 'Two silhouette profile or a white vase' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Two_silhouette_profile_or_a_white_vase.jpg in one of our books.
Details of our publication: Title: EnglishWise: Comprehension 1 and 2 Territory: Singapore Format: print (paperback) First print run: 3,000 copies Publication date: November 2011
Due acknowledgements will be provided. Thank you and we look forward to hearing from you soon.
Regards Louisa Mew Publishing Manager Learners Publishing Pte Ltd Address: 222 Tagore Lane #03-01 TG Building Singapore 787603 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.255.1.106 (talk) 02:10, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
Oh I am sorry you are gone
Hello Mila, If you read this, I am very sorry that you are not here anymore even a little. I very much enjoyed working with you on so many fascinating articles such as Fata Morgana, Earth's shadow and so on. Your photography is truly world-class and you seem to be interested in just about everything! I will miss you a lot. I am grateful to have known you a little bit. Feel free to email me if you ever want to. Invertzoo (talk) 22:33, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
- Me too. I've just come back from a wikibreak and I'm sorry to hear you've gone. Thanks for the many magnificent photos you've given us. I'm glad that retiring has made you feel better about your block log record, at least. Au revoir, Avenue (talk) 00:24, 12 August 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you, Susan, I will always be grateful for your help on many articles we wrote together!
New book
Dear Mila, I'd like to let you know that the book I used your image for is now announced at Springer:
The book is now at the designer and scheduled for release late October/November. Springer decided not to include the CD with the book as in the Norwegian version - but rather include the CD content on a dedicated webpage for download - what they call: Springer Extra's website. The content includes a lot of animations as well as a PPT version of the book contents. Very useful for lectures.
Read more here: http://www.springer.com/astronomy/extraterrestrial+physics%2C+space+sciences/book/978-1-4614-0570-2
Book flyer:
http://filer.romsenter.no/Clients/paal/flyer_the_sun.pdf
It will also be available from Amazon:
Sincerely, Pål Brekke Seniorrådgiver // Senior Advisor Norsk Romsenter // Norwegian Space Centre Drammensvn 165, N-0212 Oslo, Norway — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.109.105.231 (talk) 16:11, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
A kitten for you!
Just a little appreciation for your lovely work, and wish you luck in your life...
~ AdvertAdam talk 19:36, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you, they are so cute, and just what I need now :-)--Mbz1 (talk) 15:37, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
Puffer_Fish_DSC01257.JPG
Hi Mila
I am assisting Cheryll Williams with her book Medicinal Plants in Australia Vol3 and she would like to use your image of a Puffer Fish at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Puffer_Fish_DSC01257.JPG
in the volume If you agree please advise of the attribution that you require should the publisher use the image. We are a non-profit group supporting Daintree Wildlife Rescue in the Daintree Rainforest in North Queensland, Australia (daintreewildliferescue.webs.com) rgds
Ringpicker (talk) 00:38, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
use of an image of a solar glory in a textbook
Hi Mila,
I contacted you last month about using a solar glory image for a textbook being published by Pearson Science and I am working also on the newest edition of that book (the previous book was a reprint) and the author would like to use another photo of yours of a solar glory found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Solar_glory_at_the_steam_from_hot_spring.jpg
It says in the Creative Commons license that it is ok to make use of it as commercial work, but I just wanted to verify that.
This is the book info:
Atmosphere 12e Lutgens/Tarbuck ISBN: 0321756312 c. 2012
Thanks!
