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Welcome to my talk page! I am an administrator here on Wikipedia. That means I am here to help. It does not mean that I have any special status or something, it just means that I get to push a few extra buttons to help maintain this encyclopedia. If you need help with something, feel free to ask. Click to start a new topic.
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First, please remember that I am not trying to attack you, demean you, or hurt you in any way. I am only trying to protect the integrity of this project. If I did something wrong, , but remember that I am human, and I do make mistakes. Please keep your comments civil. If you vandalize this page or swear at me, you will not only decrease the likelihood of a response, your edits could get you blocked. (see WP:NPA) When posting, do not assume I know which article you are talking about. If you leave a message saying "Why did you revert me?", I will not know what you mean. If you want a response consisting of something other than "What are you talking about", please include links and, if possible, diffs in your message. At the very least, mention the name of the article or user you are concerned with. If you are blocked from editing, you cannot post here, but your talk page is most likely open for you to edit. To request a review of your block, add Administrators: If you see me do something that you think is wrong, I will not consider it wheel-warring if you undo my actions. I would, however, appreciate it if you let me know what I did wrong, so that I can avoid doing it in the future. |
You can email me from this link but in the interests of Wiki-transparency, please message me on this page unless there are pressing reasons to do otherwise.
Comments which I find to be uncivil, full of vulgarities, flame baiting, or that are are excessively rude may be deleted without response. If I choose not to answer, that's my right, don't keep putting it back. I'll just delete and get annoyed at you.
R1a
Hi Doug. Can you have a look at a potential problem? I do not know if you'd be aware of it, but R1a has been the subject of a lot of work, mostly positive I think, and then recently two new articles arrived in the literature, which made the editing job a bit confusing, and this seems to have annoyed one editor. A situation has arisen now because User:Pdeitiker first proposed, and then made [1], a massive change to the article, trying to distinguish R1a's rare siblings into a separate article from the most common clade within R1a, which is what most authors mean by "R1a". He also bizarrely moved all recent discussion on R1a to the talkpage of the secondary article [2]. He asked for opinions, and received disagreement [3], [4], which he apparently ignored. After looking at the result of the splits, and realizing that neither of the two articles were in a coherent state, and that the talkpages had become useless, alarm bells were rung [5], [6]. His responses are obviously in bad faith, because when they were responded to he changed the excuses. What it now clearly comes down to is that we should not just be blindly accepting what is published. I then later reversed this split, also trying to answer at least some of his concerns, and also returned material back to the original talk page. This has resulted in repeated demands now that other Wikipedians have until Saturday to appease Pdeitiker, or else he'll revert to his split versions. The main threads of talkpage discussion are here: [7], [8], [9], [10], [11]. This User is a good faith editor, who does normally like wikilawyering or anything like that, and I would like this to calm down and get practical, but I thought it worth mentioning because some of the comments are getting silly.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 19:54, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
- I suggest further observation. The talkpage tone and the main page editing are getting uncivil in a very childish way. Other editors are starting to disappear. My attempts to communicate are now being constantly met with the old school boy trick of avoiding response with "you are upset because..." answers [12]. PB666 is threatening to keep reverting one section I've mentioned as being in error, unless I work on other things instead. [13]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 21:04, 17 November 2009 (UTC)
- "The critical error in these works which you fail to place on the page is that they have not done true sequence comparisons between clades, for example R1a1a* and any R1b*. That is part of explaining why there is differences to the layman. Since you don't want to do that I created a cladogram that implies that is what is going on."[14]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 22:51, 17 November 2009 (UTC)
