I will be willing to go through it and remove the offending material but I will not do so if I keep being reverted and nobody supports what I'm doing.♦ [[User talk:Dr. Blofeld|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#000">Dr. Blofeld</span>]] 14:50, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
I will be willing to go through it and remove the offending material but I will not do so if I keep being reverted and nobody supports what I'm doing.♦ [[User talk:Dr. Blofeld|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#000">Dr. Blofeld</span>]] 14:50, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
:Dr. Blofeld, I understand completely how it feels to think nobody supports what you're doing. :) If you'll pardon my own weary complaint, I'm ''very'' happy that there are more contributors working copyright at the moment than there have been in some time - I'm particularly pleased by the increased participation of [[User:Drmies]] and [[User:Voceditenore]]. But I gave every spare minute of my day yesterday to cleaning up copyright, and I have been working for nearly three hours this morning on the issue immediately above yours. Realistically, I may have several hours still to go to finish with that, and probably a four day backlog at [[WP:CP]] that I'd like to catch up on while I can. I won't make it, but I'll do my best. :)
:Dr. Blofeld, I understand completely how it feels to think nobody supports what you're doing. :) If you'll pardon my own weary complaint, I'm ''very'' happy that there are more contributors working copyright at the moment than there have been in some time - I'm particularly pleased by the increased participation of [[User:Dpmuk]] and [[User:Voceditenore]]. But I gave every spare minute of my day yesterday to cleaning up copyright, and I have been working for nearly three hours this morning on the issue immediately above yours. Realistically, I may have several hours still to go to finish with that, and probably a four day backlog at [[WP:CP]] that I'd like to catch up on while I can. I won't make it, but I'll do my best. :)
:There are ways to get support, but it takes effort, I know. I've recommended an approach above that I think will help you - make notes on the talk page, invite the contributor to the talk page, reach out for backup at an appropriate fora if the contributor does not join in building consensus. If you think that the content is clearly an issue, you have the option of listing the contributor at [[WP:AIV]], but, if it is not so clear, you do have to go through other processes, such as dispute resolution noticeboards and ANI.
:There are ways to get support, but it takes effort, I know. I've recommended an approach above that I think will help you - make notes on the talk page, invite the contributor to the talk page, reach out for backup at an appropriate fora if the contributor does not join in building consensus. If you think that the content is clearly an issue, you have the option of listing the contributor at [[WP:AIV]], but, if it is not so clear, you do have to go through other processes, such as dispute resolution noticeboards and ANI.
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I believe I've now addressed most of the copyvios.♦ [[User talk:Dr. Blofeld|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#000">Dr. Blofeld</span>]] 16:31, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
I believe I've now addressed most of the copyvios.♦ [[User talk:Dr. Blofeld|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#000">Dr. Blofeld</span>]] 16:31, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
If you are here with questions about an article I have deleted or a copyright concern, please consider first reading my personal policies with regards to deletion and copyright, as these may provide your answer.
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Harrison Ruffin Tyler
The article on this person was deleted in 2008 for not having notoriety for being a living grandson of president tyler. You stated in the talk section that if recent articles were found on this subject that he should be retained. Apparently the world figured this out two weeks ago and there were articles written in the Huffington post, Politoco, New York Times, etc and a CBS Presidents day interview. Is it possible to revive the old article? --weum2004(talk)—Preceding undated comment added 03:19, 21 February 2012 (UTC).[reply]
Hi. :) That's not exactly what I said; i said at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Harrison Ruffin Tyler that the article should be deleted "unless somebody produces evidence that this individual has substantial coverage in reliable secondary sources." It's not really about the sources being recent; it's about them being substantial. If you think that the sources are substantial enough to verify that he meets notability guidelines, then an article on him may well be appropriate.
In terms of restoring the old article, it is possible, but you would need to take the request to Wikipedia:Deletion review, which lists among its uses "if significant new information has come to light since a deletion and the information in the deleted article would be useful to write a new article." You might consider speaking to the administrator who deleted the article first. He is not often active these days, but may still be able to return to assist you. You can find him at User talk:Mr.Z-man. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 03:26, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actual Art
Sorry did it wrong....what happened to Actual Art?...thank youPalofierros (talk) 14:30, 9 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. :) A contributor detected that the article was created with content taken from this website. The creator of the article was notified of the issue and given several steps that could be taken to repair it, here. For over seven days, the article was held in a waiting period to give the creator time to do that or to allow any other contributor to rewrite the material, if the website would not grant license. When nothing was done, the article was deleted, as we are not able to reproduce content from most sources without verified license. (Copyright protection in the United States (which governs us) is granted automatically.) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:13, 10 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I find at the bottom of the Actual Art Foundation web site that it says,"This material is released into the public domain Palofierros (talk) 13:38, 12 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
You find this? It did not say that on the 10th, when I last looked at the website. :)
I'm going to assume based on this that you are involved with the Actual Art Foundation and encourage you to modify that statement, unless the Actual Art Foundation is actually in position to release images by artists such as Alexia Nikov, Tery Fugate-Wilcox, and Maria Ceppe into the public domain. The statement as it currently is does that. The article can be restored, but I would like to resolve this issue before doing so on the precedence of some recent claims by a Russian website to release content owned by the Beatles. We need to make sure that you aren't inadvertently granting more than you intend. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:45, 12 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
thank you for your concern and quick responce.......i am not of the Actual Art Foundation, but i could ask the director/chairman to clarify the issue here if that would help.......Palofierros (talk) 16:20, 18 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
That would be great. :) But where the issue would need clarification is on the website itself, unless the Actual Art Foundation does own copyright to those artworks and intend to release those photographs of them for reuse, including commercial reuse and modification. Some artists are comfortable with such releases, but it's good to be sure of that in case they're not, before they find their artwork on a t-shirt somewhere with no recourse. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 21:33, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Roger Casement and the Black Diaries
Thank you for your message about this article. You indicated that no rewrite to avoid the copyrighted material had been proposed, and that therefore the whole article was being deleted. I am sorry that I have had no prior experience with cases of this kind. I had offered earlier on the Talk webpage to help rewrite the article and asked for information about which the problem sections were. I assumed -- due to lack of experience of the process -- that I would hear back from an admin on the request and the offer. I am sorry to hear now that it has been deleted -- there was a good deal of solid work in the article undertaken independently by other users that had nothing at all to do with Mr. Mannerings (or his co-author) and their article. To be more future-focused, can I ask if, even now, you are able to share with me and other users the identity of the specific text passages in the WP article about which Mr. Mannerings (or his co-author) have made their complaint and assertion of copyright? With this information and a few days notice, as I've suggested before, I for one would certainly be willing to take a close look at the challenge and see if a rewrite seemed feasible. My instinct is that the answer would probably be yes. Nandt1 (talk) 06:17, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. I'm sorry that the function of the copyright problems listing was not clear. :/ These articles are listed typically for a week to permit the community time to secure permission, which I gather wasn't possible, or to rewrite the article. If you look at the template (Template:Copyviocore), it cautions that, "Unless the copyright status of the text on this page is clarified, it may be deleted one week after the time of its listing" and it offers guidance on how and where to rewrite the article on its face. In that guidance, it notes that "if the original copyright violation cannot be cleanly removed or the article reverted to a prior version, it is best to write the article from scratch". I can see that "no rewrite proposed" would be confusing in this circumstance; I'm afraid it's the standard text that I use when I mean that nobody has rewritten the article in the temporary space provided so that I have nothing with which to replace the copyright problem.