Kristin — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wanderlustphotos (talk • contribs) 14:14, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
SONNET: WHEN BULLIED TO HUMILIATE YOURSELF written by Proofreader77 for Mbz1
{MBZ.001.01} ____ WHEN BULLIED TO HUMILIATE YOURSELF |
We are the ones who're "trapped inside the door" and for you, Mila, who's locked outside the door here is a little bird of freedom File:Animalibrí.gif
September 11
Her dreams, they are as broken wing,
The song that she is not to sing,
Doorbell that never is to ring,
The winter in the middle of spring,
The child whom she would never hold,
The kiss that would be snowy cold,
The story that would stay untold,
The stars that she’s not to behold,
The flower that’s not to bloom,
The dance that’s never to resume,
The empty bed in empty room,
The never worn or smelled perfume,
The creek that’s not to reach the sea,
The sadness of root out tree,
The bird that never would fly free
From night that’s crying as banshee,
She could have put on bridal gown,
To marry guy who lives next door,
If only she would've made it down
From the one hundred second floor.
She’s gone, and now only pain
Pours rain as tears and tears as rain.
--Mbz1 (talk) 15:37, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Dead trees at Mammoth Hot Springs.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on September 15, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-09-15. howcheng {chat} 15:55, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
- Beautiful! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:47, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Development of Green Flash.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on October 10, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-10-10. howcheng {chat} 17:28, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
Hello Mila,
I recently stumbled across one of your photos attached to the Wikipedia article on Parallax. I was entranced. I must have stared at this work for at least ten minutes before I found myself clicking every link I could find to see if there were more. You ma'am, have a great talent. Thank you so much for doing what you do and allowing Wikipedia so share it so freely. It's folks like you that I'm grateful for in the world.
A twenty-minute old fan, Christina — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.5.138.215 (talk) 01:51, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
- Um... sorry... I think you've come to the wrong place. Mila just doesn't belong here... she's finally realized that and gone. We block inconvenient people like Mila and hound them til they leave. But if you yourself have no talent, take yourself tremendously seriously, and most profoundly detest anything that might be fun, creative or sparkling, then welcome, welcome, welcome, you have come home. --Epipelagic (talk) 03:43, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
- Yes, Epipelagic, you're correct. Mila is gone, bullied away by people with motives that are anything but pure, but she's still taking pictures and writing interesting and informative articles. Only now she's doing it in a much friendlier and more congenial environment. And there's one more difference. One now has to pay to read Mila's articles. Sad loss for Wikipedia. Sad loss for knowledge.--Jiujitsuguy (talk) 18:34, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
Image Request for Mila
Dear Mila,
I am a Producer on a programme for the National Geographic Channel about the sinking of the Titanic. We are currently trying to get hold of images of superior mirages and looming. I was very interested in one your photos, see below:
http://www.atoptics.co.uk/fz168.htm.
Is there any chance that I could get hold of this image for our programme? The Director would like to use it for filming this week if possible?
I very much look forward to hearing from you.
Kind regards,
Karen Kirk Bedlam Productions — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.143.254.50 (talk) 17:45, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
- Mila, you are everywhere. First BBC requested your image and now National Geographic Chanel did!
- Agree with Jiujitsuguy and Epipelagic, there's something wrong with Wikipedia community that bullied away such unique contributor as Mbz1.
- Please come back. Broccolo (talk) 21:19, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Mauna Loa from the air.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on October 13, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-10-13. howcheng {chat} 17:49, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:2010 mavericks competition.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on October 20, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-10-20. howcheng {chat} 16:35, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Carpilius convexus is consuming Heterocentrotus trigonarius in Hawaii.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on October 25, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-10-25. howcheng {chat} 17:52, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
Commercial use of a photograph of yours
Dear Ms. Zinkova:
I am about to publicize a website containing a photograph of yours, obtained through Wikimedia Commons. The end result is the following:
http://sites.google.com/site/aldoloup/home/not-all-that-glitters-is-ufo
The same page in Spanish, Portuguese and maybe other languages will follow. A printed version is envisioned too.
I want to be sure that you have no complaint about this use of your work. I really don't want to have problems over copyright issues down the road.
I want to thank for the opportunity to use your work in commercial ventures.
If you have any issue with this use of your work, please let me know immediately.
I am acting in good faith, in the firm belief that the license for commercial use that appears in the Wikimedia Commons page of your photograph is completely valid, accurate and current.
Thank you very much.
