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==Goodbye== |
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Well, I'm off. Apparently Wikipedia is the sort of project where one user can pursue a campaign of threats, insults, misquotation, denigration and privacy violation, culminating in calling me a liar to my face and nobody bats an eyelid. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 06:25, 3 July 2009 (UTC) |
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'''Welcome!''' |
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: I am very sorry for your experience – indeed, this one particular user does engage in below-the-belt practices and wikipedia enforcement mechanisms have been powerless to stop him so far. As R.e.b told you, from a practical point of view, it is often easier and more constructive to disgengage and keep editing other articles, both for you and for others. I do hope that you'll find a way to return to wikipedia after a rest and I wish you many more productive edits and much satisfaction with your good work. [[User:Arcfrk|Arcfrk]] ([[User talk:Arcfrk|talk]]) 07:16, 3 July 2009 (UTC) |
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Hello, {{BASEPAGENAME}}, and [[Wikipedia:Introduction|welcome]] to Wikipedia! Thank you for [[Special:Contributions/{{BASEPAGENAME}}|your contributions]]{{#if:|, especially what you did for [[:{{{art}}}]]}}. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful: |
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*[[Wikipedia:Five pillars|The five pillars of Wikipedia]] |
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*[[Wikipedia:Tutorial|Tutorial]] |
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*[[Wikipedia:How to edit a page|How to edit a page]] |
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*[[Wikipedia:Article development|How to write a great article]] |
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*[[Wikipedia:Manual of Style|Manual of Style]] |
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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a [[Wikipedia:Wikipedians|Wikipedian]]! Please [[Wikipedia:Signatures|sign]] your messages on [[Wikipedia:talk page|discussion page]]s using four [[tilde]]s (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out [[Wikipedia:Questions]], ask me on {{#if:Genius101|[[user talk:Genius101|my talk page]]|my talk page}}, or ask your question on this page and then place <code><nowiki>{{helpme}}</nowiki></code> before the question. Again, welcome! <!-- Template:Welcome --> |
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'''[[User:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">gENIUS</span>]][[User talk:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">101</span>]]''' 19:56, 9 May 2009 (UTC) |
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::I think several people batted an eye, furrowed a brow, and even harrumphed. But certainly Wikipedia isn't perfect. There are lots of other articles and editors after all. Take care. Thanks for your good efforts and helpful suggestions and comments. [[User:ChildofMidnight|ChildofMidnight]] ([[User talk:ChildofMidnight|talk]]) 20:08, 3 July 2009 (UTC) |
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== Talkback == |
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:::I am appauled but not suprised with what happened. Sorry. [[User:Ikip|Ikip]] ([[User talk:Ikip|talk]]) 04:00, 9 August 2009 (UTC) |
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== Standard offer == |
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{{talkback|Genius101|Minority}} |
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'''[[User:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">gENIUS</span>]][[User talk:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">101</span>]]''' 19:56, 9 May 2009 (UTC) |
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A discussion on the [[WP:Standard offer]] for this used is undergoing at [[Wikipedia:Administrators%27 noticeboard#Standard offer for User:A.K.Nole]].--[[User:Salix alba|Salix]] ([[User talk:Salix alba|talk]]): 20:26, 24 May 2013 (UTC) |
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== Talkback == |
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{{talkback|Genius101|Minority}} |
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'''[[User:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">gENIUS</span>]][[User talk:Genius101|<span style="color:Green;background:Black">101</span>]]''' 19:55, 15 May 2009 (UTC) |
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== Re. Phrop == |
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Whoops, I must have mistaken them as part of the article text, my bad. [[User:B3llit0|ベリット]] <sup>[[User_talk:B3llit0|話せます]]</sup> 21:27, 20 May 2009 (UTC) |
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== Re Claudia (List of Doctor Who spin-off companions) == |
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"Unsourced" I'll give you. Lance Parkin has in fact said this explicitly, but I can't find an online source. I can't see why it's "irrelevant" -- nothing's known of "Claudia" as a character other than her name, and this gives a context for that. |
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And "implausible"? That's just rude. [[User:Phil PH|Phil PH]] ([[User talk:Phil PH|talk]]) 07:54, 9 June 2009 (UTC) |
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== [[Jeremy Dunning-Davies]] == |
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Your edits to [[Jeremy Dunning-Davies]] are problematic. If you continue reverting sourced content, your editing account could be blocked. Before future blanking, please carefully justify yourself on the talk page of this article. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 00:32, 14 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:Well, let's analyse this in detail. I have copied here one entire posting from the [[Talk:Jeremy Dunning-Davies|article talk page]]: |