The rewrite you want to do can still be done. I had left the talk page of the article rather than deleting it so that we could continue to discuss the situation, which is unusual in that the content is actually still in the history of the article from which it was split: Roger Casement. Sometimes I will leave articles up longer than the listing period in this situation to allow time for the rewrite, but since the material is still accessible at its original point and since we have an angry copyright holder demanding that the article be removed, it seemed prudent in this case not to keep it around while the article is rewritten. :)
The copyright holder claims content was copied from multiple works of his and demands that they be taken down. We don't know exactly how much was copied from him, but we do know that content was copied; it can be identified in the specific source he referenced. I'm afraid that even the lede you carefully constructed borrowed content from the earlier text on the page, so I cannot be sure what, if anything, was safe to use. While the older content can still be accessed in writing a new article, the new article should be substantially written from scratch because it is not possible to identify the exact passages that are a problem here. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:03, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I am still learning here. As I understand the above, though: (i) the copyright holder was not obliged to identify (and did not in fact identify) the specific passages in the article where he maintains that his copyright was violated, and (ii) Wikipedia has no mechanism (?) for asking him to specify such passages. It would obviously be enormously helpful if in fact you could ask him to do so.
Even assuming you cannot, I am bound to say that it seems to me extreme to suppose that we have to throw out everything that was in the earlier article: there is, as I said before, a great deal there that is sourced independently and/or does not depend in any way on anything Mr. Mannerings has ever written. But I take it that your more general point is that one should err on the side of caution rather than the reverse.
Can I obtain access to the original complaint that was made? And any other supporting information from you own internal review? Nandt1 (talk) 15:18, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'm afraid that the original letter is accessible only to OTRS volunteers. I've explained at my staff talk page how to apply for that, if you wish. I identified several passages that were copied from his websites using the duplication detector tool, which was linked from the template that blanked the article.
Aside from a few modifications, the material is still accessible in the history of the older article (I've linked to it above). If you want to try to use that content to create a new article, you would be very welcome to do so. However, while content might not seem dependent on anything Mr. Mannerings wrote, that does not mean it wasn't copied from Mr. Mannerings. Sometimes people copy content and sources are later added by somebody else; sometimes people copy content and use the sources they took from the original. I would encourage you to be very careful in reusing any of the content, as we are each legally liable for our actions on Wikipedia and as the copyright holder is extremely unhappy with the use of his content on Wikipedia. As WP:C says, "Never use materials that infringe the copyrights of others. This could create legal liabilities and seriously hurt Wikipedia. If in doubt, write the content yourself, thereby creating a new copyrighted work which can be included in Wikipedia without trouble." This is always good practice, but particularly so when infringement has occurred.
If you want to ask Mr. Mannerings to look at the content as it previously existed here and tell you what specifically he claims was his own, you certainly may, particularly as your note at the talk page suggests you have already been in contact with him. I have not; I am not the agent who addressed his letters and given the tone of his communication don't think we should. But it does not require administrator tools to coordinate with a copyright holder, and if you would rather try to salvage the material you certainly may. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 16:12, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I've left a message to that effect at his Talk page. We'll see. Nandt1 (talk) 19:22, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
What we are seeing, I'm afraid, is that he doesn't reply..... Nandt1 (talk) 02:18, 19 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
and if there's one person I have to give something to, it's you. I see I'm the first as well...Have a great day, and thanks for all you do! (I tried writing a haiku, but you have no idea what a syllable buster "Moon-rid-den-girl" is ;). NoleloverTalk·Contribs 13:38, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! And sorry for having a syllable-bustering username. You can always use the much shorter Maggie, but Moonriddengirl is much more mellifluous. :D --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:30, 15 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
An email granting copyright permission will be coming from the Founding Director of the MASB organization. Thank you for your help! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Karenmharvey (talk • contribs) 20:42, 11 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi MRG! I've taken the liberty of moving this to the bottom for visibility. Is there any indication that the necessary OTRS permission has been received? The article is still languishing at Wikipedia:Copyright problems/2012 February 4. Should I relist it on today's CP or just leave it there? Frankly, the website may grant permission for their stuff and the pdf, but I highly doubt the book (Marketing Metrics: The Definitive Guide to Measuring Marketing Performance) will be given a CC-BY-SA 3.0. It's copyright to Pearson Education (a big commercial publisher). The problem is, many articles edited/created by Karenmharvey now contain or consist almost entirely of lengthy quotes from this book, e.g. Annual growth %. All these probably need to be checked if the book permission isn't forthcoming.:/ Best, Voceditenore (talk) 14:30, 16 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Wow. We've got a backlog of 130 tickets in permissions on En! :( Let me look for the ticket. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:01, 16 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
It's not there yet. I found a rejected permission letter from July 2011 (2011071210016178), but it was rejected for what should have been easily reparable issues. I have no idea why they didn't repair them. :/ Let's relist it once, but you're probably right about the book. Can you just copy over some of your note here at the relisting? If I'm the admin who addresses the article, I'll check the others as well at that time. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:24, 16 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Regarding the MASB permissions, an email granting copyright permission (for both the website and the PDF) was sent to "permissions-en@wikimedia.org" on 11 February 2012. If you need me to forward a copy of this email to someone, please let me know.
Regarding the Marketing Metrics book, the authors have granted their permission to use the work and Jeanne Glasser, an executive editor at Pearson, is currently working with me, the authors, and Pearson's lawyers to determine the best way to handle turning over the copyright. Again, if you need verification of this, please let me know. You may email me directly at karenmharvey@gmail.com.