Aldo Loup.
aldoloup@hotmail.com — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.16.8.119 (talk) 19:49, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
Miss you
I hope you are doing well. I miss you. Invertzoo (talk) 18:44, 31 October 2011 (UTC)
- Hi Susan, thank you for this post! It is very kind of you to miss me after all extra boring copy-editing work I was asking you to do, when I was around :-)
- I do miss you too.
- It is interesting that I saw your post today, when I logged in for the first time since September 11, and I did it to communicate with you, Susan.
- I would like to ask you for a favor please. It is about this article.
- I was asked to read an article about mirages that is going to be published in a serious journal,and provide my expert :-) opinion on some images and so on. One of the images used in the article is this image.
- I have no idea what I was thinking of, when I provided the description for it as "Superior mirage of the boats". This image does not depict a realistic phenomena or as Dr. Andy Young put it: "It does not realistically depict actual phenomena -- except maybe psychological ones".
- The first problem is that the mirage of the right yacht is much longer than the real yacht herself is. Mirages never change the length of the objects. The distortion always occurs only in a vertical direction.
- The second problem is that both mirages depicted too high above the horizon. It is never like this in a real life. The mirages are seen only in a narrow strip (duct) just above the horizon.
- So to make a long story short, it was an unforgivable error I made, when I put such description as I did for this image. I should have known better.
- The only thing that makes me feel better is that even some scientists sometimes get it wrong.I've been doing lot's of reading about mirages lately, and came upon this article published by Cambridge University Press. As you see it claims that mermen and mermaids described by 13 century navigators in the King's Mirror are nothing else but superior mirages of orcas, walrus or even boulders. It is definitely an interesting suggestion that might even have some grounds, except one cannot see a superior mirage of an orca, maybe an inferior mirage, but not a superior one. A breaching orca is still way too small to see him from the distance required for seeing a superior mirage.
- So, Susan, could you please fix the description of the image itself, and maybe in the article too to make it very clear for everybody that it is not a realistic superior mirage.
- Thank you and best wishes.--Mbz1 (talk) 04:51, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
- Oh, Hi Mila, sorry it took me weeks to get back to you, I only just now saw that you had replied to me! I went ahead and changed both the description and the caption in the article. I hope that what I wrote seems OK to you now. All very best wishes to you, Invertzoo (talk) 14:29, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
Per your request
By your email request I reviewed this post and I would agree that Daedalus's posting to Gwen's talk page could be taken as campaigning because it wasn't neutral (i.e. actively asking for a block). It would have been better for Daedalus to post to the ANI discussion that was happening at that time (which would be the case in all such situations). Given that, it may not have been the best decision for Gwen to block you; that decision may have better been left to another admin for transparency. Thanks, Black Kite (t) 01:40, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for your honest review and for being not afraid to say it publicly, Black Kite!
Mbz1 (talk) 03:45, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Mercury transit 2.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on November 7, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-11-07. howcheng {chat} 19:57, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
POTD notification
Hi Mila,
Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Kohala coast at the Big Island of Hawaii from the air levels.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on November 11, 2011. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2011-11-11. howcheng {chat} 01:19, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
Use Request
I work with Golden Gate National Parks Conservancy, an environmental nonprofit that supports the work of the National Park Service at Golden Gate National Recreation Area.
Among other activities, we produce park-related products and publications. We're now working on products for the new Lands End Lookout, a visitor center at Merrie Way, near the Cliff House.
One of the products, which will also appear as part of a Visitor Center exhibit, is a set of "fortunetelling" cards: on one side of each card will be an illustration and on the other is a photo of an individual Lands End attraction, along with a short fortune.
We'd like to use your photo of Ocean Beach and the Cliff House (posted on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cliff_House_from_Ocean_Beach.jpg) on one of the cards. The cards are vertical, so we'd need to crop it somewhat.
I see that you've allowed the photo's use under the Creative Commons license, but thought it would be a good idea to check in with you directly as well. We will, of course, credit you on the card.