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:::<small>What you say is quite inaccurate. The sources show the contrary of what you state. On a personal note, looking at your editing record, you seem to be a somewhat inexperienced wikipedian editor. It is not a very good idea to continue pushing a point of view contradicted by multiple sources, unless you wish to be blocked indefinitely. This will happen very soon if you don't bother checking things, To see how wikipedia functions in this particular area, I suggest you review Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Telesio - Galilei Academy of Science, which directly involves JDD. Look at the video cited here before wasting any more time.</small> |
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:First, the weasel words. |
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::"Problematic" = disagreeing with Mathsci |
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::"Revert" suggests that I blindly reverted as opposed to editing. It was in fact Mathsci who reverted. |
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::"Sourced" = largely unsourced. Sources did not support the claims made, and other sources requested were not forthcoming. |
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::"Blanking" = removing contentious and inadequately sourced material in accordance with [[WP:BLP]]. |
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::"Please justify" suggests lack of justification, ignoring multiple comments and the four-point reasoning I placed on the talk page together with edit summaries referring to talk page and invoking BLP. |
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::At the talk page: "pushing a point of view" = disagreeing with Mathsci |
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::At the talk page: "quite inaccurate" = comments on Wikipedia policy disagreeing with Mathsci |
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::At the talk page: "sources"/"multiple sources" = only one source supplied and unsurprisingly it does not address Wikipedia policy |
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::At the talk page: "the video cited here" = a video not cited |
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:Second, the behaviour. |
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::Here and at the talk page: "Account could be blocked"/"unless you wish to be blocked". Apparently threats. Of course Mathsci is not in a position to actually block me, and even if s/he were, it would be grossly improper to do so. |
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::At the talk page: "On a personal note". Article talk pages are not the place for personal discussions of any kind and this is clearly a personal attack. |
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::At the talk page: "inexperienced". Irrelevant. |
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::At the talk page: "blocked ... if you don't bother checking things". Implied threats: impossible to check anyway since Mathsci repeatedly failed to supply the references which s/he claims support his/her case. |
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::Edit summary: "editor doesn't know what he's talking about". Simple insult. |
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:I do not propose to tolerate this sort of bullying behaviour. Mathsci, if you have an issue with my edits, and if we cannot reach consensus in an orderly way on the article talk page, take it to dispute resolution. If you truly believe that my behaviour warrants an indefinite block, take it to the appropriate forum. Do not attempt to bully me, do not harrass me, do not insult me. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 11:39, 14 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::Please see [[Wikipedia:Fringe_theories/Noticeboard#A.K.Nole_disputing_fringe_science_involvement]]. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 22:24, 14 June 2009 (UTC) |
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== [[Mathscinet]] == |
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I assume that you meant [[mathscinet]]. The correct trade mark is MathSciNet. I used that wikilink already on the deletion page of [[Jeremy Dunning-Davies]]. Please don't leave any more messages like that on my talk page. It counts as fairly serious harrassment and could result in your account being blocked, possibly indefinitely. Thanks, [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 10:16, 16 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:No, I said, and meant, ''Mathsci'', which is the trade mark referred to [http://library.dialog.com/bluesheets/html/bl0239.html here] and [http://www.ovid.com/site/catalog/DataBase/117.jsp here]; numbers 2 and 3 on Google for the search term ''Mathsci''. Since I supplied those links in my message your "assumption" is false. As the AMS press release [http://www.ams.org/ams/press/mr.html here] makes clear, MathSci is a database and MathSciNet is a web interface. It is hard to believe that you are not perfectly well aware of this. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 17:13, 16 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::You have been reported on [[WP:ANI]]. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 19:04, 16 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:::I have replied [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=prev&oldid=296831186 here]. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 21:20, 16 June 2009 (UTC) |
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== I'm Lost == |
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This may never reach anyone of note, but I can't figure out how to deal with the Wikipedia behemoth. I just want to take issue with the way erotic literature (e.g. Yolanda Celbridge) has been essentially erased from Wikipedia. I want to help, but I find myself in a Kafka-esque situation in which I need to know an answer before I can ask a question. Is there some way in this software bog where I could participate in a real discussion about what's happening. As I may not be able to use the software even to see your reply (assuming I've reached somebody, that is) perhaps I should give my email address: storm.wolf@btinternet.com. This may well be my last attempt at trying to support Wikipedia - my God you guys make it difficult! |
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John. |
