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==NPA request== |
==NPA request== |
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[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3ALaRouche_movement&action=historysubmit&diff=452763014&oldid=452750569] Please don't make any further personal attacks on the LaRouche movement talk page. [[User:Cla68|Cla68]] ([[User talk:Cla68|talk]]) 23:49, 27 September 2011 (UTC) |
[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3ALaRouche_movement&action=historysubmit&diff=452763014&oldid=452750569] Please don't make any further personal attacks on the LaRouche movement talk page. [[User:Cla68|Cla68]] ([[User talk:Cla68|talk]]) 23:49, 27 September 2011 (UTC) |
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:For what it's worth, the debating approach you appear to be taking on that talk page is ''argumentum ad hominem''. I don't think that approach is helpful in a collaborative model such as Wikipedia. [[User:Cla68|Cla68]] ([[User talk:Cla68|talk]]) 00:50, 28 September 2011 (UTC) |
Revision as of 00:50, 28 September 2011
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Your e-mail
Received, I did think that might be the case. Mjroots (talk) 10:57, 3 September 2011 (UTC)
Talkback
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Message added 04:25, 10 September 2011 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.
Mtking (edits) 04:25, 10 September 2011 (UTC)
talkback
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Templating my talk page
I appreciate your concern and I'm well aware of 3R rule. But in the future, could you please not template my talk page as it can be perceived as an aggressive gesture Wikipedia:Edit_warring#Handling_of_edit_warring_behaviors. We have interacted long enough that I hope you would be comfortable enough to just leave a note. Thanks. danielkueh (talk) 01:15, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- On the contrary, you have reverted three times in the space of less than 12 hours. If you revert a fourth time and a report is made on WP:AN3, it is a requirement that you should have been notified. The template is standard. The passage you cite concerning warnings about edit warring applies to those involved in the edit war, if you read it carefully. If you check, my two edits to the article "evolution" were on 24 and 30 August. I am not editing the article at the moment, but I have made one comment on the talk page recently. Please stop posting aggressive messages on my user talk page. Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 01:38, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- The passage I cited includes, "Consider writing your own note to the user specifically appropriate for the situation, with a view to explicitly cooling things down." In any event, I obviously failed to get through to you. Oh well. Have a nice life. danielkueh (talk) 01:55, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- I agree that it is good style not to template the regulars, but post personal messages. ·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 02:00, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- Maunus, after 3 reverts by Danielkueh, you should have posted some kind of explicit warning yourself about edit warring instead of just using an edit summary.[1] Danielkueh, please could you stay away from my talk page if you feel you need to resort to thinly veiled saracsm ("Have a nice life"). Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 02:14, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- I agree that it is good style not to template the regulars, but post personal messages. ·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 02:00, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
- The passage I cited includes, "Consider writing your own note to the user specifically appropriate for the situation, with a view to explicitly cooling things down." In any event, I obviously failed to get through to you. Oh well. Have a nice life. danielkueh (talk) 01:55, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
Article on Swami Budhpuri Ji rewritten
Hi Mathsci, the concerned article has been rewritten. Your review is awaited. Please visit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Swami_Budhpuri_Ji/Temp and give your suggestions for possible improvements...thanks...Svechu (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 09:02, 22 September 2011 (UTC).