Karenmharvey—Preceding undated comment added 16:06, 24 February 2012 (UTC).[reply]
Photos
Okay, I'm finally getting some headway with photos. For the article Millennium Park Bus Depot, I requested two sources to supply non-free copyrighted images to me so as to use in the article. I mailed them for permission. Guess what? Both of them sent me confirmations! Yay! Now please tell me how do I upload these photos, providing fair-use rationales and showing that permission has been provided? The two sources told me that the mails sent can be used as their confirmation for use, provided I cite them as source and state that the photos are from them. Please respond fast. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 13:55, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Great. :) If you have permission that conforms to our licensing requirements, you don't need fair use rationales. What you would do is upload the images to Wikimedia Commons, explain the origins, and place {{OTRS pending}}. Then go ahead and forward the permission letters you received to permissions-commonswikimedia.org, providing a clear link in each letter to the image as uploaded. Then watch your inbox, because if there are any issues, the OTRS agent should let you know. :) If you didn't receive a clear licensing statement (one that clearly identifies the license they permitted), you may need to first ask them to send you the release statement at Wikipedia:Declaration of consent for all enquiries. Sometimes copyright holders give us permission to use content "on Wikipedia" or otherwise aren't clear on license, and we have to go back to ask for more. --User:Moonriddengirl 14:02, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Nice. However, the two sources didn't say as to which license I should use exactly. One of the sources said this, and I quote: "I am confirming that, this photo is freely usable and allowed for public use but only if u are giving some reference link to my blog". The other source stated that "we have no objection in Wiki using the picture with due credit as suggested by you." I have both the mails stating this, and both said that the mails can be used as guarantee letters. Do I need to ask them again for a specific copyright license? ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 16:34, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Btw, I had mailed Box Office India regarding copyright concerns of their figures (and I wrote a pretty long letter); unfortunately, they haven't responded despite it being 2 weeks since I sent them that. Has anybody from Wikipedia attempted to contact BOI regarding usage of its figures? I thought I could help, and I outlined several policies, but their lack of reply is rather unnerving. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 16:51, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I'm afraid you do. :/ Here's what I've found the easiest approach to be: write them, say, "Wonderful! Now all we need is for you to send us the form letter. I'm going to paste this in at the bottom of my email. If you are willing to agree to our license, please reply to my email, keeping this form in place and putting your name and the date in the spaces provided for it below. The Wikimedia Foundation will retain this licensing statement for their records."
Extended content
I hereby affirm that I am the creator and/or sole owner of the exclusive copyright of [put the URL to the work here, Ankitbhatt] I agree to publish that work under the free license "Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0" (unported) and GNU Free Documentation License (unversioned, with no invariant sections, front-cover texts, or back-cover texts). I acknowledge that by doing so I grant anyone the right to use the work in a commercial product or otherwise, and to modify it according to their needs, provided that they abide by the terms of the license and any other applicable laws.
I am aware that this agreement is not limited to Wikipedia or related sites.
I am aware that I always retain copyright of my work, and retain the right to be attributed in accordance with the license chosen. Modifications others make to the work will not be claimed to have been made by me.
I acknowledge that I cannot withdraw this agreement, and that the content may or may not be kept permanently on a Wikimedia project.
[NAME]
[DATE]
If correspondents don't seem to be getting it, I make it as simple as possible for them. :)
You can save yourself some time and trouble by asking them to carbon copy their reply to permissions-commonswikimedia.org. If they return the form and put their own name and date where you've asked them to (don't put that there for them! put the URL in, but not that), then they'll have given explicit consent to the license. The only issue you might really run into then is if their email address doesn't clearly connect them to the website where the image was originally published.
If I'm misunderstanding you and the images aren't currently online, I'll need to tweak that language a bit. Let me know. :)
And with regards to BOI, yes, they have been contacted. From what I understood, they were considering it, but then they stopped responding. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:11, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
No problem, actually. I just sent them a mail telling them that I'll release the photos under the tag; I asked them to reply saying that they confirm allowing me to release under the given tag. They said yes. Simple. The photos are now available; i forwarded all the necessary mails to the e-mail ID you gave. Thanks a ton for your help, now I feel more confident when I want to upload photos :D. You can check up the photos in this article :).
Regarding BOI, I sent them a LONG letter asking them to release their figures under a license, telling them of the benefits both sides would get. They didn't respond back, and its been more than a month. Its unfortunate :(. Cheers! ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 08:31, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Can I help?
Dear MRG, I've been absent for a while and have only just caught up with recent CP developments. Since SCV is currently blank, can I help at CP? I did a couple today but realise that I probably should volunteer as a trainee clerk first to be able to help out properly at CP. Shall I just go ahead and volunteer myself at WP:CP/C?--CharlieDelta (talk) 20:01, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi! I missed all these yesterday when I was catching up. I can't believe it. I thought I'd answered everything. :/
Anyway, sorry for the delay. You certainly can help at CP; we need all the help we can get. :) If you'd like to volunteer as a trainee, go for it. Please just let me know, so that I can come and support you. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:12, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I think it may be an overall problem of IP editors from the past, however I do believe there is one particular editor who may need to be warned and if they persist, perhaps some sanction or another. Depends on if all they are doing is baiting me or really just commiting plagerism.--Amadscientist (talk) 23:40, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hopefully, they're not intending to cause any issues and will be corrected as they see local conventions. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:15, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This article references a 1931 or 2(?) obituary. It reads as if it's been copied directly from it, but I haven't seen the original, and it doesn't state that it incorporates text directly. Advice? LadyofShalott 19:02, 18 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
That's very helpful, Sphilbrick. :) Looking at the original, I believe this is an issue under our current guidelines on plagiarism, but not a copyright problem. I don't see a notice anywhere on that document, so I believe it should be public domain. I've tried to make it a little bit more readable and have added the attribution necessary to avoid plagiarism. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:20, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you both. I finally got back to this, and see that MRG has taken care of it. LadyofShalott 18:05, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Barnstars and a few questions
The Copyright Cleanup Barnstar
I'm sure you'll probably have piles of these, yet an extra one can never hurt.--&レア (talk) 16:09, 19 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Moonriddengirl! Aside from the barnstar, I wanted to come by and ask a few things.
In the Fashion in Milan article, I was quoting a book, and I wrote this - Producing fashion: commerce, culture, and consumers, Regina Lee Blaszcyzk [1] ECW University of Pennsylvania Press, 2008, p.47 (Chapter three: Elisabetta Merlo and Francesca Polese) [an example]. Is it right according to MoS to put that (Chapter three:...) part, because, if I am not wrong, the chapter I am quoting from does not seem to actually have been written by Regina Lee Blaszcyzk, but Elisabetta Merlo and Francesca Polese (though I'm not sure)?
Secondly, I added a photo of the Via Monte Napoleone street sign to the top of the Fashion in Milan page since I believe it summarises the essence of the article well. This is not a major concern, more of a curiosity, but regarding the freedom of panorama in Italy, is it alright to put street signs and things? (I'm pretty sure it's possible, yet if not I can replace it with another image). Could you also explain to me a bit about the whole story around FOP?
