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:Above, I twice invited you to discuss your concerns at [[WT:WikiProject Israel|WikiProject Israel]] and [[WT:WikiProject Palestine|WikiProject Palestine]]. [[User:Goalie1998|Goalie1998]] invited you to discuss them at [[Talk:Proposals for a Palestinian state]]. |
:Above, I twice invited you to discuss your concerns at [[WT:WikiProject Israel|WikiProject Israel]] and [[WT:WikiProject Palestine|WikiProject Palestine]]. [[User:Goalie1998|Goalie1998]] invited you to discuss them at [[Talk:Proposals for a Palestinian state]]. |
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:When I told you I had no interest in debating with you, I meant that I will not respond to your arguments about article content on my Talk page. You have been pointed to three more appropriate places to have that discussion, places where other editors can contribute. Please take your concerns to one (or more) of them. — [[User:Malik Shabazz|Malik Shabazz]] <sup>[[User talk:Malik Shabazz|Talk]]</sup>/<sub>[[Special:Contributions/Malik Shabazz|Stalk]]</sub> 23:18, 3 July 2015 (UTC) |
:When I told you I had no interest in debating with you, I meant that I will not respond to your arguments about article content on my Talk page. You have been pointed to three more appropriate places to have that discussion, places where other editors can contribute. Please take your concerns to one (or more) of them. — [[User:Malik Shabazz|Malik Shabazz]] <sup>[[User talk:Malik Shabazz|Talk]]</sup>/<sub>[[Special:Contributions/Malik Shabazz|Stalk]]</sub> 23:18, 3 July 2015 (UTC) |
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=== Re: ARBPIA & Proposals for a Palestinian state === |
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Dear Malik, |
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In regard to the page [[Proposals for a Palestinian state]] you are to be seen as an '''involved''' admin, because you edited it since at least January 2011, or longer. Please see: [[WP:ARBPIA]] alert.<br/><u>FYI:</u><br/> |
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{{Ivm|2=''This message contains important information about an administrative situation on Wikipedia. It does '''not''' imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date.'' |
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'''Please carefully read this information:''' |
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The Arbitration Committee has authorised [[Wikipedia:Arbitration Committee/Discretionary sanctions|discretionary sanctions]] to be used for pages regarding the [[Arab–Israeli conflict]], a topic which you have edited. The Committee's decision is [[Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Palestine-Israel articles|here]]. |
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Discretionary sanctions is a system of conduct regulation designed to minimize disruption to controversial topics. This means [[WP:INVOLVED|uninvolved]] administrators can impose sanctions for edits relating to the topic that do not adhere to the [[Wikipedia:Five pillars|purpose of Wikipedia]], our [[:Category:Wikipedia conduct policies|standards of behavior]], or relevant [[Wikipedia:List of policies|policies]]. Administrators may impose sanctions such as [[Wikipedia:Editing restrictions#Types of restrictions|editing restrictions]], [[Wikipedia:Banning policy#Types of bans|bans]], or [[WP:Blocking policy|blocks]]. This message is to notify you sanctions are authorised for the topic you are editing. Before continuing to edit this topic, please familiarise yourself with the discretionary sanctions system. Don't hesitate to contact me or another editor if you have any questions.}}{{Z33}}<!-- Derived from Template:Ds/alert --> |
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--[[User:Miraclexix|Miraclexix]] ([[User talk:Miraclexix|talk]]) 10:58, 8 July 2015 (UTC) |
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== ''The Signpost'': 01 July 2015 == |
== ''The Signpost'': 01 July 2015 == |
Revision as of 11:18, 8 July 2015
This page has archives. Sections older than 5 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 2 sections are present. |
Source validity & reverts
Hi Malik, I seem to be having an issue with another editor that continues to revert and delete sourced material in favor of his wording, here, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_George Lazyfoxx (talk) 15:05, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
- Malik, please read the full discussion between Lazyfoxx and myself here, here and here. If you could provide a third opinion here I would very much appreciate it. Cheers, — Cliftonian (talk) 15:28, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Lazyfoxx and Cliftonian. I'll review the background and get back to you over the next couple of days. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 02:33, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks Malik. — Cliftonian (talk) 02:35, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
- I did not delete reliable sources. On each occasion I replaced the two source footnotes Lazyfoxx added with a larger bundle of sources (with the ref name parameter "origins") including both of the sources he had added (Guiley and Maloney). No source information was actually removed on any of these occasions. — Cliftonian (talk) 18:41, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks for the clarification, but the issue remains of your constant reverting to the wording you see fit, when a reliable source clearly states it the way I had it. Lazyfoxx (talk) 19:59, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- With respect, I do not see what happened the same way. I will wait for outside views. Thank you for your patience Lazyfoxx. — Cliftonian (talk) 20:34, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks for the clarification, but the issue remains of your constant reverting to the wording you see fit, when a reliable source clearly states it the way I had it. Lazyfoxx (talk) 19:59, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- I did not delete reliable sources. On each occasion I replaced the two source footnotes Lazyfoxx added with a larger bundle of sources (with the ref name parameter "origins") including both of the sources he had added (Guiley and Maloney). No source information was actually removed on any of these occasions. — Cliftonian (talk) 18:41, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Sorry for bothering you again with the same thing, but we just got another account just created to vandalize Popular Republican Union (2007) page. See here Special:Contributions/Francis Le français D0kkaebi (talk) 22:55, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