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[[User:CliffordDorset|CliffordDorset]] ([[User talk:CliffordDorset|talk]]) 19:03, 18 June 2009 (UTC)CliffordDorset |
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== [[Butcher group]] == |
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Hello. If you continue editing the talk page of this article as you have been doing recently, you can expect to be blocked. Many thanks, [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 23:34, 29 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:Since my edits to [[Talk:Butcher group]] have been to suggest three improvements to the article, all of which have been accepted and implemented by yourself, this warning is incomprehensible and unacceptable. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 06:30, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::This edit [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Minimal_subtraction_scheme&diff=299462609&oldid=93889358] will be reverted because you copied and pasted material from one article into another. The problem with this edit is that it is not relevant to the stub and the material is completely out of context in this article. You are unwittingly using the notation of Hopf algebras but don't seem to have a clue that you're doing so. If you continue editing tendentiously like this you are probably heading for quite a long block.[[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 07:01, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:::The relevant article talk page is the place to discuss improving the [[Minimal subtraction scheme]] article. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 07:04, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::::No, you copied a section of one article out of context into another. That was a very ill-advised thing to do and is not how wikipedia is edited. Why are you adding unsourced material and unexplained notation to an article? That is extremely unhelpful and disruptive. The normal way is to find the material in a book, e.g. Collins' Renormalization, paraphrase it and then cite it. I hope you understand this. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 07:12, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:::::BTW as an example of how to edit wikipedia, I prepared this article on Dame [[Janet Trotter]], the founding Vice-Chancellor and Principal of the [[University of Gloucestershire]] in [[Cheltenham]]. The same process applies: locate the sources, provide the references and paraphrase the material. It might be a useful exercise for you to try creating an article from scratch like this yourself, just to get the hang of things. You've spent so much time adding citation tags to other articles, that I am quite surprised that you don't understand how to add material properly yourself. Good luck. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 07:18, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::::::A supplementary question that I would like you to answer here: why did you paste material on renormalization in the toy case of rooted trees rather than the usual setting of [[Feynman diagram]]s? That was a very ill-advised error and indicates that you are probably not really interested in adding content to this encyclopedia. Try adding something you know about next time. [[User:Mathsci|Mathsci]] ([[User talk:Mathsci|talk]]) 07:26, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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Warning: please back off the trolling on this article and find yourself something useful and productive to do [[User:William M. Connolley|William M. Connolley]] ([[User talk:William M. Connolley|talk]]) 07:40, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:Well, there's a lot to answer here, and I will do so in tranches. |
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:In response to WMC. I do not accept that my comments at [[Talk:Butcher group]] constitute trolling. I made three proposals for improving the article: |
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::1. That the definition of the Butcher group itself (as it stood at that time) was incomplete [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=298511620&oldid=298402257]. Mathsci accepted this and added the missing material [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Butcher_group&diff=298534381&oldid=298456267], acknowledging my assistance ("your question was useful") [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=298607822&oldid=298603509]. |
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::2. That the opening sentence was misleading as it identified the group with the associated formalism [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=298607822&oldid=298603509]. Mathsci argued quite strongly that this was absurd, then made the suggested change ("slight rewording of lede") [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Butcher_group&diff=298643273&oldid=298601180]. |
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::3. That the phrase ''minimal subtraction scheme'' should be wikilinked to the article of the same name if that was indeed appropriate [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=299347621&oldid=299312731]. Mathsci again angrily rejected this as absurd and then made the suggested link [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Butcher_group&diff=299404528&oldid=299347314] |
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:Unfortunately Mathsci chose to pitch the discussion mainly at a level of an attack on my motivation, mathematical competence and integrity. He chose to misquote some of my comments quite badly (whether recklessly or deliberately I cannot tell). He further issued threats to have me blocked if I continued to contribute to the talk page. He characterised my position on making the article more accessible as trolling, even though at least one other editor in good standing agreed with my proposition. Mathsci's conduct is quite extraordinary and I can only understand it as an extreme attempt to assert [[WP:OWN|ownership]] over this article. |