May we proceed?
Susan Tasaki — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.226.227.200 (talk) 21:07, 11 November 2011 (UTC)
Your Photo
Dear Ms. Zinkova,
I am a production assistant at Singularity, LLC. We are producing a documentary film about the end of the Mayan Calendar on 12/21/2012. You can our trailer on You Tube at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROlI86ukGmM
We would like to use your image from the link below in our film. We believe that you have copyright to this image. If you do not, could you possibly reference us to its source? If you do hold copyright, could we have your permission to use it in our film? If so please reply indicating we can use the image, and as well, please let us know how we should attribute the credits. Thanks in advance.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Dry_lake_bed_in_Death_Valley.JPG
Sincerely, -Emma Paul — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.22.15.219 (talk) 21:54, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
Image use
Hello Mila,
We'd like to use your images of solar glories and fogbows for a slide show on Scientific American's web site. I hope you do not mind. Please let me know if you need any further information.
Sincerely,
Monica Bradley
Photo Editor
Scientific American — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.199.186.2 (talk) 22:41, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Impressive, how real magazines ask for your photos, girl!
And to think I got you to take a geeky science one also!
Hey, could you start a WR thread on a presentation I wrote? Put it in the Annex so that meanie Glassbead does not shit on it. (should they put the whole forum in the annex...like some Klein bottle?) But am interested in what more quantitative ones like Peter Damian and Kohs and the like think. Also, there is a lot of institutional memory there, so if this was all done years ago...they will know. I don't have an account there and they seem really harsh with all the outing and stuff. Sorry, no hot pictures for Horsey.
See here: PowerPoint: Wikipedia's poor treatment of its most important articles
69.255.27.249 (talk) 15:57, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for commenting on my images.
- I believe WR thread was started by someone else. Sorry I check on my talk page here only once in a while now.
- Good luck with your struggle.--Mbz1 (talk) 20:22, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
For Mila
Just saying thanks for all the pretty pictures. If I had photos of that quality, I'd never have the selflessness to upload them for Wikipedia. Nightw 13:44, 27 November 2011 (UTC) |
- Thank you, Night w!
- But me uploading images on wikipedia has nothing to do with selflessness. To me the best award for my images is an ability to share them with as many people as possible. I love taking pictures, and most of the time quality is of a little importance to me. For example one of my favorite subjects are mirages. It is hard to take a good image of a superior mirage because it always located far away, and in my city it is almost always against the sun. These images will not pass FPC, but, if some people learned something new from my images, and maybe became enthusiastic about looking for an amazing display themselves, it means that the time I spent on wikipedia was not wasted.
- I am still taking images, but now without ability to edit wikipedia, I am looking for a different venues to share them. A few weeks ago I observed an interesting mirage, and I submitted my image to EPOD.
- Thank you once again for your kind words!
- Happy editing!--Mbz1 (talk) 20:36, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
- Wow I just realised, I've seen your mirage work before on the Fata Morgana article! But I was more referring to the kind of work seen on your userpage. Do you have a Flickr account? It's one of the main hunting grounds for contributions to photography and natural science publications... Nightw 04:36, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you. As a matter of fact user:Invertzoo and me were the ones who completely re-wrote the article. From many images that are used in the article I believe this one is one of the most interesting. I saw this kind of display only two times, two days in a row. I was surprised to find out that This effect was first described in the medieval King's Mirror like this "hafgerdingar look as if all the storm-waves of the sea were gathered together in three continuous combers; the three wavecrests surround the whole sea in such a way that there is no escape (opening) ; they are higher than big mountains and as steep as precipices, so that in but few cases have people escaped from the sea when this has occurred." It is amazing that medieval explorers saw and described it. I assume it looked really scary to them.
- I have Flickr account, but I forgot, when I used it the last time.