Thirdly and lastly, I think I have spotted a copyvio on the Music (Madonna album) page. In a part of the introduction it says "which further developed Madonna's move toward European dance music" and in the composition section "and retains a rocky, American edge". Though divided up, this is almost identical to a sentence in this website, where "which develops further Madonna's move towards European Dance but still retains a rocky, american edge" ([2]) is written. At first I thought it could have been copied from Wikipedia, as many websites do, but it seems from the timestamp that it was written in 2000/2001, which would probably mean that it might be the other way round. I have no idea of the article history - it could have been written by the person who put it on the very same website, or it could be allowed to feature on the article, yet, considering your experience, may you please have a look at it?
(Talk-page stalker responding to first question) If you use {{cite book}}, you should follow the model under "Citing a chapter in a book with different authors for different chapters and an editor", so the filled-in template would look something like {{cite book |last1=Merlo |first1=Elisabetta |last2=Polese |first2=Francesca |editor-first=Regina Lee |editor-last=Blaszczyk |title=Producing Fashion: Commerce, Culture, and Consumers |publisher=University of Pennsylvania Press |location=Philadelphia |date=2008 |page=47 |chapter=Accessorizing, Italian Style: Creating a Market for Milan's Fashion Merchandise |isbn=0-8122-4037-5}}, which would produce
Merlo, Elisabetta; Polese, Francesca (2008). "Accessorizing, Italian Style: Creating a Market for Milan's Fashion Merchandise". In Blaszczyk, Regina Lee (ed.). Producing Fashion: Commerce, Culture, and Consumers. Philadelphia: University of Pennsylvania Press. p. 47. ISBN 0-8122-4037-5.
Thank you, &レア. :) And thank you, Deor for explaining the {{cite book}} options.
In terms of your other questions, Italy doesn't have a "freedom of panorama" exception but I really am inclined to think that this sign should be okay. I do not think it is likely to be creative enough to warrant copyright protection. The name of the street is not protected; the typography is not protected; the only real protection could be in the arrangement of elements. If you want further opinion, though, you might ask at WP:MCQ.
With respect to the article, the content was added in 2005 here, and it's pretty obvious that what remains is derivative. I've taken it out. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 16:25, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/Capolinho. I've found issues in every article I've looked at to which he added substantive content. It's a short CCI, but I suspect will result in removal of all or most content he's added. Sometimes he cites his actual sources; sometimes he does not. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 15:16, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Busy today (but managed to delete one copyvio article), maybe tomorrow. Dougweller (talk) 17:16, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Requesting your opinion as a 3rd set of eyes
I've been told you're great with WP:MILHIST articles; would you be interested in doing me the favor of taking a quick look at Lavrentiy Beria as well as the talk page? It technically falls under Wikipedia:WikiProject_Military_history/Russian,_Soviet_and_CIS_military_history_task_force, but I don't want to bother the whole task force when all I'm really trying to do is get some actual discussion going so I'm not the only guy adding sources. Due to the low editorship I can't really get any kind of reasonable consensus, and the one other guy who edits it doesn't use the talk page and doesn't like my sources. I would value your opinion. Thanks! Bravo Foxtrot (talk) 02:45, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. :) It looks as though the editor with whom you disagree is talking to you at User talk:Greyhood#Removal of cited content from Lavrenti Beria. Probably the best thing to do here is to ask him to engage in discussion at the talk page of the article and, if the two of you can't agree, to invite either a WP:3O or to take the matter for neutral commentary at WP:DRN. The 3O process requests notes left without signatures so that whoever responds does not start off with an unconscious predisposition towards the person who made the request. I wouldn't want to risk seeming to be biased towards you, as I might, unless I happen to disagree with you. :)
I will note that the entire section relies very heavily on a single source. It may be a perfectly accurate source (I have no background in this subject), but it is always helpful to bring in other sources. There seem to be lots of them: [3], [4], [5], [6]. Adding several more sources would help. Book sources are fantastic, but aren't always easy to "verify" if people challenge content. Support from sources that can be accessed online will help settle disputes for those unfamiliar with the subject. Also, relying on multiple sources will help document that the material is not "undue" weight (the concern of only one or two biographers) but is also covered by others. All around, a good thing for contentious material. :)
Since I've never worked on the article and don't have time, I'm afraid, to do a proper job of adding more sourcing, I haven't changed anything there. I have changed the section header discussing the matter on the talk page from "User:Greyhood deleted the section again" to "Content deleted again". As I note there, according to the list of contributors, as of this writing Greyhood has edited the article only four times:
I'm afraid that the prior header is likely to prejudice people against him, as it suggests he is repeatedly removing this content without discussion. :/ It seems it may have prejudiced the only editor who has thus far responded, given his reference to Greyhood continuing to make a nuisance of himself. In general, it's really a good idea to focus on the content rather than the contributor when discussing issues and to be very careful when accusing others of misbehavior to be sure that misbehavior can be substantiated. I would encourage you to reread that section and to strike out anything that may move the focus of talk from the issue to the editor.
Hopefully Greyhood will join the conversation at the talk page and you will be able to resolve this without need of further dispute resolution. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:34, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Bot update
After a slight delay due to coding burn out (coding is a major part of my day job as well and it wasn't going well in the middle of the week) I think I have the pseudo-bot code sorted and a couple of minor problems ironed out - one of these was that it wasn't detecting the source parameter in close paraphrase as I'd coded it to look for a url parameter and as plenty of people had incorrectly used a url parameter it was returning sources for some pages so I didn't notice the problem at first. This means some of the backlog pages are listed without a source when they have one. This is now sorted.
I've just spent some time getting the bot to detect edit conflicts. I want to give the rewritten code a test run at the end of today and if it works I'll submit it at BRFA. Still trying to get my toolserver account reactivated so not sure when I can get it running in it's final form but I should, temporarily, be able to run it automatically form my laptop once I have permission to run in bot mode.
Finally, if you add a copyright=no parameter/value to a close paraphrase tag then the pseudo-bot should ignore it. This isn't fully tested so it would be great if you let me know the first time you used it. Dpmuk (talk) 06:55, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Awesome! I will, indeed, and, please, don't let yourself burn out on it. We've been without copyright bots for a long time, and it won't hurt us to have it on pseudomanual to keep you happy and engaged. :D --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:42, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Well I spent all of Wednesday digging through work code only to decide it was odd data. That sort of put me off looking at code for a while. Am happy to look at it again now. I do plan on taking a bit of a break once it's been through BRFA as what with RfA, BRFA, coding bot, updating user pages, etc. etc. all in the last week or so I could do with a bit of a break. Want to see the bot running first however. Dpmuk (talk) 21:05, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
On a different note, are you happy with my new user page. You'll notice that I both point people at your user page and quote from it so I thought I'd check you were OK with it. Dpmuk (talk) 07:39, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Congratulations on passing your RFA! I was out of town or would have stopped by when it happened. I'm absolutely delighted to have you onboard and welcome your coming by at any point you want an opinion or a second set of eyes. I've always thought that one of the greatest strengths of Wikipedia is our collaborative nature; we don't have to work alone. There are plenty of editors who can attest that I'm never shy about asking for opinions or help when I need it. :)
I quite like your userpage, even though it makes me blush. If you want to copy any of my language, you are welcome to it. I'm glad to see you give instructions for talking about disagreements. Hopefully you won't run into too many issues, but if I can take the liberty of sharing some of my own thoughts on this...well, I can take the liberty of sharing some of my own thoughts. :D I'll just hope you don't mind.