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:I should add that I find this article a tour-de-force of mathematical exposition and regret that Mathsci's conduct will overshadow his achievement in bringing it to Wikipedia. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 17:19, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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::In response to Mathsci. I propose to discuss points connected with the content of the article [[Minimal subtraction scheme]] at [[Talk:Minimal subtraction scheme]] which is the only appropriate venue for such discussions. |
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:::1. Cut-and-paste. As you know, cut-and-paste is deprecated in the specific case of [[Wikipedia:How to fix cut-and-paste moves|cut-and-paste moves]] for technical reasons connected with page histories. Otherwise, it falls under the [[Wikipedia:Plagiarism#Copying_within_Wikipedia|copying within Wikipedia]] guideline ''When copying material within Wikipedia, from one article to another, attribution within the edit summary is required'' which I was careful to adhere to. I reject your criticism of my conduct. |
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:::2. Your comments on my editing. You are entitled to your opinion: regrettably your expression of it has reached the level of a personal attack, and is no longer welcome. I am content to stand on my record of useful contributions to Wikipedia and civil interaction with other contributors. |
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:::3. For an editor who claims that commenting on one article talk page consitutes "wikistalking" [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:LadyofShalott&diff=298907368&oldid=298906130] your sudden interest in [[University of Gloucestershire]] and [[Trotter]] might raise an eyebrow. Can you honestly state that your motives in selecting these articles to edit were entirely unconnected with their appearance on my contribution list? For the record, of course, I maintain that you have as much right to edit those articles as I do to contribute to any that you may have worked on. |
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:::4. Your reversion of my contribution [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Minimal_subtraction_scheme&diff=prev&oldid=299462609] to [[Minimal subtraction scheme]] took place within <u>13 minutes</u> of my making it (during which short period you also found time to fire off a threat to me [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:A.K.Nole&diff=prev&oldid=299463600]). It stretches credulity to suggest that this gave you time to happen across the article, give a measured assessment to my contribution, and respond accordingly. It seems overwhelmingly likely that you reverted this edit simply because it was I who had made it and for no other reason (taking the rest of the day to justify it). This close attention to, disruption of, and refusal to discuss my edits represents a further and disturbing step in a campaign to make editing Wikipedia unpleasant for me, to undermine me, to frighten me, and to discourage me from editing entirely. '''This must stop'''. |
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::Executive summary. Dispute resolution is called for. How do you wish to proceed? [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 19:20, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:::<small>For the record: Mathsci rejected [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Mathsci&curid=22737410&diff=299571935&oldid=299571413] my suggestion of dispute resolution here and at his talk page [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Mathsci&diff=prev&oldid=299571413]. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 20:29, 30 June 2009 (UTC) </small> |
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Mathsci challenged me to explain my additional material to the Minimal subtraction scheme article. I said I preferred to reply at the article talk page, and did so, but that has now been removed by WMC. In the interests of a full record, here is that explanation again. |
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* you copied and pasted material from one article into another. The problem with this edit is that it is not relevant to the stub and the material is completely out of context in this article. You are unwittingly using the notation of Hopf algebras but don't seem to have a clue that you're doing so. |
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* Why are you adding unsourced material and unexplained notation to an article? The normal way is to find the material in a book, e.g. Collins' Renormalization, paraphrase it and then cite it. |
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* why did you paste material on renormalization in the toy case of rooted trees rather than the usual setting of Feynman diagrams? That was a very ill-advised error |
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These are very reasonable questions which I propose to address here. |
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* Copy-and-paste is not in itself a bad thing. However. In this particular case I selected a small amount of material from a long, detailed and very expert article (largely written by Mathsci). The homomorphisms in question are indeed Hopf algebra homomorphisms but this is not relevant, and i removed that phrase, since the renormalisation rule applies entirely to the image space V. I added the comment that renormalisation is the principal part operation. |
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* It is adequately sourced in Butcher group: detailed references welcome. The notation is entirely contained in the selected text, where the operator R and space V are adequately explained. |
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* It is indeed a toy case, and the suggestion that this should be made clear is a good one. Its value to the non-expert is precisely that, as a toy, it is an example giving a flavour of the scheme in terms of mathematical concepts at a level that could be understood by an undergraduate. Another reason for its selection is that this is, so far, the only example of an MSS currently present in Wikipedia. |
