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Who do I have to ask to get an OK on posting models on that article, or should I just put on my flak jacket and helmet and see what happens? --[[User:Wiarthurhu|matador300]] 23:44, 4 August 2006 (UTC) |
Who do I have to ask to get an OK on posting models on that article, or should I just put on my flak jacket and helmet and see what happens? --[[User:Wiarthurhu|matador300]] 23:44, 4 August 2006 (UTC) |
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:You completely miss the point of Wikipedia. You don't ask permission - you look at the WP guidelines - and if you think you are doing the right thing, you just 'be bold' and do it. '''''However''''' when someone reverts your work - you shouldn't get all defensive and paranoid - you should rationally discuss with the community of editors the reason it was reverted - and not get into revert wars by repeatedly reposting things that a majority of other editors think is wrong - ''no matter how right you personally believe you are''. So it was not in any way "wrong" to post your pinewood derby racer onto AMC Matador ''the first time'' - it was a bold experiment that you evidently thought made sense. What was wrong (terribly wrong) was that after several other people (myself included) patiently explained that we felt it was unsuitable, you flew off into revert wars - diatribes about how everyone is out to get you, you posted the same photo in a couple of other inappropriate areas, you added junk text to try to further justify it, you accused me of vandalism, you violated WP:3RR, you engaged in flamefests about every change we made to the article...I could go on. That in turn got you a '''''nasty''''' reputation that's going to be exceedingly hard to shake off. Now you have a bad reputation (deservedly IMHO), your 'bold moves' just come off a bloody annoying and every time you do something like that, you'll have a battle on your hands. So for chrissakes don't put on your flak jacket, helmet and aspestos underwear and 'be bold'...now you have to play as a team member, do more listening than talking and wait for tempers to cool off. You've really upset a lot of normally mild-mannered people (me included). It's really quite hard for me to talk to you at all - let alone politely. Right now, I think a mandatory one year ban from the site would be the best fix for you...but I'm not an admin - so I don't get to do that. Better still would be if you just voluntarily took a Wikiholiday for six months. In short - PLEASE GO AWAY AND STOP ANNOYING ME! [[User:SteveBaker|SteveBaker]] 14:17, 5 August 2006 (UTC) |
Revision as of 14:17, 5 August 2006
Procuring images
Steve, thanks for your suggestions on Talbot Tagora images. I actually know that all, if you'd look at the sources of the Tagora article you'd find the Simca Talbot Club there :D I was just focusing on procuring some other images (have quite many from one forum already), and I am really looking forward to seeing your email to the AMC Matador guy, the boilerplate ones I linked to in the WikiProject discussion aren't really that great. I don't speak French, so the French sources are quite out of the question (unless I get some French-speaking Wikipedian to help me), but there is one guy in the UK who seems to be a know-it-all on Tagoras and I think he had like three of them, I just need to dig out his email address.
Anyway, I would be really glad to know your opinion on the Tagora article in its entirety, the picture notwithstanding, especially now that the sentence was corrected. Perhaps you could say whether you totally object this nomination or maybe even conditionally support if a free picture is procured? I also think this whole picture discussion is quite irrelevant to the nomination, so if you share my thoughts on that perhaps we could move it here :D
What do you think about my idea about institutionalizing the Free Picture Procurement process, with a bit of a competition spirit, trying to beat the general targets and also to be the first to "complete the brand" you selected? Bravada, talk - 19:39, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
PS. I know I owe you the section on Mini Spiritual concept cars. I'll get down to that when I'm done with the current business!
- I'm not sure where this 'boilerplate' thing came from - I never wrote a boilerplate message for people to send. In fact, I think it's better not to do that - let's be more personal - show that we care. What I actually did in the AMC Matador case was to send an eBay 'question for seller' to the guy that was selling his Matador. It simply said: "This is a bit cheeky - but would you mind if I used the main photo of your AMC Matador to illustrate the article on the Matador on Wikipedia? There isn't a single decent copyright-free image out there that I can find. Good luck with selling your car - it looks nice." - when he replied saying that is was OK - I asked him if he would release the image into the public domain without copyright restrictions and he replied that he would - and asked that I send him the URL of the article - which I did.