I always try to treat people with compassion when they are shocked or angry that content has been removed for copyright reasons. I try to imagine how I would feel if I found out that I was doing something completely wrong or, just as bad, that an article I cared about and had worked on had been gutted because somebody else did something wrong. Usually, people calm down after a round or two. It helps to make your initial response very clear and to give examples of the problem, if they don't believe it's there. In my general experiences, those who don't calm down if you treat them with true civility and respect may have larger problems. It has become a red flag for me that I may be dealing with a serial copyright issue. It's not always the case, but it has been more often than not. It may be that these people become more defensive because they realize they have more to protect.
In terms of deleting copyright problems, I prefer to leave even a little stub if I can rather than deleting an article altogether. In this day of "rev deletion", this is so much easier. It was harder when I had to either rewrite the content completely from scratch or attribution specific contributors in edit summary. :) I am particularly like to try to save articles that I think may be challenged by Wikipedia:Systemic bias. In the years I've been working copyright problems, I've seen some articles that have been G12ed multiple times before ever landing at CP. It's not uncommonly the case that these articles are efforts by multiple people who don't speak English well to add something on a subject that is important to them and in their culture. Giving them one will sometimes put an end to that cycle.
Again, if you are ever in need of assistance, please don't hesitate to let me know. You are very welcome to any assistance I can offer, and in turn your assistance is much appreciated. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:40, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Well I was going to point at your page for the copyright side of things and when checking that out saw the admin bit and remembered how I thought, when I read it ages ago, what a good statement it was. Hence the copy! I agree with the second opinion stuff - hence the reason you got to deal with some stuff from me at WP:CP where I've wanted a second opinion. Can't imagine that will change just because I'm now an admin. The insight into people's reaction is interesting - I'll have to bear it in mind.
I have noticed that you're a bit more ready to stub rather than delete (or tag for deletion) than me and indeed I've taken that on board and do try to stub a bit more. The systematic bias one is something I do bear in mind, although, to date, I think I've come across it more in the context of older 'things' with unavailable sources than because of foreign languages. I think I'll be treading quite carefully while I work out how best to deal with the competing interests and the different way of dealing with things. Suspect I'll always be a bit more ready to suggest delete than you but I think we are, thankfully, both within the "discretion" area.
Oh, and I noticed when I was looking at my RfA stats that I've edited your talk page twice as often as I've edited my own. Not quite sure what to make of that! Dpmuk (talk) 21:30, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed that there's room for variance in how we approach things. :) I saw that editing statistic, too. :D I have a feeling that now that you're an admin, that will change. But, hey, if it doesn't, it's good for me. I get to benefit from you as TPS and enjoy generally collaborating on copyright work. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:30, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Just deleted my first two pages that were listed at WP:CP. Even bearing in mind what you said above I could see no way to save Mirai Suenaga. We don't have articles on the website or artists so couldn't find any where to redirect. Stubifying would have left an article with no links to anywhere apart from a couple of claimed "appearances" and I could find no sources myself so couldn't even find a way to make it a valid stub. Feel free to review anything I do while I'm learning the ropes and revert anything you disagree with - I'll definitely take it as a learning experience. Dpmuk (talk) 08:15, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, I'll be happy to offer input. Appreciate your working at CP. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 11:17, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, mrg, I'm back with another suspected copyvio. It looks to me as if the material added with this edit was taken, directly or indirectly, from here. I've not reverted the edit, assuming you would want the history to be revised also. Hope that is right. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 11:57, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. :) Thank you for letting me know. It's generally going to be best to revert it, to avoid mirrors picking it up, and just let me or somebody else know that the edit needs deletion. I see User:Voceditenore has reverted it, and I've done the mopping up and left the IP a note (User talk:24.171.118.95). I appreciate you keeping an eye out for the issue. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:25, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) :You're speedy, MRG! :) I had was just about to list it at CP as cleaned but needing a rev del. Too bad he's copyright, or I'd make you a Speedy Gonzales barnstar. Best, Voceditenore (talk) 12:30, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy indeed! Thanks to both of you. OK, mrg, message received, ty! Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 13:11, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
LOL! Not lately that speedy, but timing was right. :D --Moonriddengirl(talk) 15:19, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
OTRS
Dear editor-who-I-happen-to-know-has-otrs-access, earlier today I forwarded some ancient e-mail exchange to permissions-en, subject 'en:user:mstrsail' at around 12:27 UTC. I expected an automated reply with ticket ID, but haven't received anything yet. If you have a minute, could you check that it actually made it and let me know the ticket ID so that I can use it to mark the respective images? As I write there it's only for bookkeeping, no action needed. Not urgent. Thanks, Amalthea 14:20, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Sure. :) Let me do a few more minutes of mopping, if you don't mind, to a brand new CCI, and then I'll take a look. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:23, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks a lot! :) And I'm surprised you don't have automatic replies. I've always found them useful in a ticketing system, for both sides. For the ticket management side, the biggest benefit IMO is that people are less likely to create multiple tickets. If they get a response they are assured that it's tracked somewhere and won't send a "Answer me already!" mail 30 minutes later, and if they want to follow up with additional information they'll reply to the auto-response and it automatically ends up in the right ticket. Cheers, Amalthea 16:21, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Sticking my nose in to support automated replies.--SPhilbrick(Talk) 16:26, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
You make good points. :) I'll bring it up to the OTRS mailing list. Not sure if it's possible, but it's worth checking. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 16:27, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
OTRS mailing list seems to think it's a good idea, basically, but I'm not sure what if anything will be done. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:58, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Email
Hello, Moonriddengirl. Please check your email; you've got mail! It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.— EyeSerenetalk 20:55, 20 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Your name was mentioned in relation to PumpkinSky ("... someone whose conversant in the copyvio area should be added to his list of mentors, someone like Moonridden girl."). I would appreciate highly if you reviewed just one article in his CCI (of 11 left of 729) and join the distinguished list of reviewers. I have been labelled an "absolute supporter of the copyright violator" and would live happier without that. Absolute supporter of a person, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:48, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I would not be able to help as his mentor, I'm afraid, as I've got quite a lot more than I can currently handle with WP:CP. :) I did, however, review an article. I wish I could do more, but it took me an hour to review that one, and I'm afraid I really can't. I found a few small areas that needed rewriting, but nothing of substance. There were, however, several issues with incorrect facts--for instance, in her cause of death, in the timeline of the building of her new cabin, in which of her friends declared hers a marriage of convenience. I wonder if these are perhaps both due to the same cause? If you wind up mentoring him, maybe the issue is that he needs to slow down?