- Best wishes.--Mbz1 (talk) 20:20, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
- Wow I just realised, I've seen your mirage work before on the Fata Morgana article! But I was more referring to the kind of work seen on your userpage. Do you have a Flickr account? It's one of the main hunting grounds for contributions to photography and natural science publications... Nightw 04:36, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
So here it is
- 'Would you tell me, please, which way I ought to go from here?'
'That depends a good deal on where you want to get to,' said the Cat.
'I don't much care where —' said Alice.
'Then it doesn't matter which way you go,' said the Cat
- 'But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
'Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: 'we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
'How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
'You must be,' said the Cat, 'or you wouldn't have come here.'
Request image use
Mila,
I work for a company that designs and fabricates natural history museum exhibits. We are currently working on an exhibit that will illustrate biodiversity. It will require a large photo mural of a tide pool. I happened upon your image http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/74/Tide_pools_in_santa_cruz.jpg via a web search .
Our mural will be about 28 ft. wide x 9 ft. high.
1) What usage fee would you charge to have your tide pool image reproduced at that size as part of a museum exhibit? 2) In what format does the image exist (4x5 transparency, high-resolution digital image...)?
Please let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks for your time.
Allan Burch — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aburch11 (talk • contribs) 01:23, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
- Wow! 28 ft. wide x 9 ft. high! It is definitely going to be the biggest image of mine ever get printed.
- Alan, thank you for your request. Please use my image for the museum for free. No fees are required.
- Cheers.--Mbz1 (talk) 01:36, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Thanks very much for your time, Mila, and for the generous use of your beautiful image. I'm sure it will be educational and very well-received by audiences around the world.
Thanks, again.
Allan — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aburch11 (talk • contribs) 01:51, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Who owns Hitler?
This is pure vandalism, meant to annoy an arrogantly ignorant elitist admin named Gwen Gale. Relax, we probably don’t know you, your name was probably on a list. You can disappear this, or some admin probably will, anyway. If you want to contact us privately, you can try theplutonpack@gmail. Otherwise, we probably won’t bother you again. Thanx.
"And pretend that he just doesn't see?"
This is long, and mostly garbage, I expect almost no one to make it through. I hope that someone will skip down to the closing, though.
Admin abuse damaging an article?
The first part of this was posted in Jan 2011. There are two additional sections, one from Nov 2010, one from Mar 2011, and a closing. Sorry about the formatting, (losing Bold and Paragraphs):
Should Wm5200 be blocked? Here is some background, edited for length and with some words bold for emphasis. Please check the originals for accuracy.
Posted under Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler--random questions--
I am not a scholar, I read Wiki but would not think of editing it. But I was disappointed in this article, and many points in the discussion, so I am asking some questions. Perhaps someone else will read and address them... 99.41.251.5 (talk) 01:27, 5 August 2010 (UTC) As to sources, the last books I have read are The Murder of Adolph Hitler by Hugh Thomas (sort of shaky) and The Last Days of Hitler by Anton Joachimsthaler (English translation, I buy much of this).
As the article lead says... This said, this talk page isn't a forum for talking about personal views or questions on a topic, it's meant for talking about sources and how to echo them in the text. I say this because the article seems to already cover, with thorough citations, most if not all of what you've brought up. Gwen Gale (talk) 09:45, 5 August 2010 (UTC)
I would like to direct people to the work of Ian Kershaw in general, and specifically to Hitler, 1939-1945: Nemesis ISBN 0393322521. Chapter 17 and the epilogue relate to this article. Please pay attention to his notes and sources. Be warned, his book Hitler: a Biography is a kind of digest which does not include these wonderful resources.