- The problem here is that PB666 feels it is unquestionable that people should defer to him on everything including writing style, but his editing is terrible. How do you tell someone that without being "personal"? Discussion has become very blocked:- "I repeat this, you are not going to get me to back off on pushing the readability aspects of the article, I am doing this for your own improvement such that in future you can do this with Y-DNA pages by yourself. I have had the almost same discussions with older editors (3 years back) that you are having with me now." [15]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 06:50, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- Take a look at WP:DRV, see if there is anything there you thin you can use. Dougweller (talk) 07:07, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- Not sure I see the relevance. The article split proposal might have been a trigger for worse communication but it is not being disputed anymore.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 16:40, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- Take a look at WP:DRV, see if there is anything there you thin you can use. Dougweller (talk) 07:07, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- The problem here is that PB666 feels it is unquestionable that people should defer to him on everything including writing style, but his editing is terrible. How do you tell someone that without being "personal"? Discussion has become very blocked:- "I repeat this, you are not going to get me to back off on pushing the readability aspects of the article, I am doing this for your own improvement such that in future you can do this with Y-DNA pages by yourself. I have had the almost same discussions with older editors (3 years back) that you are having with me now." [15]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 06:50, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- Is there a WP policy on people who think they are kung fu masters putting apprentices through hoops in order to make them stronger? :) See, just for examples from today--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 23:15, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
- The page will not self-improve if you also do not self-improve. [16]
- Again, this should be your baby, and there are about 6 days left before GA occurs, if by that time we haven't gotten around the basic issues of style and working, then I might replace the sections. However I would hope that you will take the initiative at this point, looking at other GA articles and these edits go about making the repairs yourself. I will focus on the lede, henceforth.[17]
- Is there a WP policy on people who think they are kung fu masters putting apprentices through hoops in order to make them stronger? :) See, just for examples from today--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 23:15, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
I would like admin opinion on at least a couple of issues:
- Very intensive use of hidden notes expressing personal opinions within the main text of the article. I have been removing many of them.
- A big point is being made about the fact that Wikipedia demands that the lede must be bigger than what we have right now. PD is insistent that we are therefore forced to insert material there which largely duplicates material in the main body.
- The assigning of deadlines, as in the diff mentioned above. (For the two other questions any look at the article and talkpages involved should show you what I mean fairly quickly.)
Regards--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 07:40, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
Doug, I believe that the ONLY discussions on the R1a talkpage right now are about interpretation of Wikipedia norms, both in terms of editing and also acceptable talkpage behavior. I can't seem to break out of that. We really need some outside input on these things at least. It seems everything I propose or do is being described as being in violation of PB666's interpretation of some rule somewhere, with no discussion possible. And indeed I'd say most of his postings currently really are in violation of the spirit and letter of Wikipedia, but maybe I'm crazy. (The long long postings of PB666 are largely devoid of relevance to anything, but I can understand how they make Wikipedians feel unqualified to comment.)--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 13:15, 27 November 2009 (UTC)
Doug, a familiar sounding user just appeared at the R1a talkpage, User:HonestopL. Looks like Cyrus?--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 20:05, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
- Jog my memory please - maybe a link to Cyrus's contributions? Dougweller (talk) 20:18, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
- Apologies, I meant User:Cosmos416.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 20:36, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
PDeitiker is becoming more of a man on a mission out to make a point now: [18] then to this [19]. His attempt to call for GA review as way to apply pressure during silly content disputes blew up in his face [20], as it had to, and this has led to an increase in problems. What his real point is, is difficult to define. The nominal target keeps changing.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 15:47, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
- I'm just left with a headache. I know I hate infoboxes. I really just don't understand the subject well enough to know what this is all about. If it were archaeology or history, sure, but genetics? Sorr. Dougweller (talk) 16:53, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
- :) the reading I just gave you will be sure to make you feel more positive right? --Andrew Lancaster (talk) 21:26, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