In any event, it's nice to see this one proceeding so quickly. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:37, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Would you mind collapsing the section, I think you finished 21 to 40. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:22, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I would have, but I'm afraid it's not complete. :) Nelson Story remains to be reviewed. --User:Moonriddengirl 14:25, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Wizardman did it and collapsed, thanks, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:25, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Copyright issues with new user
Boing! said Zebedee and I have been struggling to explain copyright issues to a new user, User:CaptainKramer. He is under the belief that because the organization is registered in the US as a public organization (in this case, a political party), the content from their website can be reproduced on Wikipedia without it being a copyright violation. Boing! and I have tried to explain otherwise, and linked him to the appropriate policy pages, but this is either a case of WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT or just us not explaining it properly. He thinks we are preventing other editors or admins from assiting him, and has specifically requested an admin more familiar with copyright policies to assist him. Out of an abundance of good faith, I thought I would ask if you can assist CaptainKramer with his copyright questions. Singularity42 (talk) 22:04, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I have visited his talk page. I'm not sure that I will make him any happier, though. :/ --Moonriddengirl(talk) 23:18, 21 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Is userspace protected by CC-BY-SA licensing.
Are userspace contributions made by users protected by copyright.Many users leave the project with unfinished userspace contributions or userspace articles are not worked on for more than 6 months can another user use it without attribution.A user created an article in userspace Not edited since April 2011 Another user copy pasted it into mainspace in Sept/Oct 2011 and it was speedy deleted yesterday as copyright violation can it be restored if it attributed in the talk page.Is attribution necessary ? Russia–Yemen relations .Other editors appear to have contributed to it since then. A Senior Editor has left the Project with many unfinished articles now can others use his contributions as per this.If it is to an existing article it will be copy paste by another editor. The Rationale for deletion is here .Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 01:05, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. :) Yes, userspace contributions are copyrighted. Every time we hit save, we agree to release our content under CC-By-SA and GFDL, and this is true for userspace, article space, talk pages, noticeboards, etc. Nobody can use that content without attribution, but another user can use the content with attribution.
For a new article, the best bet is to move the sandbox (although I'd make sure the editor is gone and not likely to object first). With an existing article, the easiest way is to give attribution in the edit summary. If all the changes to content were made by one author in the sandbox, you can do that like this: "All content created by [[User:Example]]"
If multiple people worked on the sandbox, this method does not work. In that case, you have to follow the steps for copying content from one article to another at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Making a prominent note on the sandbox of what you've done is a very good idea, if you do that, to avoid it being deleted. With the specific name credit, we do not need to retain the sandbox. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 11:16, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hey :D. Since this list is in extract form, I was thinking: Why not expand the extract reach?
Look, when the list was in its complete form, the list went up to 30 films under the "highest-grossing films" list. Right now the extract stops at 10. I'd like to add the 15, 20, 25 and 30 ranks too. That way we can all be clearer as to what is the limit for a film to be in the list. I'm also planning to write some written material in the article (like in Bollywood films of 2011). I'd appreciate it if you could clarify whether I could go ahead with this. Thanks in advance :). ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 08:41, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. :) Probably we should not expand the list. We are using exactly the recommendation of our lawyer. But written material would be fantastic. The more we "transform" the material (by adding new content), the more we can use of it. You could probably discuss each of the top five, for instance, as long as you included three or four sentences on each with facts chosen and sourced from different references. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 11:11, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Couldn't we consult the lawyer again and ask to expand the list? I'm keeping it in extract form after all, just going to add 4 more ranks. Regarding written material, my intention was to add to the article and keep the lists too. You'll understand when you see the list after I work on it; I'm gonna make it almost FL status :D. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 13:18, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
That would be great. :) Your best bet would be to add the written material first, because the more of that we have the better our claim to fair use. Then we can look at increasing the extracts. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:37, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'm working on it right now. What I'm planning is to make the list a source of info about Bollywood as well, albeit in a much summarized form; an FL is always very informative, isn't it? :D. I finished one paragraph regarding a brief history of Bollywood, and I added photos too. Not much of it is my own work, I just looked at the Bollywood article and summarized some 6 paragraphs into one LOL. I'll continue working on this for some time. Take a look if you can, and give me your thoughts. Cheers! ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 14:18, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I've finished for now; it needs a few references so I'll have to ask people to help me out. Take a look :D. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 15:38, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hey! I like your lead. :) I did have to take a picture out; sorry! It's used under non-free guidelines, and you can't use it in another article unless you can add a "fair use rationale" to explain why it fits those criteria in your article, too. See WP:NFC. I would add a "fur", but I'm afraid I'm not sure we can make using it there fit that guideline.
Have you thought about turning it into an article instead of a list and just including the list excerpts in the article? Highest-grossing Bollywood films? Not being able to include the full list might be a problem for FL, but shouldn't be a problem at all for FA. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:56, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I didn't know that file was unfree. Ah anyways, it doesn't really matter; I'll put up some other film's free file that doesn't need a fair-use (hopefully, though I really need a Sholay pic as it was something of a turning point in the film industry). I had actually thought about turning it into an article, and I am making my way to make it as article-like as possible, but at the end of the day I think a list is necessary as our viewers would rather see some tabulation (easy for the eyes) rather than read through lines of text. I'll again try contacting BOI regarding the release of figures, but if nothing comes out then... well, nothing can be done :(. Thanks, and regards :D. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 13:19, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Subject Alternative Name deletion
Could you please explain to me the basis of your deletion of the article on Subject Alternative Name? I am researching this type of secure certificate and information could potentially have been very helpful. Could the article not have been amended to remove any copyright-infringing material?
193.128.166.225 (talk) 16:58, 22 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. The article was deleted because it copied content from a non-free source and, after a grace period of a week during which the creator could have verified permission or anyone could have rewritten the article, no action had been taken to correct the problem. (While it could not have been amended, it could have been rewritten from scratch.) In terms of research, you can still access the source from which it was copied: [7]. :) Good luck with your research. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:45, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Plagiarisms and copyright violations
Can you please take a look at History of the Germans in Poland's history page [8]? There was some sketchy looking unsourced sentences which also seemed strangely out of place so I tagged a few of them with 'citation needed' tags. When the editor who put them in added the sources, I checked them and sure enough, a whole bunch of them were verbatim copy-pastes from copyrighted sources (since they were not even attributed originally, they were not just copyvios but straight up plagiarism). I checked about five different sources so this isn't limited to just copying one. And of course the editor insists on restoring the copyvios.