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[[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 06:10, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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== Blocked == |
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Well, I warned you, and you didn't listen. So I've blocked you for 24h for trolling. Please ponder the reasons for this for 24h, then come back to productive editing in areas that you have something to contribute to. But maths topics are clearly not your forte and should be avoided [[User:William M. Connolley|William M. Connolley]] ([[User talk:William M. Connolley|talk]]) 21:05, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:Please post this block to ANI for review. [[User:ChildofMidnight|ChildofMidnight]] ([[User talk:ChildofMidnight|talk]]) 21:13, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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{{unblock reviewed|I was warned to "back off the trolling on this article" in section "Butcher group". I have not edited [[Butcher group]] or its talk page since that warning. If the warning referred to some other article, that wasn't stated. For the record, I deny trolling at any article and have been actively seeking to resolve my dispute with the other user concerned.|2=When the form of the trolling is pretending to an expertise you don't have and irritating the editor/s who do understand the material, and you ignore it by doing exactly the same thing regarding the same topic just in a different article, I think it's fair to say you didn't take the warning to heart. [[User:Mangojuice|Mango]][[Special:Contributions/Mangojuice|<span style="color:orange">'''juice'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Mangojuice|talk]]</sup> 13:38, 1 July 2009 (UTC)}} |
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For clarity, does "maths topics ... should be avoided" constitute a topic ban or advice? [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 21:22, 30 June 2009 (UTC) |
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:I believe that would be advice rather than a formal topic ban, as administrators cannot, of their own accord, issue bans. That requires a ruling by the Arbitration Committee, community discussion, or an indefinite length block that nobody is willing to lift. However, usually when advice is offered in this manner, it's a good idea to follow it (not a "making-you-an-offer-you-can't-refuse" kind of good idea, just good advice). Of course, this may be dependent on the ANI discussion (which I haven't read) - if a consensus forms there to issue a ban, THAT would stick and could be enforced according to policy. [[User:Hersfold|'''''<em style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;color:blue">Hers</em><em style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;color:gold">fold</em>''''']] <sup>([[User:Hersfold/t|t]]/[[User:Hersfold/a|a]]/[[Special:Contributions/Hersfold|c]])</sup> 02:00, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::Thank you Hersfold, that's very clear and helpful, and I will bear it in mind. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 06:04, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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''For clarity, does "maths topics ... should be avoided" constitute a topic ban or advice?'' - strong advice. I'll unblock you now, if you agree to follow it [[User:William M. Connolley|William M. Connolley]] ([[User talk:William M. Connolley|talk]]) 11:11, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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:I agree it's advice. You clearly have some level of background in mathematics but too little for these advanced topics. If you decide to persist in editing them, I think you should tell us why you want to do that when your lack of background has caused so much trouble and you've been asked to stop. One explanation is trolling. Another is that you are trying to learn, but that's an inappropriate use of Wikipedia's editors. If you don't take good-intentioned advice like this to heart, it is reasonable for us to assume that you are trying to cause trouble. [[User:Mangojuice|Mango]][[Special:Contributions/Mangojuice|<span style="color:orange">'''juice'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Mangojuice|talk]]</sup> 13:38, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::Thank you WMC, but I think it best to let nature take its course at this late stage. MJ, please take a look at "Draft reply 3" below. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 20:26, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::: I've read your draft reply #3. It confirms me in my original opinions. You are very strongly advised to stay away from maths that you don't understand, including but by no means restricted to Butcher group and related topics [[User:William M. Connolley|William M. Connolley]] ([[User talk:William M. Connolley|talk]]) 21:42, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::::Thank you taking the trouble to do that. Did you spot the bit about my suggestions all being accepted? [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 21:49, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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== Block review request == |
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I have requested a block review at [[WP:ANI#Block review - uninvolved admin request]]. [[User:LadyofShalott|<font color="#ee3366">'''Lady'''</font>]][[Special:Contributions/LadyofShalott|<font color="#229922">''of''</font>]][[User_Talk:LadyofShalott|<font color="#0095c6">'''Shalott'''</font>]] 00:15, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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:Thank you, I appreciate it. I may try to post some comments here, since unfortunately I am not in a position to participatein the discussion in which my conduct (among others) is being criticised. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 06:05, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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===Draft reply 2=== |
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I must also take issue with this statement by William Connelly: |