- This technique works every time. I have a (non-Wikipedia) web page[1] for MINI Cooper owners where I attempted to get one photo of every possible paint scheme for the car (there are about 100 combinations!) - I asked dozens of people for photos, just asking nicely. I wasn't ever once refused by any car owner. The only refusal I ever got was when I asked the car manufacturer to use a photo of one of the cars from their web site! SteveBaker 20:01, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
- Umm, I guess it's a bit more complicated than that. I believe one needs to get a permission to release the pic into public domain with the full understanding of the issue from the author. I thought you have some ready lines on how to do that swiftly, but if not then I'll have to come up with something. I already committed a massive post explaining the issue to my fellow forum members and am already getting responses, so I guess I'll deal with that too :D Bravada, talk - 20:12, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
- Hi Steve! I was wondering whether you got my email with my correspondence with Dave Chapman, and/or perhaps had some time to contact Dave yourself. I must say there are some really massive efforts by many users and persons I managed to talk into that :D to procure a Tagora image - as of now, I have replaced the brochure image with an outright publicity (press) photo and added a rationale following the example given by Outriggr. Do you believe the article as is is a good FA candidate? Could you perhaps express your view on its FAC page? Bravada, talk - 11:37, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
- It looks like my Spam filters caught your message and dumped it into my low priority mail queue - sorry about that! I've tried a less formal approach and emailed Dave Chapman - we'll see how it goes. SteveBaker 13:24, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
- Hi Steve! As you might have seen, I have managed to finally get some free photos for the Tagora article. Perhaps you could take a look at the article now and see whether you still have reservations as concerns its FA nomination. I would be grateful for our definitive support or opposition - the Tagora is currently the first in line to be kicked out of the FAC list, and I would hate it to fall through because not enough "votes" were cast. Even if it's an "oppose" it would be good, as I hope you would give some directions as to how to improve the article further.
- I was also wondering whether you got any reply from Dave Chapman, as I believe the article could still use more/better pictures. Thanks! Bravada, talk - 12:05, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
- No - I didn't get any kind of a reply. We need to find some other members of that club. SteveBaker 14:01, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
- Sorry to hear that. In the meantime, I have found out that Keith Adams might actually have a Tagora [2], and he seems to have been behind the creation of the whole Rootes-Chrysler.co.uk site. He might actually be a WP editor, as the user who created his entry and several related ones has a login suspiciously similar to his email handle... Bravada, talk - 14:30, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
- No - I didn't get any kind of a reply. We need to find some other members of that club. SteveBaker 14:01, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
Mini photo
Hi, I notice you were a prominent part of shepherding the Mini articles to featured article status and thought you might like to take a look at another Mini photo showing a family receiving the keys to a brand new Morris Mini Minor. Don't they look psyched! Pedant 20:28, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
- Wow! That is a VERY interesting photo - the car has no chrome grille - it's like the Mini pickup truck and van which had the grille removed to save money. Then there is that very exciting set of cow catchers around the front of the car. I've never seen a Mini like that. MANY *MANY* thanks for that photo. SteveBaker 12:49, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
- It's a Mk I Mini - but I don't think it can be 1959. Minis weren't sold in the USA until late in 1960 - but in any case, the badge on the bonnet is from a much later Mk I. Up until about 1965 cars either had the Morris badge or the Austin badge - they didn't get the 'MINI' badge until later still. I'm going to ask around some local experts and see if we can get a more accurate date. Where did you get the photo? SteveBaker 12:52, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
- If you dramatically boost the image brightness you can see a bunch of Morris Minors in the background - so presumably this dealership sold lots of Morris cars (and yes - if you magnify the bonnet of the Mini, it's a Morris badge). SteveBaker 03:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
Oh didn't know...
World Jump Day
Thanks for adding that additional information onto the end of my comment (and moving my comment into a new section) about the numbers of people changing.