Right now I don't have time to look through the editor's other contribution but if it's so blatant here I'm sure there's plenty more. Please also see the note I left on his/her talk page [9]. Thank you.VolunteerMarek 10:34, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Silar also edited as 46.174.24.10 and some similar IP addresses.VolunteerMarek 12:20, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Another CCI. :/ I see you removed some additional problems from that article; unfortunately, they were added by the founding editor. If you see any more, can you blank the article for copyright problems board? The whole article may be tainted, and I'm afraid I don't have time to look into it.
This is it for substantial edits of the IP you identify:
Thanks for finding the issue. Pity it had to go this way. :/ --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:30, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Lech (Bohemian prince) also had some stuff copied directly from a source. I'll look over rest of the History of Germans in Poland article later and see if there's more.VolunteerMarek 13:07, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
problems with close paraphrasing - my mentor says to ask you
Hello
I've been reviewing an article for GAN Douglas W. Owsley. I did a fair amount of copy editing to the article where the wording was strange or out of sync, so I was alerted to look at the sources. I discovered some close paraphrasing/plagiarism in the lede and brought it to the attention of the nominator User talk:Cindamuse who said she had fixed it. My review is here: Talk:Douglas W. Owsley/GA1.
So I went back to reviewing the article, starting at the lede, this time starting with checking sources. Again I found multiple instances of what I consider close paraphrasing in the lede. I alerted Cindamuse, but she disagreed, quoting copyright laws and such to support her view.
My mentor User:Worm That Turned agrees that it is close paraphrasing and possibly plagiarism, but since Cindamuse does not agree he says I should consult you as you are an expert.
I haven't checked the sources beyond the lede, although I did some copy editing in the article before I was aware of the problem.
Your opinion would be much appreciated. I have listed the problems found so far at Talk:Douglas W. Owsley/GA1.
Mathew, as stated at User talk:Mdennis (WMF), she cannot address your concerns or can't take any part in evaluating the content, since first approached in her WMF capacity. I don't appreciate your inaccurate characterization of the facts here. The information that I provided to support content was from WP:CP, which I told you provides guidance for editors. You may also wish to review WP:Plagiarism. Please return to the review for comments there and at my conversation at Worm's talk page to address concerns raised. I have contacted Derrick, who will hopefully be able to provide some input. Thanks. Best regards, Cind.amuse (Cindy) 18:08, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Please let me apologize for anything I've done wrong or against a policy.
User:Worm That Turned is my mentor and I first contacted him because of some odd wording I found in the article on February 18.[12] I've tried to follow his advice, though I may not have understood him correctly. He did agree that there was a problem with close paraphrasing in the Douglas W. Owsley article and possibly plagiarism.[13]
The issues is not Wikipedia:Copyright problems as you seem to think in your words above, but rather plagiarism and close paraphrasing. As Worm pointed out, he doesn't feel WP:Plagiarism supports your view.
I understand, Cind.amuse, that you are upset, and I apologize deeply for any blunders I have made. It's just that I've seen lately what happens to editors that allow close paraphrasing and other such problems remain in an article. DYK has had terrible problems that way and a DYK editor was blocked for close paraphrasing. So I'm nervous.
I appreciate the apology. Note that concerns raised by Worm were resolved. Your first question to me was an attempt to ascertain who wrote the article I presented. An assumption of bad faith was a poor start to this review. You appear to take offense that I pointed out content at WP:PARAPHRASE, since you have mentioned it in all your comments about the article, implying wrongdoing on my behalf in presenting the information. (While you have referred to the article as a copyvio, in presenting WP:CP, I meant to present WP:PARAPHRASE.) I have written professionally for over 20 years and have never had my work questioned in this manner and certainly not by a new editor on Wikipedia. I have never had my work characterized as a copyright violation or close paraphrasing, when I am very familiar with copyright law and know that it does not meet that definition. I enjoy collaboration and appreciate the copyedits that you have made in the article. I recognize your talent with editing. That said, the point of a review is to review and offer suggestions, rather than outright change the style to your preference. I have never had my work characterized as "odd" or "strange". The characterization was inappropriate. I have to be honest, I'm concerned with the manner of questions and accusations in this review. If you are not comfortable reviewing this article, please request an official second opinion. I will not respond here further, since this is the wrong place for conversation to take place on this issue. I can be reached through my talk page. Best regards, Cind.amuse (Cindy) 21:15, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sorry that you are interpreting my review of your article so negatively. Indeed it is difficult for all of us to accept criticism at times.
You say: "Your first question to me was an attempt to ascertain who wrote the article I presented. An assumption of bad faith was a poor start to this review." Again I'm sorry you interpreted my attempt to do my job of reviewing your GAN so negatively. If you read Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2009-04-13/Dispatches (Let's get serious about plagiarism), you will see that some of the "red flags" to look for immediately are:
"Rapid maturation: Fully developed articles that appear in very few edits may signal plagiarism. While sometimes editors construct articles in sandboxes or off-wiki, sometimes a sudden maturity of text signals that material has quickly been added without careful attention to the issue of plagiarism."
Your article sprung into life on February 10 at 55,757 bytes - very long for a new article. So I was just doing my job to ask you if you had written it off wiki, since the article had no article history.
"Inconsistent language: If the tone of an article or passage is colloquial or does not feel "right"—for example if jargon or idioms are used incorrectly—a source may have been misused.
I pointed out this instance of odd language in the review: "The family lived financially conservative, yet never seemed to run out of money by the third week of the month, due to his mother's talent at stretching a meal." I asked what you meant by "lived financially conservative" combined with the "yet never seemed to run out of money" - the two clauses seem to clash, and "lived financially conservative" isn't really grammatical. I suggested alternatives and asked what you meant. You refused to change the wording and the odd language remains in the article.
I'm sorry that you see my review as "bad faith". Please remember that all the instances of close paraphrasing/copyvio were in the lede. So 40,000 to 50,000 (or so) bytes of the article remain to be evaluated. I'm just trying to protect the encyclopedia. Please remember that. As a GAN reviewer I have certain responsibilities. Please remember that DYK is under fire for not vetting for close paraphrasing/copyvio and a DYK editor has been indefinitely banned for his role in the problems there. So, yes, I want to be careful.
I will ask my mentor what to do next. Best wishes, MathewTownsend (talk) 22:13, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, guys. :)
User:MathewTownsend, I appreciate your keeping an eye out for close paraphrasing issue. It is important to do, and while some cases are clearer than others, it's also important to talk openly when there are disagreements about where that line is. :) I see that User:Cindamuse approached; User:Dcoetzee. I'm glad, Cindy, and I'm so glad he had time to weigh in. I think he has good judgment in this area, in terms of what the typical approach is on Wikipedia.