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:<small>This is complex maths, and most people have wisely noticed that they don't understand it well enough to even tell whether AKN is contributing usefully or not. The few with enough knowledge have realised that he isn't. I noticed too, and warned him to stay away (which is why Why do a few uninformed comments on the talk page merit a block etc shows an insufficient reading of the situation). He chose to ignore that warning, so I blocked him. AKN should keep away from maths stuff he doesn't understand</small> |
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:* "The few with enough knowledge have realised that he isn't." I disagree. The record shows David Eppstein doubtful about my contributions, Shell supportive. Mathsci refers to another editors opinion but that editor has not commented in person. This is not a consensus. I remind you that Mathsci actually accepted all three of my suggested improvements, which I think is evisdence of the usefulness of my contributions. |
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:* "He chose to ignore that warning". I disagree. I was warned to stay away from [[Butcher group]], and did so. No other warning was given. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 07:54, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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===Draft reply 3=== |
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Much of the discussion of my contributions is based on notion that I have no expertise in mathematics. The logic appears to run in the circle "he is not an expert so his statements must be nonsense" and "his statements are nonsense so he can't be an expert". I should prefer to be judged purely on the content of my contributions but that appears to have become impossible in this present climate, in which my lack of expertise appears to be taken for granted following the astonishing campaign of repetition and misquotation. Charles Matthews presents the interesting variation that I'm so non-expert that I must actually be an expert. Astonishingly no-one has actually taken the elementary step of simply asking me what my qualifications are! |
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* I have a first-class degree in a mathematical subject from an established British university. That is all I propose to say on that matter. |
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* The quality of my suggested specific contributions to [[Butcher group]] can be judged from the simple fact that they were all accepted by Mathsci and incorporated in the article. |
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* My training and knowledge enable me to comment on such matters as: |
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**That a group has an identity and inverse elements and its specification is not complete without them |
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**That a group is not the same thing as a formalism |
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**That the terms involving negative powers on a Laurent series (its principal part) characterise the rate of divergence near an isolated singularity |
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**That two different systems of equations may define the same algebraic variety in characteristic zero but not in characteristic three |
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Mathsci has worked assiduously to promote the notion that I must be an ignoramus. His descriptions (almost always presented without diffs) are seriously misleading. |
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* I made the comment "To those of us who barely know what a group is, the initial sentence as it stands is confusing" [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=298608906&oldid=298607822] which "us" refers to the whole community of non-experts in the context of a discussion on how to phrase the opening sentence. Mathsci has chosen to interpret that as "as he freely admitted, he didn't know what a group was." [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=299647008&oldid=299646727] This misquotation is hard to understand as anything but a deliberate distortion. |
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* I referred to the introductory paragraph of [[renormalisation group]] as "somewhat incomprehensible" [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Butcher_group&diff=299358347&oldid=299347621], again in the context of discussion of opening sentences for non-experts. I think that is an accurate assessment of what is intended to to be an introduction for the non-expert. Mathsci drops the context and presents it as if it were an admission of personal incompetence [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=prev&oldid=299642657]. This is again misleading. |
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[[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 20:01, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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===Draft reply 4=== |
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Nishkid asserts that "A.K.Nole is "Elonka" spelled backwards? This user's first edits were to Simutronics, the company Elonka works for" [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=299693467&oldid=299693314]. Since I've been getting a lot of stick for pointing out that "MathSci" is a registered trademark, I'm surprised that Nishkid chooses to comment on mine. If the implication is that it's inappropriate, by all means take it to the appropriate forum. If the implication is that I'm supposedly a sockpuppet of Elonka, by all means take that up too. (I'm not, by the way.) If the implication is that I should discuss whether or not it's my real name, then I consider that a form of [[WP:OUTING]]. |
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However I need to point that (contrary to what is being said here) my first edits were actually to [[University of Gloucestershire]] and [[Trotter]] — two articles which Mathsci has recently developed a surprising interest in, by the way. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 20:18, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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===Draft reply 5=== |