- I believe these cases should be easier to follow for you: [21], [22]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 08:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- I am trying to think how I can avoid having to respond to the accusations and distortions. I was wondering what the feeling is about simply deleting pointlessly long or pointlessly argumentative posts if they keep coming and the disruption is obvious? (I imagine that if you asked people to name which ones come under this category on the R1a page there would be little disagreement about some of them.) My first impression is that this will not be accepted by the community?--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 13:29, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- You're right. Please don't delete them. And with respect, language such as 'fantasy accusations', right or wrong, doesn't help your case, especially if you go for a RfC on him (which would need someone else such as Marmaduke Percy). Dougweller (talk) 14:07, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- I have gone to ANI twice. Language such as "fantasy accusations" is about as far as I go, compared to the increasingly hateful and obviously deliberately disruptive language of PB666. If anything though, it seems to work for him like a magic "wall of invisibility" keeping admins away from him. He cites the ANI cases now as being on his side! And who is going to bother to look things up? So far this morning he has expounded almost 20,000 bytes worth on the R1a talk page. He is openly gloating over his power to disrupt now, and it is aimed largely at me personally: "The thing is here, I am the one person he can't deal with".--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 07:58, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
- You're right. Please don't delete them. And with respect, language such as 'fantasy accusations', right or wrong, doesn't help your case, especially if you go for a RfC on him (which would need someone else such as Marmaduke Percy). Dougweller (talk) 14:07, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- I am trying to think how I can avoid having to respond to the accusations and distortions. I was wondering what the feeling is about simply deleting pointlessly long or pointlessly argumentative posts if they keep coming and the disruption is obvious? (I imagine that if you asked people to name which ones come under this category on the R1a page there would be little disagreement about some of them.) My first impression is that this will not be accepted by the community?--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 13:29, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- I believe these cases should be easier to follow for you: [21], [22]--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 08:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
- :) the reading I just gave you will be sure to make you feel more positive right? --Andrew Lancaster (talk) 21:26, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
I would like an admin opinion about this usage of the comments option on the R1a article: [23]. The record shows that PB666 is using such comments, and also making reviews about the quality of articles he is working on and/or disputing about. He then refers to reviews during disputes as if they were done by someone else, and more generally he quite frequently writes during disputes as if "people are watching". I have raised it with him on the talk page [24], and he has now reduced the size of these particular remarks but they seem to be things that should just be worked on either on the talkpage or else by simply trying to find better wordings etc. He quite openly objects to the idea that people should be able to post their reasons for disagreeing with the comments. When I tried to open discussion on the talkpage [25] he accused me of "getting all peeved about the 3 remaining comments, and then going biserk" and "carrying on the war ... working his Maelstorm" [26]. --Andrew Lancaster (talk) 19:52, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
Hello, I disagree with your decline on the ANI I had started. It was fully valid, and time should not make a difference. The fact is that the user is incivil and he was in fact engaged in a edit war so stale does not come into the question. But to the point, If I am unhappy with your application of rules and WP in terms of the equality rule, then is there anyplace I appeal your decision? Just answer here as it is easier for me to keep track this way. Hope this is ok. Fragma08 (talk) 17:29, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- ANI3 is for violations of WP:3RR. How would blocking someone over 10 days later help? Dougweller (talk) 17:59, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- I believe it would make a statement instead of leaving it unaddressed, as the behaviour will simply continue only stronger. My understanding from reading on wikipedia, is that the administrators, when encountering an edit war, should block all particpating parties. Being kind of new, I only learned this now, hence I initiated the ANI. I understand you disagree due to lapse of 10 days, but still. Fragma08 (talk) 18:08, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- We block to prevent further problems, not to punish. Take a look at Blocking policy#Purpose and goal. Yes, if you read the Administrator guidance at WP:3RR (which I advise you to do if you haven't so far), we can block for "deterrence and forceful education to reduce the likelihood of future occurrence in the face of repeat behavior." Hipocrite has never been blocked for editing warring (his only block is a 1 second block for technical reasons in 2007), and he hasn't been particularly active on that article since you were blocked. In addition, we take potential BLP violations extremely seriously (have you read WP:BLP? So if you ever get reverted for a BLP violation, please stop and discuss it on the talk page.
