Griffinofwales (talk | contribs) →Giving up the use of block: agree |
Jimbo Wales (talk | contribs) |
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: Would you be willing to annotate Bishonen's block log to void the block that you placed? This would not exonerate her behavior; it would simply say that you are revoking your block without prejudice. Somebody else could theoretically review the incident involving Bishonen and place an appropriate warning or sanction if needed. If you agree, you might offer this to Bishonen. I have no idea if she would accept. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 21:04, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
: Would you be willing to annotate Bishonen's block log to void the block that you placed? This would not exonerate her behavior; it would simply say that you are revoking your block without prejudice. Somebody else could theoretically review the incident involving Bishonen and place an appropriate warning or sanction if needed. If you agree, you might offer this to Bishonen. I have no idea if she would accept. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 21:04, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::I am offering to enter into mediation with a goal of placing a note into the block log, but the exact wording is not something that I think can be usefully be hashed out in public. The block was valid, and I hope it will be viewed as influential and important in terms of establishing the principle that even influential admins who are likely to complain a lot afterwards may be blocked for egregious personal attacks - just as any ordinary or unpopular user would be. Bishonen has offered to consider having someone work with me to come up with a wording she can accept - she is not willing to work with me directly. I think she's wrong to be so uncooperative, but then, that's no surprise.--[[User:Jimbo Wales|Jimbo Wales]] ([[User talk:Jimbo Wales#top|talk]]) 21:28, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::Are you sure you want to do that? It seems a bit of an overreaction. You've made rather influential blocks in the past: MyWikiBiz, DanielBrandt, and giving that up would, for better or worse, remove your ability to break up problems which are too contentious to end in any other ways. [[User:Prodego|<font color="darkgreen">''Prodego''</font>]] <sup>[[User talk:Prodego|<font color="darkgreen">talk</font>]]</sup> 21:08, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
::Are you sure you want to do that? It seems a bit of an overreaction. You've made rather influential blocks in the past: MyWikiBiz, DanielBrandt, and giving that up would, for better or worse, remove your ability to break up problems which are too contentious to end in any other ways. [[User:Prodego|<font color="darkgreen">''Prodego''</font>]] <sup>[[User talk:Prodego|<font color="darkgreen">talk</font>]]</sup> 21:08, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
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:::There are other ways for me to handle cases like that which I think will be more effective. In the long run, as I have always said, I am opposed to the entire notion of "GodKing", much preferring the model of Constitutional Monarchy where I have certain reserved and rarely used powers, primarily existing in order to deal with constitutional crises of various kinds. Although this is directly an attempt to simply eliminate what I view as a distraction from the real issue (admin misconduct in the form of personal attacks being a blockable offense), it is also part of my ongoing efforts to make sure that my role evolves usefully. Soon, I will be making some announcements about the upcoming ArbCom elections that are in the same general spirit - and which go far beyond the proposals that even some of my harshest critics have recommended. (I think they are wrong about their criticism, but I also, perhaps surprisingly think they are too mild in their reform proposals.)--[[User:Jimbo Wales|Jimbo Wales]] ([[User talk:Jimbo Wales#top|talk]]) 21:28, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
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:::Agree with Prodego. [[User:Griffinofwales|Griffinofwales]] ([[User talk:Griffinofwales|talk]]) 21:21, 22 July 2009 (UTC) |
Revision as of 21:28, 22 July 2009
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This user was a participant in the 2009 Great Wikipedia Dramaout, improving articles from July 18–22. |
Wikibooks
I would like to inform you that you may wish to change your babel boxes at the English Wikibooks. You may wish to change {{Babel|en|de}} to the code described below the userboxes. Thank you for your kind attention. Kayau |Jane Eyre| PRIDE AND PREJUDICE| les miserables 13:05, 18 July 2009 (UTC)
Request for arbitration
Hello, Jimbo. I'm about to request arbitration of you. Regards, Bishonen | talk 16:51, 20 July 2009 (UTC).
- The message above indicates he won't respond until on or after the 22nd. –xenotalk 16:52, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- Bishonen, if you believe we have a live dispute, then I would recommend following the steps in the dispute resolution process. I would recommend at this point either information mediation (mediation cabal) or formal mediation (mediation committee, though normally they restrict themselves to article content disputes). But perhaps it could be helpful if you could state for me what you think is in live dispute here?--Jimbo Wales (talk) 23:14, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- IMO, you (Jimbo) should stay out of this topic until the end of the dramaout. No offense, but when you become involved in something, it seems to create more drama. Just a suggestion. Griffinofwales (talk) 23:27, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- I'm going to break my dramaout pledge in order to eliminate a possible source of drama. The RFAR has actually been started: Wikipedia:A/R#Jimbo Wales' block of Bishonen, that "about to request" message was apparently intended as notification of the case. Jimbo, you probably want to make a statement there, it seems it is too late to recommend mediation. --Tango (talk) 23:35, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- (edit conflict)Um...to Jimbo. My suggestion is to keep the pledge and wait the 2 days. Most users will understand. Griffinofwales (talk) 23:38, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- I will, certainly; if I'd been aware of the dramaout, I would have posted later. However, 2 days isn't much in this context, as I expect the arbitration committee will be busy discussing the case amongst themselves for some time yet. Bishonen | talk 00:20, 21 July 2009 (UTC).