- I do not vandalize, it's a shame D0kkaebi trying to manipulate and controle alone this article by this method !--Francis Le français (talk) 00:05, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- As a result of recent edit-warring, I've protected the article for four days. I encourage both of you to continue discussing your proposed changes to the article at Talk:Popular Republican Union (2007) and, if necessary, to pursue WP:Dispute resolution. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 02:46, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Thank you ! I have opened an IP investigation to know whether this new user dedicated to UPR / Asselineau is the same as the other IPs also dedicated to UPR/Asselineau here. He is now claiming that all those IPs have a consensus. D0kkaebi (talk) 02:49, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- I make a list (talk page) and your opinion is welcome.--Francis Le français (talk) 14:17, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- I took time to answer to all your comments. As you can see, changing the article based on your lack of review or knowledge was not justified. That's why I recommend you to discuss your change before proceeding as those make us loose time. D0kkaebi (talk) 00:18, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- Changing the article based on wikipedia's rules was justified (correct invalid sources, lies or errors). --Francis Le français (talk) 09:26, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk, just to inform you, you (and me) are being accused by --Francis Le français (talk) to "Lie" as said the title of the part and making "changes without obtaining consensus" from him, see here. Any opinion? D0kkaebi (talk) 01:34, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- False and ridiculous charge. I recalled that Malik have advised us (to us both - Both of us - you and me - francis the frenchy and D0kkaebi) to find consensus in discussion page--Francis Le français (talk) 02:14, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- It's not false and ridiculous, we just don't understand your writings. Quoting your sentence below a comment from Malik "You doesn't understand that you are concerned ( both of you ) and yet you have made changes without obtaining consensus with me ( both of you) in the talk page ?" D0kkaebi (talk) 05:00, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- Dear compatriot, you can ask me any details in our mother tongue (french ) + ( suppose my good faith WP:AGF ).have you understood that you were one of the people designated as malik Shabaz (both of you) ? and you need to find consensus on the points I have listed, for example ?--Francis Le français (talk) 04:35, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
- It's not false and ridiculous, we just don't understand your writings. Quoting your sentence below a comment from Malik "You doesn't understand that you are concerned ( both of you ) and yet you have made changes without obtaining consensus with me ( both of you) in the talk page ?" D0kkaebi (talk) 05:00, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- False and ridiculous charge. I recalled that Malik have advised us (to us both - Both of us - you and me - francis the frenchy and D0kkaebi) to find consensus in discussion page--Francis Le français (talk) 02:14, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk, just to inform you, you (and me) are being accused by --Francis Le français (talk) to "Lie" as said the title of the part and making "changes without obtaining consensus" from him, see here. Any opinion? D0kkaebi (talk) 01:34, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- Changing the article based on wikipedia's rules was justified (correct invalid sources, lies or errors). --Francis Le français (talk) 09:26, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- I took time to answer to all your comments. As you can see, changing the article based on your lack of review or knowledge was not justified. That's why I recommend you to discuss your change before proceeding as those make us loose time. D0kkaebi (talk) 00:18, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- I make a list (talk page) and your opinion is welcome.--Francis Le français (talk) 14:17, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Thank you ! I have opened an IP investigation to know whether this new user dedicated to UPR / Asselineau is the same as the other IPs also dedicated to UPR/Asselineau here. He is now claiming that all those IPs have a consensus. D0kkaebi (talk) 02:49, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
I saw this warning, but I think it would be good to re-create a redirect to Southport, New York, in light of my comments at this AfD. Please advise. Bearian (talk) 11:46, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Bearian. The page I deleted was a spammy three-sentence article. Please feel free to create a redirect. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 21:48, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
Military occupations peer review
Hello Malik, how are you? Over at the peer review for the List of military occupations we are having a discussion regarding whether a qualifying note or footnote should appear where the State of Palestine in mentioned under the column "occupied state" (the point of contention being the disconnect between the start of the occupation in 1967 and the declaration of the State of Palestine in 1988). If you could give a couple minutes of your time to help us out and, if necessary, guide us on the proper procedure to get more opinions, I would be grateful. Thanks and I hope you're well. — Cliftonian (talk) 17:56, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Cliftonian. I left a comment at WP:Peer review/List of military occupations/archive1. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 22:37, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks Malik. — Cliftonian (talk) 23:07, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
Palestine/Palestinian Refugee Camps
DearMalik Shabazz, could you please look up my edits on the article Palestinian refugee camps / Palestine refugee camps. The input from Goalie1998 gave me thinking, the editor left a message on my TP User_talk:Miraclexix#Palestine.2FPalestinian_Refugee_Camps. I would very much like to hear some short comments from you on that matter. I got your username from his TP, and I am just in search for a little help or advisory. - Sincerely --Miraclexix (talk) 16:00, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Miraclexix. I would encourage you to make more frequent use of articles' Talk pages (I see you have only four Talk page edits related to Israel and Palestine) and consider joining WikiProject Israel, WikiProject Palestine, and WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration. Also, please don't check the box to indicate that your change is a minor edit unless it is one you believe could never be the subject of a dispute.