- The fact remains, when two people are in an editwar then both must be blocked. That was not the case and this is problematic as this indicates favourism/bias. The reason for the user's inactivity is simply, because he got his way i.e. the version he wanted, so he owns the article: threat to neutrality and will continue to be the minute the article is reverted. User also sought the article deleted, in vain. So this would have been his first and very legitimate block for 3RRR. His lack of being blocked for 3RRR previously, is irrelevant. Neither have I ever been blocked before, might I mention. The future threat hence remains. There was no BLP violation as a person can not be defamed by his own words which was also confirmed by an administrator [27] so this claim makes no sense. It does not appear that wikipedia takes 3RRR violations seriously when it comes to certain editors. There was a 3RRR breach by the user. That needs to be addressed irrespective of his past blocks. I have done everything according the WP to the best of my knowledge but been told to "get the fuck out" etc. Therefore it is severely disappointing that I am being falsely accused, when pointing out the lack of action taken against another user who made 4 reverts in 1 hour. I do not understand the protectionist stance as several editors have pointed out to the user his behavioural problems. Fragma08 (talk) 19:34, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- Nonetheless your report was stale - ANI is the correct forum for complaining about my decline if you are still unhappy, but I don't think anyone would have given him a 3RR block at this point. If the dispute on the article picks up again, past behaviour of editors would normally be taken into account. I can't comment on why Hipocrite wasn't blocked at the time obviously since that wasn't mentioned in the decision. Dougweller (talk) 19:46, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- Some action ought to be taken to make him aware of his incivility, refusal to discuss while simultanously 3RRR and baseless arguments for 3RRR. Question of principles. His reverts are vandalism from a BLP POV. There was awareness of his 3RRR violation sadly, yet it was not addressed, which becomes an separate issue on its own. Is there no other option than ANI, as I fear the bias may be a problem as much indicates that some administrators are protecting him which should not be the case. Fragma08 (talk) 20:01, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- Nonetheless your report was stale - ANI is the correct forum for complaining about my decline if you are still unhappy, but I don't think anyone would have given him a 3RR block at this point. If the dispute on the article picks up again, past behaviour of editors would normally be taken into account. I can't comment on why Hipocrite wasn't blocked at the time obviously since that wasn't mentioned in the decision. Dougweller (talk) 19:46, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- The fact remains, when two people are in an editwar then both must be blocked. That was not the case and this is problematic as this indicates favourism/bias. The reason for the user's inactivity is simply, because he got his way i.e. the version he wanted, so he owns the article: threat to neutrality and will continue to be the minute the article is reverted. User also sought the article deleted, in vain. So this would have been his first and very legitimate block for 3RRR. His lack of being blocked for 3RRR previously, is irrelevant. Neither have I ever been blocked before, might I mention. The future threat hence remains. There was no BLP violation as a person can not be defamed by his own words which was also confirmed by an administrator [27] so this claim makes no sense. It does not appear that wikipedia takes 3RRR violations seriously when it comes to certain editors. There was a 3RRR breach by the user. That needs to be addressed irrespective of his past blocks. I have done everything according the WP to the best of my knowledge but been told to "get the fuck out" etc. Therefore it is severely disappointing that I am being falsely accused, when pointing out the lack of action taken against another user who made 4 reverts in 1 hour. I do not understand the protectionist stance as several editors have pointed out to the user his behavioural problems. Fragma08 (talk) 19:34, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
- We block to prevent further problems, not to punish. Take a look at Blocking policy#Purpose and goal. Yes, if you read the Administrator guidance at WP:3RR (which I advise you to do if you haven't so far), we can block for "deterrence and forceful education to reduce the likelihood of future occurrence in the face of repeat behavior." Hipocrite has never been blocked for editing warring (his only block is a 1 second block for technical reasons in 2007), and he hasn't been particularly active on that article since you were blocked. In addition, we take potential BLP violations extremely seriously (have you read WP:BLP? So if you ever get reverted for a BLP violation, please stop and discuss it on the talk page.