ArbCom
I noticed your comment on the page, yet there are many examples from above, even from edits on the page you refer to. This is a peculiar stand to take on the issue. --69.232.50.106 22:42, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Sorry - I call 'em like I see 'em. Look at CoolCaesars posts to Talk:Computer and tell me what's wrong with them. I don't always agree with what he says (like the debate over what photo to use) - but he was polite and argued reasonably. That's not to say he doesn't 'lose it' from time to time - but all I've personally seen has been OK behavior. SteveBaker 00:49, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
User:Wiarthurhu
I noticed you intend to take Wiarthurhu to mediation for violation of Wiki rules. There is an open User Conduct Request for Comment on Wiarthurhu: Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/Wiarthurhu. You may find it of use (or not)--Mmx1 02:38, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
- And your opinon of the conduct of Karmann? I'm the one getting run out of town. --matador300 23:34, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
- You know this Mmx1 fellow has accepted that he was in the wrong on most of the points of dispute on the F-14, and he was the first fellow to demonsrate the sort of conduct I'm finding in spades on the automobile project. As a manager, do you think you could show some leadership and tone these guys down? Sheesh. No fun being chased by guys bearing pitchforks. --matador300 23:34, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
- I have not yet run into Mmx1 and have had little to do with Karmann - so I have no opinion. I also don't have an opinion about the F-14 kerfuffle. I don't edit aircraft pages because I design flight simulators for the US military - and I'm mortally afraid that I might accidentally let slip something I know about a plane that I'm not supposed to mention - and since I'm not a US citizen, that could wind me up in a dark cell somewhere on the coast of Cuba. So I'll stick with articles about cars, computers and other things that take my fancy. I will say this - the disputes over F-14 appear to closely mirror your behavior on Automotive pages - and since your behavior on those is utterly outrageous - I'm prepared to give the guys who oppose you on F-14 the benefit of the doubt - it's not about content it's about behavior - and in your case, I don't like what I see. So, no - I'm certainly not getting drawn into a debate about the nature of the F-14. SteveBaker 23:45, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
- Just to point out, the RfC is a User Conduct RfC, not a content RfC - specifically for addressing violations of Wikipedia:Policies and guidelines. Having failed to reach compromise through the mediation process, I requested discussion of his conduct via a User Conduct RfC. While my experience with him and the posted diffs in my account were in relation to the aviation content which we disputed, all User Conduct issues are open to scrutiny in a User Conduct RfC. --Mmx1 01:25, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Chaparral pictures
Who do I have to ask to get an OK on posting models on that article, or should I just put on my flak jacket and helmet and see what happens? --matador300 23:44, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
- You completely miss the point of Wikipedia. You don't ask permission - you look at the WP guidelines - and if you think you are doing the right thing, you just 'be bold' and do it. However when someone reverts your work - you shouldn't get all defensive and paranoid - you should rationally discuss with the community of editors the reason it was reverted - and not get into revert wars by repeatedly reposting things that a majority of other editors think is wrong - no matter how right you personally believe you are. So it was not in any way "wrong" to post your pinewood derby racer onto AMC Matador the first time - it was a bold experiment that you evidently thought made sense. What was wrong (terribly wrong) was that after several other people (myself included) patiently explained that we felt it was unsuitable, you flew off into revert wars - diatribes about how everyone is out to get you, you posted the same photo in a couple of other inappropriate areas, you added junk text to try to further justify it, you accused me of vandalism, you violated WP:3RR, you engaged in flamefests about every change we made to the article...I could go on. That in turn got you a nasty reputation that's going to be exceedingly hard to shake off. Now you have a bad reputation (deservedly IMHO), your 'bold moves' just come off a bloody annoying and every time you do something like that, you'll have a battle on your hands. So for chrissakes don't put on your flak jacket, helmet and aspestos underwear and 'be bold'...now you have to play as a team member, do more listening than talking and wait for tempers to cool off. You've really upset a lot of normally mild-mannered people (me included). It's really quite hard for me to talk to you at all - let alone politely. Right now, I think a mandatory one year ban from the site would be the best fix for you...but I'm not an admin - so I don't get to do that. Better still would be if you just voluntarily took a Wikiholiday for six months. In short - PLEASE GO AWAY AND STOP ANNOYING ME! SteveBaker 14:17, 5 August 2006 (UTC)