In view of this information, and hopefully with the help of Gwen, I propose edits similar to the following...Reference others may include Trevor-Roper and Beevor. Wm5200 (talk) 16:36, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
Posted under Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler--aftermath--
The first paragraph...claims. Wm5200 (talk) 22:39, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
Everything in that section is sourced and/or highly verifiable. Gwen Gale (talk) 14:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
Have you read either Kershaw or Joachimsthaler? Wm5200 (talk) 14:42, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
Why do you ask? Gwen Gale (talk) 14:50, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
If I had read Kershaw's Nemesis Chapter 17 note 156 and Epilogue note 1 I wouldn't have wasted your time. You can't get much clearer than that. Should be required reading. Perhaps someone else should read them, and possibly edit the article. Thank you for your time.99.41.251.5 (talk) 17:48, 6 August 2010 (UTC) The source Joachimsthaler is basically an English translation of a German's analysis of 1950's post-Soviet interviews of bunker survivors. The original transcripts must be available somewhere. There are many other bunker interviews, some with questionable intent, and not all agree. Wm5200 (talk) 16:36, 7 August 2010 (UTC) I would like to direct people to the work of Ian Kershaw Hitler, 1939-1945: Nemesis ISBN 0393322521. Chapter 17 and the epilogue relate to this article. Please pay attention to his notes and sources. Be warned, his book Hitler: a Biography is a kind of digest which does not include these resources. In view of this information, I propose edits similar to the following:Wm5200 (talk) 14:55, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
Posted on Talk:Wm5200--Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler--
Article talk pages are not meant as general forums or question boards about a topic. Moreover, they are not meant as outlets for your original thoughts on topics, even if you put those thoughts as questions. Please either start citing sources (along with thoughts about how to echo those sources in the text), or stop posting to Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler. If you would like to know more about how to deal with (and skirt) plagiarism worries on en.Wikipedia, you might have a look at Wikipedia:Plagiarism. Gwen Gale (talk) 20:31, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
Is this the way you were welcomed to Wiki?
Look at the talk page. Did Wm5200 bring up valid points? Did he attempt to reference them? Did he try to improve the article?
It is now January 2011. Wm5200 has been permanently blocked for trying to introduce Sir Ian Kershaw to Gwen Gale. Gwen Gale has collected more stars. Kierzek and Farawayman fixed up the article some, but still no Kershaw acknowledgment by Gwen Gale.
Is this how you think Wiki should work? Should Wm5200 be blocked from improving the article while Gwen Gale is rewarded for not assisting him?
Or should Wm5200’s block be reconsidered?
This is not about outing Gwen Gale, as some say. No one cares who Gwen Gale is. This is about holding her accountable for things she has said and done on Wikipedia and signed Gwen Gale to. Hiding behind those who have a real reason to hide is a bit hypocritical, don’t you think?
Does this conflict have political overtones? Wm5200 says “Cabal” and “they” and is ridiculed. But Farawayman has been blocked, and others have been intimidated. Be careful.
In November 2010, under the heading “Lead In”, the following was posted:
That greyfalcon source is indeed trash. Gwen Gale (talk) 17:21, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Going "with scholarly books" (that are balanced and objective, as far as secondary sources/authors can be) has always been my aim on Wiki; and as to this article, specially; Farawayman, who has worked hard of late, herein, I am sure would agree. "Time" and other duties are something that keeps many of us from more Wiki editing/writing and cross-checking at a more expedient rate. So, present what you will for consensus; there is plenty of "time". Cheers, Kierzek (talk) 19:05, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I'm not offering [1] it as a source, Gwen. Only to demonstrate that a lot is floating out there. There's enough trash being passed off as sources in this article as it stands, without any more needing to be added. What the article especially needs to do is to bring forth that seventy years after the fact, the exact circumstances regarding the event remain uncertain and are contested. Naturally the scholarly "consensus" needs to be presented. The WP article on Hitler deals with the generalities regarding his death. This article needs to also deal with the subject's controversial nature. Not cigarette smoking. Dr. Dan (talk) 20:52, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