Context is everything
I noticed your complaint at the Arbcom enforcement page about Malleus, and I also noticed you had mentioned me there, without providing any diffs. Were you aware of this comment from MONGO from 5 September? If not it might be worth looking at it and considering amending your statement in light of this evidence that at least one (prominent and previously-sanctioned) American editor has started the ball rolling in the nationalism stakes. MONGO has never properly explained what exactly he was on about there, but it seems ridiculous to threaten Malleus with sanctions but not mention the antecedent behavior. Regarding my own behavior there, I have found the degree of resistance of the "Defenders of the Wiki" crowd to an article assessment process (that they themselves invited) quite frustrating at times, but I hope that if you feel anything I said there crossed the line, you would have the courtesy to raise it with me in the first instance rather than on an enforcement page. Thanks for your consideration. --John (talk) 05:02, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- I removed any reference to you despite this diff in your response to MF.[2] I'm sure you meant the US government there which is why I put the comment in parentheses. I think your own editing on Talk:September 11 attacks has been exemplary. I haven't looked at any comments on your talk page. But if you have evidence that there is editor bias or bullying related to the article following the request for a GAR, the best idea is probably to present that yourself, particularly if it's spread over several wikipedia pages. Mathsci (talk) 05:59, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for that, I appreciate it. The diff you mention took place during a discussion about the cultural sensitivities around the topic of 9/11, started by Karanacs' proposed new structure for the article, my suggestion of redrafting the article, MONGO "we're not going to marginalize the event itself with a slurry of POV pushing background junk", Karanacs "implies to me that there is an unstated goal here of presenting a non-POV article; one that offers Proper Memorialization and shows the accepted US POV." MF agreed and so did (and do) I, that this is a problem with improving the article. It shouldn't be outrageous in the context of discussing that article to discuss the very strong emotional grip that this event still has (indeed I would argue for including it in the article, but that's another story). You are right however to make the distinction between US government and "American"; that is something I would rephrase another time. Thank you for taking the time to examine this and I hope you might feel able to help out if we are ever to move this matter forwards; the article feels like it has been stuck since about 2006, and I hope Karanacs' and Malleus's comments in their different ways will help to move us on. I wouldn't be putting time into it if I didn't feel there was some chance of ending up with an improved article on this important topic. Meantime, MONGO continues to vent on another editor's talk page. I really think that if there is to be Arbcom enforcement it should start with him. But that, too, is another story. --John (talk) 07:05, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Is there a US POV? From a UK perspective there are the Lockerbie bombing and the 7 July 2005 London bombings. Although disasters on quite different scales, the way the three articles are written should not be vastly different, if it's possible to be objective. I don't normally edit current affairs articles, although I did help a little on the Sheffield incest case. Mathsci (talk) 08:08, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Yes, that would be my stance too. These type of events are very jarring and produce great waves of emotion around them, making it difficult sometimes to hit the right tone. Of the articles you mention, I've done quite a lot on the first one and only a little on the second. Neither is a GA or an FA but to me they get the tone about right. I think (and multiple other reviewers at the GAR agree) that the 9/11 article takes too "official" a tone and does not adequately explore things like alternative theories, antecedents and consequences. Both the UK articles you mention do this (arguably do it too much), but the 9/11 article does not do it at all. Off to look at the incest one now, I am not even familiar with that story. --John (talk) 08:21, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Wow, it's a horrible story, but a very nice article. --John (talk) 08:34, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Having read the current GA reassessment, my personal view is that the regular editors on the article at the moment are not being reasonable about adding some mention of conspiracy theories in the article. If a serious book devotes 3 or 4 pages to describing and dismissing them, wikipedia editors should be able to craft a short paragraph summarising that content without entering into detail about individual theories. Wikilawyering against the inclusion of non-trivial content in secondary sources is against core policy. The recent flair up, which hopefully has now subsided, seems to have been a result of regular editors' unwillingness to yield this point combined with Malleus' overreaction. Matters will calm down once EyeSerene closes the GA reassessment, although it is hard to say whether it will help solve any of the outstanding problems with the article pointed out by Geometry Guy. Mathsci (talk) 16:45, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Is there a US POV? From a UK perspective there are the Lockerbie bombing and the 7 July 2005 London bombings. Although disasters on quite different scales, the way the three articles are written should not be vastly different, if it's possible to be objective. I don't normally edit current affairs articles, although I did help a little on the Sheffield incest case. Mathsci (talk) 08:08, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
- Thank you for that, I appreciate it. The diff you mention took place during a discussion about the cultural sensitivities around the topic of 9/11, started by Karanacs' proposed new structure for the article, my suggestion of redrafting the article, MONGO "we're not going to marginalize the event itself with a slurry of POV pushing background junk", Karanacs "implies to me that there is an unstated goal here of presenting a non-POV article; one that offers Proper Memorialization and shows the accepted US POV." MF agreed and so did (and do) I, that this is a problem with improving the article. It shouldn't be outrageous in the context of discussing that article to discuss the very strong emotional grip that this event still has (indeed I would argue for including it in the article, but that's another story). You are right however to make the distinction between US government and "American"; that is something I would rephrase another time. Thank you for taking the time to examine this and I hope you might feel able to help out if we are ever to move this matter forwards; the article feels like it has been stuck since about 2006, and I hope Karanacs' and Malleus's comments in their different ways will help to move us on. I wouldn't be putting time into it if I didn't feel there was some chance of ending up with an improved article on this important topic. Meantime, MONGO continues to vent on another editor's talk page. I really think that if there is to be Arbcom enforcement it should start with him. But that, too, is another story. --John (talk) 07:05, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
NPA request
[3] Please don't make any further personal attacks on the LaRouche movement talk page. Cla68 (talk) 23:49, 27 September 2011 (UTC)