- I believe it would make a statement instead of leaving it unaddressed, as the behaviour will simply continue only stronger. My understanding from reading on wikipedia, is that the administrators, when encountering an edit war, should block all particpating parties. Being kind of new, I only learned this now, hence I initiated the ANI. I understand you disagree due to lapse of 10 days, but still. Fragma08 (talk) 18:08, 5 December 2009 (UTC)
Albert Stubblebine
I notice you deleted the text I had appended to the paragraph dealing with General Stubblebine's testimony in the documentary "One Nation Under Siege". I find it very unfortunate that you deemed it necessary to also remove the link to the YouTube document I copied it from. I am not at all familiar with all those copyright concerns, although I know they do exist. In this particular case, I doubt very much that the copyright owner would object to having someone linking a Wikipedia article to a YouTube excerpt from his movie. He could more understandably object to YouTube distributing the video than for someone just linking to it. It seems to me that since he doesn't seem to object to the video being freely accessible on YouTube, it is very unlikely that he would object to someone merely providing a link to the publicly available document on YouTube.
That being said, I fail to see why the phrase mentioning that "he states that a Boeing 757 airplane could not have crashed into The Pentagon on September 11, 2001" was allowed to remain. What is the logic here? That information comes straight from the video. Why did you delete his views about the free press having become very expensive since 9/11 and kept intact those about the Boeing at the Pentagon ?
Is it because I faithfully transcribed what he said word for word? If that is the case, would it be acceptable to mention his thoughts if I summarized them in my own words? Oclupak (talk) 03:13, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
- Sorry I forgot to reply, I've responded on the article's talk page. Dougweller (talk) 06:09, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
Thank you for the AN notice
I will be posting a reply forthwith (within the next few minutes). Thank you. I am sorry if this is the incorrect place to notify you that I got your message. Moogwrench (talk) 05:35, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
I just wanted to let you know that I had placed my reply to the ANI issue on the ANI board. Again, sorry if this is the incorrect place to notify you, I really don't know, since I never have had to deal with this before. Moogwrench (talk) 06:34, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
Please
Please, stop —Preceding unsigned comment added by 123.23.253.111 (talk) 07:02, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- You are clearly Yongle the Great (talk · contribs), indefinitely blocked by another Aministrator- all you need to do is ask to be unblocked and be willing to discuss your edits - and start using reliable sources as references, etc. You need to learn to work with others if you wish to edit here. So far as I can tell you have something to add to Wikipedia if you are willing to work with others and follow our guidelines and policies. But so long as you evade your block, expect your edits to be reverted, blocked editors can't edit, that's the purpose of the block. Dougweller (talk) 07:46, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
YtG
Thanks for the note. Short of continuing to WP:RBI until they start to communicate, I don't know what else to suggest. The IPs are close enough that a rangeblock might be appropriate, but I've never done one and don't know what sort of collateral damage is acceptable - I wouldn't want to take out the entire country :) If they are static IPs that makes it easier, but at the moment I suppose we just have to wait and see. I've tagged the socks you mentioned. The only additional measure I can think of is article semiprotection; I realise there are quite a few articles involved, but it would curtail the IP editing. If we make it unproductive enough for them to continue evading the block, they may eventually be brought to the table. EyeSerenetalk 13:44, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks. I'm slowly doing that. Not something I really want to do, but the only practical way to stop this disruption. There's not much else you can do when an editor won't discuss their edits. Dougweller (talk) 16:57, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- I agree. I had wondered if there were language issues, but they seem to be able to produce article text readily enough. EyeSerenetalk 18:20, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- The redlink already existed in the sock templates I'd added to the accounts I was aware of; I don't know if I got them all though. I've created the listing page, Category:Suspected Wikipedia sockpuppets of Yongle the Great, so in future all anyone need do is tag their accounts with {{sockpuppet|Yongle the Great}} and the account will automatically be added to the category. Hopefully the rangeblock will help. EyeSerenetalk 17:18, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks, how about confirmed sockpuppets such as user:Emperor of China, shall I use it anyway? Dougweller (talk) 17:35, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- The redlink already existed in the sock templates I'd added to the accounts I was aware of; I don't know if I got them all though. I've created the listing page, Category:Suspected Wikipedia sockpuppets of Yongle the Great, so in future all anyone need do is tag their accounts with {{sockpuppet|Yongle the Great}} and the account will automatically be added to the category. Hopefully the rangeblock will help. EyeSerenetalk 17:18, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- I've created that category too (not done much actually - if you follow the redlink from a sock template on a user page and add {{sockpuppet category|username}} to the blank category page, then save, it auto-detects whether they're suspected or confirmed and creates and populates the page accordingly). We now have two cats:
- As long as any future socks are tagged with the right version of {{sock}}, the pages will maintain themselves. Only one other thing - you only really need to add the template to the userpage, not the talkpage (it creates a double listing in the category otherwise). EyeSerenetalk 19:20, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Brilliant, thanks. I've been sticking to the user page today. :-) Dougweller (talk) 19:26, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Heh :) I've also just tagged User:Yongle the Great as the sockpuppeteer account, so hopefully everything's in place that should be. You're very welcome, anyway. It can be a bit of a pain dealing with editors like this; some of us are chasing one around various milhist articles at the moment, and it's not much fun when there's other things you'd rather be doing. Still, Wikipedia attracts all sorts... :P EyeSerenetalk 19:38, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- This Yongle fellow & his increasing number of socks might need a range block. GoodDay (talk) 20:52, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Yes. I'm working with Nishkid64 who has blocked 123.23.240.0/20 for five days. And I agree, EyeSerene, I've got more constructive ways to spend my time. Dougweller (talk) 20:54, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
Trouble with Yongle
Hi Doug. Looks like I'm becoming involved in the problems with Yongle the Great (talk · contribs). Please have a look at the actions of Trương Hoàng Phong (talk · contribs). Seems to be yet another puppet, whether sock or meat I cannot tell. I have reported him to the administrators at WP:ANI#Trương Hoàng Phong, but I don't feel competent to undertake a clean-up. Favonian (talk) 11:04, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
Category:Piri Reis
Hi! First of all: it's not Resi but Reis, which is explained in Reis#Military rank. Secondly, as an admin, you must well know what this cat is supposed to be. If you really wanna know, check please cats for notable people. Cheers. CeeGee (talk) 19:14, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
- I know what a Reis is, but your category was Piri Resi [28] and see Piri Reis map which still has a red link to it. So, a typo, right? I thought ok, maybe I've missed something and there is a word 'Resi'. Dougweller (talk) 19:35, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
I see now, İ didn't realize it. My bad. Sorry my comments. Cheers. CeeGee (talk) 19:41, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
The Wikipedia Signpost: 7 December 2009
- From the editors: 250th issue of the Signpost
- Editorial: A digital restoration
- Election report: ArbCom election in full swing
- Interview: Interview with David G. Post
- Discussion report: Discussion Reports and Miscellaneous Articulations
- Features and admins: Approved this week
- Arbitration report: The Report on Lengthy Litigation
- Technology report: Bugs, Repairs, and Internal Operational News
Pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact
Don't you spell artifact with an "i"? Bernstein2291 (Talk • Contributions • Sign Here) 07:19, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Archaeology/archeology, artefact/artifact, both are correct. Artifact is not a spelling used in British English but artefact and artifact are both used in American English. You will sometimes see the ae spelling for archaeology and the i spelling for artifact together. Dougweller (talk) 07:58, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
Building consensus on copyright issue
You were involved in a discussion regarding the use of copyrighted architectural designs on Wikipedia pages and I'm trying to find community consensus on a gray area. If you can, please let me know at what point you feel these images should be replaced here. Thank you so much! DR04 (talk) 19:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
Clerk advice please
Despite the arbitration, Tothwolf is doing large scale removals of edits I previously did, usually with no edit summary. On the discussion page he isn't answering why, but is telling me to fuck off and accusing me of paid editing. [29]. The paid editing accusation has no evidence in the arbitration and is a particularly egregious assault on my character - this community despises it as Jimbo has said it is never acceptable. I do not know how long this situation can simmer if the arbitration continues at idle. Is there anything that can be done in the mean time to make the attacks and revert warring stop? Miami33139 (talk) 21:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- If UrbanDictionary.com is now considered to be a reliable source then there are several articles I need to go add citations to.