- Wikipedia works by a delicate balance of two contradictory philosophies: boldness and consensus. In the Israel–Palestine area, I think it's important to tilt a little toward consensus. Propose a major rewrite on an article's Talk page before you make it, even though you believe it's superior to the current version. It may take a few days to make the changes you want, but it'll be better for having the input and support of a group of editors. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 00:28, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hello Malik, thank you for the help and input. I will consider to join the suggested groups. Sorry for the minor edit misuse, will be more careful in future (actually it is good to have positive constructive feedback on behaviour!). I asked you for help on the issue layed down. It is my understanding that TPs are for the purpose to fix/improve articles, and that is why I came here on to your TP. Thank you for the help and suggestions you made. But why did you post the info about blocks, restruictions and sanctions, regarding WP:ARBPIA? BTW, could that infobox be altered? I would like to have a date of the " Arbitration Committee has authorised discretionary sanctions" statement; the statement "Don't hesitate to contact me" is not clear, does it regard to the autor of the infobox template or to the signing user of that infobox? Cheers --Miraclexix (talk) 21:03, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Miraclexix. I notified you about the WP:ARBPIA sanctions because I think editors who choose to work in the Arab–Israeli subject area need to be aware of them. As the alert says: "This message ... does not imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date."
- With respect to your questions, the dates of WP:ARBPIA are posted at the top of that page; it was originally decided in 2008 and has been amended four times since then. The statement that you should "contact me or another editor if you have any questions" refers to the editor who posted the alert, although you could ask any experienced editor if you have a question. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 03:11, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
Proposals for a Palestinian state - Inaccurate Information
Dear Malik
I am not sure who blocked my account the other day, but I think it was unfair. I admit that being a new member I may not have quite understood the Wikipedia etiquette as well as some more senior members. However, my aim was not to cause any issues, but to positively contribute to the accuracy and neutrality of the article on Proposals for a Palestinian state.
I still feel the issues that I have raised have not been addressed. I may be a new member but, nonetheless, my views should still be discussed and taken seriously. Malik, for a senior member to state that following "I have no interest in debating with you" is very concerning. I have admitted that as a new member I may have misunderstood the editing procedure, but my intention was to improve the article, and you should be interested in debating with me, or anyone else, who is taking the time to contact you.
Please can we discuss the Following:
- It would be more accurate to state the "proposed creation of a Palestinian State", rather than the current term establishment. The reason is because an independent arab state of Palestine has never existed before and therefore the term creation, which is a term used to describe something which is brought into existence, would be more accurate.
- The article currently states the following: "As a result of the Six-Day War of 1967 the Palestinian territories were occupied by Israel". This is an inaccurate statement. If you read the lines prior, they discuss the fact that prior to the six day war the territories in question were occupied by Egypt and Jordan. It is incorrect terminology to imply that immediately after the six day war the territories automatically became "Palestinian territories". It would be more accurate to state the following " As a result of the Six-Day War of 1967 the territories previously occupied by Egypt (Gaza) and Jordan (West Bank & East Jerusalem) were controlled by Israel".
History
"The birth of Israel led to a major displacement of the Arab population". This statement is extremely vague, misleading and does not appear to be a NPOV. It implies that it was the "birth of Israel" that led to the displacement of the Arab population, rather than the 1948 war. The displacement resulted, not from the establishment of the State of Israel, but from the 1948 Arab Israeli War, when five Arab nations invaded territory in the former Palestinian mandate immediately following the announcement of the independence of the state of Israel (https://history.state.gov/milestones/1945-1952/arab-israeli-war).
Gazmie (talk) 09:15, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hello Gazmie. I guess reading isn't your strong suit.