- I have posted and also emailed the Arbitration Committee. I would like to repeat my request here that if you think we have a live dispute, then let's talk to mediators.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 00:43, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
- I will, certainly; if I'd been aware of the dramaout, I would have posted later. However, 2 days isn't much in this context, as I expect the arbitration committee will be busy discussing the case amongst themselves for some time yet. Bishonen | talk 00:20, 21 July 2009 (UTC).
- (edit conflict)Um...to Jimbo. My suggestion is to keep the pledge and wait the 2 days. Most users will understand. Griffinofwales (talk) 23:38, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
Set up a direct link to Wiki Questions
Hi, there. I had a great idea to share with wikipedia, but I don't know where to post it. I also noticed that one of our sister projects, Simple English Wikipedia, had a place where people could go to list there question and be able to be read and answered by anyone. So I was wondering if you could please set one up for the main page (or in the way Simple English set it up) and if it was already set up, can you make a direct link to it from the main page? Please respond on my talkpage. Signed and regards from --Secret Saturdays (talk) 02:00, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
Re:Simple English Wikipedia username
Hi Mr Wales. I've blocked a user with your username on the Simple English Wikipedia. Just to be on the safe side, I'd like to cofirm if it is really you. Thank you.--TVBdxiang (Talk) 07:05, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- It was created automatically by SUL [1] so it is pretty clear it IS him. ViridaeTalk 08:05, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- :-) --Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:15, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- Hell's teeth! Welcome to SEWP, I hope you'll be providing us with an assessment of the project. It's very important, particularly to those editors whose time is spent exclusively there. I'm not suggesting you should give us some "inside line" on the thinking of the WMF but as of very recently, this particular Wikipedia was on the edge of closure. Some comment, direction, advice, or similar, would be very much gratefully received. No drama.... The Rambling Man (talk) 20:21, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
Offer to mediate
Hello Jimmy. Please see my offer to formally mediate your dispute with Bishonen Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case#Statement_by_Ryan_Postlethwaite here. Regards, Ryan PostlethwaiteSee the mess I've created or let's have banter 14:08, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
I would be very happy with that, so my answer is yes. I hope that Bishonen will agree.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:06, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
Giving up the use of block
I voluntarily offered, in my discussions with Bishonen, and as a good faith gesture to demonstrate my good will in trying to resolve all disputes with her, to not use the block tool for 6 months. Upon my own private reflection, I have decided to simply give up the use of the block tool permanently. I don't need it, it isn't important, and it is too widely viewed as a "nuclear option". I simply can't use the block tool normally, because people over-interpret it. No problem, I just won't use it at all.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:53, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- Would you be willing to annotate Bishonen's block log to void the block that you placed? This would not exonerate her behavior; it would simply say that you are revoking your block without prejudice. Somebody else could theoretically review the incident involving Bishonen and place an appropriate warning or sanction if needed. If you agree, you might offer this to Bishonen. I have no idea if she would accept. Jehochman Talk 21:04, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- I am offering to enter into mediation with a goal of placing a note into the block log, but the exact wording is not something that I think can be usefully be hashed out in public. The block was valid, and I hope it will be viewed as influential and important in terms of establishing the principle that even influential admins who are likely to complain a lot afterwards may be blocked for egregious personal attacks - just as any ordinary or unpopular user would be. Bishonen has offered to consider having someone work with me to come up with a wording she can accept - she is not willing to work with me directly. I think she's wrong to be so uncooperative, but then, that's no surprise.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 21:28, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- Are you sure you want to do that? It seems a bit of an overreaction. You've made rather influential blocks in the past: MyWikiBiz, DanielBrandt, and giving that up would, for better or worse, remove your ability to break up problems which are too contentious to end in any other ways. Prodego talk 21:08, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
- There are other ways for me to handle cases like that which I think will be more effective. In the long run, as I have always said, I am opposed to the entire notion of "GodKing", much preferring the model of Constitutional Monarchy where I have certain reserved and rarely used powers, primarily existing in order to deal with constitutional crises of various kinds. Although this is directly an attempt to simply eliminate what I view as a distraction from the real issue (admin misconduct in the form of personal attacks being a blockable offense), it is also part of my ongoing efforts to make sure that my role evolves usefully. Soon, I will be making some announcements about the upcoming ArbCom elections that are in the same general spirit - and which go far beyond the proposals that even some of my harshest critics have recommended. (I think they are wrong about their criticism, but I also, perhaps surprisingly think they are too mild in their reform proposals.)--Jimbo Wales (talk) 21:28, 22 July 2009 (UTC)