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I see that my comments here were too terse (and at least one enior mathematics editor was led astray by that). The article needs to ''either'' specify characteristic zero ''or'' handle the case of positive characteristic, and especially the case of characteristic three. Specifically, in characteristic three the equation |
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:<math> X^3 + Y^3 + Z^3 + W^3 = (X+Y+Z+W)^3</math> |
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presented here for the Clebsch surface has a linear hypersurface as underlying set of points but the equations |
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:<math>\displaystyle x_0+x_1+x_2+x_3+x_4 = 0</math> |
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:<math>\displaystyle x_0^3+x_1^3+x_2^3+x_3^3+x_4^3 = 0</math> |
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given in the article [[Clebsch surface]] in characteristic three define the same sets of points, and hence the underlying set of points is a linear three-hold. [[User:A.K.Nole|A.K.Nole]] ([[User talk:A.K.Nole#top|talk]]) 20:37, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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==Editors who want to collaborate== |
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Hey A.K. Your block is, of course absurd, to say the least. You might try working with GTBacchus on different maths articles if those topics are also of interest to you. I appreciate your good faith and interest, so let me know if there are any topics I can help out on. |
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Usually there's enough room on Wikipedia to let the spoil sports have their way and to just steer clear. The problems with the [[Butcher group]] article are plain to see, and if those working on it would rather attack anyone who wants to help instead of working with them, then that's their loss. Cheers. Sorry about your block. Totally an inane and absurd joke given the abusive behavior by you-know-who on that article's talk page and elsewhere. [[User:ChildofMidnight|ChildofMidnight]] ([[User talk:ChildofMidnight|talk]]) 22:11, 1 July 2009 (UTC) |
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== User name == |
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Per my comment [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AAdministrators%27_noticeboard%2FIncidents&diff=299796215&oldid=299796007 here], can you at the very least clarify whether the resemblance of your user name to that of another editor is entirely coincidental or not? If not, it's probably good for you to elaborate on that. It's a straightforward question, and in no way am I suggesting that you should reveal any personal information whatsoever. But I think you could understand how there could be concerns when an editor chooses a user name closely related to that of another editor. --[[User:Bigtimepeace|Bigtimepeace]] <small>| [[User_talk:Bigtimepeace|talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Bigtimepeace|contribs]]</small> 00:34, 2 July 2009 (UTC) |
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:I don't at all mean to badger you, but just want some clarity on this. I certainly never though you were User:Elonka, but per [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AAdministrators%27_noticeboard%2FIncidents&diff=299838825&oldid=299838733 this], are you saying that the fact that your username is "Elonka" spelled backward is purely coincidental? No details necessary, just a simple yes or no would suffice. --[[User:Bigtimepeace|Bigtimepeace]] <small>| [[User_talk:Bigtimepeace|talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Bigtimepeace|contribs]]</small> 06:49, 2 July 2009 (UTC) |
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::I think this is something you really need to address, and if you don't want to do it here on your talk page or on ANI you can e-mail me in private (it's enabled at my user page). I've looked at some of your edits, and to say the least it stretches credulity that your username is not somehow related to Elonka. I'm sure there might well be an innocent explanation, but if not it could be an issue. I was going to post some information about this on [[WP:ANI]] but will hold off on that until you address this here or elsewhere. I apologize for bothering you about this repeatedly but just want to update the situation from where I sit. --[[User:Bigtimepeace|Bigtimepeace]] <small>| [[User_talk:Bigtimepeace|talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Bigtimepeace|contribs]]</small> 08:09, 2 July 2009 (UTC) |
Latest revision as of 20:26, 24 May 2013
Goodbye
Well, I'm off. Apparently Wikipedia is the sort of project where one user can pursue a campaign of threats, insults, misquotation, denigration and privacy violation, culminating in calling me a liar to my face and nobody bats an eyelid. A.K.Nole (talk) 06:25, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
- I am very sorry for your experience – indeed, this one particular user does engage in below-the-belt practices and wikipedia enforcement mechanisms have been powerless to stop him so far. As R.e.b told you, from a practical point of view, it is often easier and more constructive to disgengage and keep editing other articles, both for you and for others. I do hope that you'll find a way to return to wikipedia after a rest and I wish you many more productive edits and much satisfaction with your good work. Arcfrk (talk) 07:16, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
- I think several people batted an eye, furrowed a brow, and even harrumphed. But certainly Wikipedia isn't perfect. There are lots of other articles and editors after all. Take care. Thanks for your good efforts and helpful suggestions and comments. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:08, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
Standard offer
A discussion on the WP:Standard offer for this used is undergoing at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard#Standard offer for User:A.K.Nole.--Salix (talk): 20:26, 24 May 2013 (UTC)