As for large scale removals, exactly how many articles are part of this "large scale removal"? 2+2=5(?)...
What's to say I've not provided evidence of your sponsored editing Miami33139? You are the one who made several mistakes, the first being to engage in such editing with a clear and absolute conflict of interest. I and others also told you to leave me alone and disengage but even during the arbitration process you've continued to follow my contributions and prod/AfD my past contributions purely for harassment purposes. You have not and are not fooling anyone, Miami33139. --Tothwolf (talk) 23:21, 11 December 2009 (UTC)- If you have made evidence of my being a paid editor, please show it to me. I am not a paid editor. Miami33139 (talk) 23:37, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- No, email it to Arbcom, this discussion has to stop, I've commented at Wikipedia talk:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Tothwolf/Evidence#Personal attacks made while arbitration is underway and Tothwolf's talk page. Dougweller (talk) 08:22, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
- If you have made evidence of my being a paid editor, please show it to me. I am not a paid editor. Miami33139 (talk) 23:37, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- To follow up with you on your comments and concerns, I already emailed Arbcom so we can certainly leave it at that.
Doug, now, I know you may not personally like what I have to say here, and while I'm going to keep my comments here civil they are going to be quite matter of fact. To put it bluntly, I feel as clerk you really should be taking a much more objective view of things and not taking the continued trolling of myself by Theserialcomma (who has been warned and told to disengage repeatedly by other administrators previously; see their talk page history [30]) as anything more than baseless trolling. Despite being warned, Theserialcomma continues to troll, wikihound, follow my contribs, prod/AfD articles from my contribs, and make false statements. None of this has yet to be addressed and I've provided plenty of evidence of these continued behaviours on the case's Evidence page that shows these behaviours continuing even during the Arbcom proceedings. Theserialcomma even did it here [31] as well while following my contribs. There are many other administrators, both on-wiki and off-wiki, who have since been made aware of both Theserialcomma and Miami33139's continued behaviours, so this will no longer be happening in a vacuum anyway.
Considering that I've never been blocked, never been threatened with a block, and have not, nor have I even attempted to "out" anyone, I think you are going overboard with your comments here [32] and here [33] where you threaten me with a block for "outing". Considering Miami33139 has taken to harassing Hm2k now, and even moved sandbox articles from Mabdul's userspace to articlespace (an attempt to change from MfDing user pages to AfDing articles), someone really should be taking a much harder look at what Miami33139 has been up to.
Now, while I fully understand that you have a lot going on which has left you limited time to deal with issues relating to this case, this case is not the simple case people initially thought it would be and it really needs more attention directed its way. In the interest of stopping the disruptive behaviours from Theserialcomma and Miami33139, I suggest a proposal of an injunction for Miami33139 and Theserialcomma based on the actual evidence provided in the Arbcom case (which has been provided by both myself and others) that shows the continued patterns of harassment and gaming the system from these two specific editors.
If you wish to reply to my comments above, I'll gladly follow up with you here, otherwise I think what I've said above pretty much covers things and I intend to leave it at that. --Tothwolf (talk) 13:33, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
- To follow up with you on your comments and concerns, I already emailed Arbcom so we can certainly leave it at that.