My main worry here is that there is utterly zero, aught evidence, that Hitler or Braun were alive after the late afternoon of 30 April 1945, however they died and the lead should steadfastly echo this, one way or another. Gwen Gale (talk) 21:13, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Gwen, maybe I am missing something.... the lead currently says "Adolf Hitler committed suicide by gunshot on 30 April 1945 in his Führerbunker in Berlin..." Surely that "steadfastly echo's" death on the 30th April. Why is it necessary to pertinently state that he was dead by the afternoon? Farawayman (talk) 21:37, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
For starters, the Russian autopsy bore overwhelming evidence he not only shot himself, but bit down on a cyanide capsule. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:02, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Slow down, one thing at a time!!!! Above, you insist the lead must "echo" that he was dead by the afternoon of the 30th. Explain? Farawayman (talk) 22:06, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Can you cite any meaningful sources that he was alive after that afternoon? Gwen Gale (talk) 22:28, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I removed the Beevor quoted cite; per points stated above; not needed, anyway. With that said, as for hearing the shot, yes, the two you mentioned are on record as having heard it, but Günsche and Linge are on record as NOT hearing anything; although Linge has changed his story on that point. In the famous "The World At War" T.V. series on DVD (originally from the 1970's), Linge stated he heard it; but in his book on page 199, he wrote: "I smelt the gas from a discharged firearm...Hitler had shot himself in the right temple with his 7.65-mm pistol..." As for the evidence of the "Russian autopsy", that bears close scrutiny through the published works. Kierzek (talk) 22:24, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
WP:OR. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:28, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Gwen, I am not talking about "original research"; I am talking cross-checking and putting forth what the published reliable sources state; as I refer to above in my reply to Dr. Dan as to editing on Wiki and this article, in particular. Kierzek (talk) 22:38, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Whatever you may be talking about, I'm talking about your own original research. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:41, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I am NOT doing OR; I am editing an article to try and improve it; enough said. Kierzek (talk) 22:59, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
So at the very least Gwen the circumstances shouldn't be "steadfastly echoed" as they currently are.correct?.70.28.7.229 (talk) 22:31, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Your rhetoric is lacking, IP. Please cite sources or stop now. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:33, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Gwen...... The lead says he was dead by the 30th! No-one is disputing that! Who said he was alive after the late afternoon of the 30th? I recommend a good Brunello, I'm having one too! Set this aside, and lets move to a thorough copy edit of the first section. Farawayman (talk) 22:39, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
All I'm saying is, I think the new lead is not on. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:41, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
That's what I'm saying.Why the hostility?.70.28.7.229 (talk) 22:49, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Gwen, we had a grey, green, yellow, blue and dark blue (whatever) version of the lead in the above section! I agree its not perfect in terms of prose, but its factually correct! I concur, it needs polishing to make it read better, so why not give us your version - That's much more constructive. Farawayman (talk) 23:06, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
On 12 Mar 2011 , under the heading “When making large edits please be careful with citations: the following was posted:
(OD) While I agree ... This was further complicated by certain editors constantly preventing information that they objected to being placed in the article, which IMO, somewhat bordered on violating the guideline concerning ownership of a Wikipedia article. Rejecting information that was sourced and then demanding "sources" for information that was objectionable to them. Thankfully things have calmed down a bit. ... Dr. Dan (talk) 23:13, 12 March 2011 (UTC)
Closing.
Using “Dr. Dan (talk) 23:13, 12 March 2011 (UTC)” is not really fair, he does not name anyone. And neither he, Kierzek, or Farawayman have been contacted or informed of this post. Gwen, either.
Unblocking the Wheelman is a moot point, he’s long gone. But we do not see where Gwen has ever apologized to Dr Dan, Kierzek, or Farawayman, either. She was clearly counterproductive to the article, but there has been no sign of accountability.
This is hardly her first dispute. Does the average admin have this amount of conflict?
Thank you.
P.S. Clearly the above is outside the rules, we expect this account to be rolled up. But while you were ignoring us, another person posted the same kind of crap on our favorite admis’s talk page. And once the numbers change, we will be back. Power to the people, not the elite.Exwheelman5200 (talk) 13:28, 8 November 2011 (UTC)
Jax the Great (talk) 18:13, 12 December 2011 (UTC)