I am not sure who blocked my account the other day
At the bottom of your Talk page, EdJohnston left you a message saying he had blocked you. - Above, I twice invited you to discuss your concerns at WikiProject Israel and WikiProject Palestine. Goalie1998 invited you to discuss them at Talk:Proposals for a Palestinian state.
- When I told you I had no interest in debating with you, I meant that I will not respond to your arguments about article content on my Talk page. You have been pointed to three more appropriate places to have that discussion, places where other editors can contribute. Please take your concerns to one (or more) of them. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 23:18, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
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Private message
Is there any way I might contact you privately? If so, you can contact me at my blog, via my FB account or Twitter acct (@richards1052). I will respond to you & give you my e mail address.Richard Silverstein (talk) 00:50, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Richard. I generally prefer to be contacted on this page, as this gives better transparency and you will likely get a faster reply, but you can e-mail me here. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 02:15, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
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Notice of Neutral point of view noticeboard discussion
Hello, Malik Shabazz. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Wikipedia:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.--Miraclexix (talk) 16:25, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
- P.S.: I do not mean to harm you, nor mock you in any way, but I like to have a hopefully neutral oversight over your revert-war. Why? Because there is constructive cooperation between me, Goalie and Nableezy already, why do you involve yourself in a rather interruptive way? --Miraclexix (talk) 16:25, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
Inappropriate Behavior for an Administrator
Dear Malik
I found your sarcastic response inappropriate. I have already explained that I am a newcomer to Wikipedia and I am still learning the ropes. To state that "I guess reading isn't your strong suit" is no way to respond to a new member who is genuinely trying to contribute to an article. The reason I thought you may have blocked my account was because you were the one who kept reverting my edits. Either way, you could have explained in a way more befitting for an administrator.
I still do not understand why you will not respond to my questions on your talk page. You mentioned that I should take my concerns to other places. However, its was yourself who continually reverted my edits. You cannot revert someone's edits and then when they request a response from you, direct them somewhere else. It was you, personally, who had concerns with my edits, so I think it is fair for me to request your personal response.
Your interactions with me are seriously discouraging me from continuing. Please could you improve your interaction with newcomers and not discourage them.
Gazmie (talk) 10:08, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
Kohelet Policy Forum
Hi Malik, me again. I'm sorry to bother you, but I just noticed פורום קהלת (talk · contribs)—"Forum Kohelet"—which seems to be a WP:ROLE account representing the Kohelet Policy Forum. All the user's contributions seem to be related. I suspect the account has remained under the radar so far in part because the username is written in Hebrew and thus ineligible to most people. I'm unsure how to proceed with this so I thought I would pass it on to you as an administrator at least vaguely familiar with Hebrew. Cheers, — Cliftonian (talk) 13:03, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
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Ethnicity
How are you both Ashnenazi and African American? Per your user boxes. deisenbe (talk) 09:34, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
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Miles Davis
In what way is IMDb not a reliable source? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Buffalo mozzarella (talk • contribs) 17:42, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- The problem with IMDb is that the content is user-generated. Wikipedia's reliable sources guideline specifically addresses the reliability of IMDb in the section at WP:USERGENERATED. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 18:29, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi Buffalo mozzarella. Barek is right. As I wrote on your Talk page, I replied to your message at Talk:Miles Davis#Personal life. — MShabazz Talk/Stalk 06:29, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
removing non-free logos with no fair-use rationale
I notice that you reverted many pages and signed it with: "removing non-free logo with no fair-use rationale" But after checking those articles, it seems they used the exact same logo that came from the logo objects parent article. Are you using a bot to do so, just click happy? And example is: The infobox of Iran–Iraq War in which the People's Mujahedin of Iran had an icon next to it but you removed it. I looked at a previous version of it and then read the parent article of People's Mujahedin of Iran where the same logo was present. The logo itself appears to have been created by MrPenguin20 which would make it eligible for fair use. ThurstonHowell3rd (talk) 06:16, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
- Hi ThurstonHowell3rd. See WP:NFCC, which requires a fair-use rationale for each use of a non-free image (Item 10c). A non-free logo can be used in the main article about an organization, but that doesn't mean editors can use the logo in infoboxes in other articles that mention the group.
- With respect to File:Flag of the People's Mujahedin of Iran - from Commons.svg, maybe I'm missing your point, but I don't think anything can make a non-free image eligible for fair use without a fair-use rationale. — MShabazz Talk/Stalk 07:08, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
File:Flag of the People's Mujahedin of Iran - from Commons.svg
You're right. I didn't scroll down far enough to see that the image had been moved from Commons as "non-free" and not to Commons as "free". It might be a good idea to ask an admin or a file mover to WP:MOF the file unless there is a particular reason it cannot be renamed to avoid a future confusion. - Marchjuly (talk) 06:46, 8 July 2015 (UTC)