Cindy, I hope that you will not take this as too much of a criticism of your writing in general, even though I see he did think the content followed too closely. Wikipedia, as I'm sure you know, keeps on the conservative side of fair use for a number of reasons, including that our content may be reused commercially and may be reused in countries with stricter fair use or fair dealing laws than our own. :)
Mathew, you did nothing whatsoever wrong with dropping a note at my staff talk page. The situation you had kind of bridged the gap between my two roles, and it was entirely appropriate for you to ping me there. :) (I wish I could wear both hats on the same situation, but I have to be careful about that for legal reasons.) I'm sorry that my userpage misled you, though. If you don't mind doing me a favor, could you look at what the box says now and let me know if it's any better? I want to make sure that people wind up at the right place. :D --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:52, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Moonriddengirl! I'm glad to hear I didn't do anything heinous. As far as your box at the top of this page, it doesn't seem to explain that you actually have two different names (your other one which I can't remember now) and Moonriddengirl with two different roles, one of them for WMF (your staff page?) which prohibits you from responding to concerns about wikipedia, and that if your WMF name is contacted, then the other one must not be. Also, when you say you deal with copyright concerns, does that mean that you don't deal with a situation where it's not clear whether it's a copyvio or close paraphrasing?
On another note, would you be able to convince User:Cindamuse that it disrupts GAN if she continues to delete the GAN review Talk:Douglas W. Owsley/GA1? It's necessary to the GAN process that every review be retained to aid the next reviewer, and that the article and its talk page belong to the community and not to her. I failed her nomination because it seemed clear to me that Cindamuse would not accept my review points. I've explained to her that there is no shame in a failed review and that she can nominate it again when ever she feels the article is ready. Thank you! MathewTownsend (talk) 12:47, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Matthew, I'm one of Moonriddengirl's talk page stalkers. Cindamuse didn't delete the GA review (Talk:Douglas W. Owsley/GA1), she simply removed its transclusion into Talk:Douglas W. Owsley. That's what's normally done when a GA review is finished to free up space on the article's actual talk page. Talk:Douglas W. Owsley/GA1 is now linked from the Article Milestones banner at the top of Talk:Douglas W. Owsley. Best, Voceditenore (talk) 13:08, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Vpceditenore. I was worried it would get "lost" as seems to happen in a fair number of cases. So thanks for the reassurance. Best wishes, MathewTownsend (talk) 15:24, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Mathew, I'm a little confused by your response. :) You said here that you contacted me at User talk:Mdennis (WMF) because Moonriddengirl's page sort of said to. Since there's nothing on this talk page mentioning Mdennis, I assume you read the note here. I've updated that note to help avoid confusion. If I've misunderstood you, and there was something else that directed you to my staff talk page, please let me know.
I deal with copyright concerns, but part of that necessarily entails determining when a close paraphrase crosses the line into a copyright problem under Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. I am not prohibited from responding to concerns about Wikipedia as staff; it's what I'm there for. :) However, I'm a conduit between staff and volunteers and not, in that capacity, an editor. I'm not allowed in that capacity to make judgments about whether or not content is a copyright problem, for instance, because if staff starts making editorial decisions, we will no longer qualify as an online service provider and the current systems we have in place to protect the project when contributors violate copyright will be put at risk. If WMF is not an online service provider, but a publisher, WMF is legally liable for what we publish. This would be bad for everybody, since it would mean that we would probably no longer be able to edit freely, because WMF would have to pre-screen everything...which would break the encyclopedia altogether. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:59, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
apology
Well, I apologize that I have gotten confused and made a mess of things, which I have, and I admit that I space out and don't always read carefully all the message boxes etc. and follow all the links and read those carefully also that I should. Also, lots of the terms and names of other editors I'm not familiar with, so even if I read everything I don't necessarily understand. And I appreciate that you have limits as a WMF staff member over what you can address and I have no complaints at all about you. And your suggestions were great and the person you suggested did the right thing. And certainly WMF needs to be protected from accusations of copyright violations. My frustration was not over editors that are uninformed and inexperienced. No, my frustration is over this particular editor who STILL DOESN' GET IT, and has posted prominently on her user page:
I am an Online Ambassador, member of the Ambassador Selection Team, and member of the Ambassador Steering Committee. I have worked with university professors and students through the Public Policy Initiative over the past year and attended the Wikipedia in Higher Education Summit in July 2011, to assist with expanding the project to the global community. I am now part of the Wikipedia Education Program, with an emphasis on the United States and Canada.
Now, I watched from the sidelines the mess that was created by these on line educational courses in the past, and seems like there was criticism that on line ambassadors were unable to monitor copyright violation by students. And now, as I understand it, a new bunch of these on line courses is about to be unleashed on en:wp. Close paraphrasing/plagiarism is just as much a mess for en:wp to clean up - and its harder to detect - takes more work than copyright violations. Here we have an Online Ambassador, member of the Ambassador Selection Team and the Ambassador Steering Committee, who doesn't know that close paraphrasing/plagiarism in en:wp articles is a no no. And who still has not admitted that close paraphrasing/plagiarism is wrong, but rather has quoted a bunch of legal cases and copyright laws to justify her behavior. Discouraging, to say the least. This is why I think WMF isn't considering en:wp editors who WMF does expect to clean up the mess. However, I thank you for your help and appreciate greatly what you do and how you handle things. Respectfully, MathewTownsend (talk) 19:20, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I suspect you've probably noticed the changes I made to this yesterday on your watchlist. I comment on them at WT:CP. Thought I'd point you at the comments in case you missed me posting there as WT:CP has another pretty active thread at the moment. There are one or two things there would your input would be useful - although there's no rush whatsoever. Dpmuk (talk) 16:42, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'll try to come by CP later today if I can. :) I'm not sure what the changes amount to, because markup confuses me. :D But I have confidence in you, so I'm sure it'll be fine, and we can fix any issues that may come up. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 22:23, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
As I say no rush. I'm confident I've not broken anything important! Dpmuk (talk) 04:04, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Legolas2186
Per this AN thread and Legolas' disapparance, I think it might be time to open a CCI on him. It might involve dozens of recognized article dilistings and spread over over 100 pages, so yeah it's looking really bad. Sven ManguardWha? 05:11, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, Sven. :) Just to clarify, is this needed to look for incorrect information, or is there a copyright dimension to this that I'm overlooking? We can use the CCI tool either way, but it wouldn't be hosted at CCI. I've gone ahead and run the tool; see [15]. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 12:30, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
He's making up sources. That's the issue. Sven ManguardWha? 04:07, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, then it wouldn't be at CCI. I'll put it in a subpage of his user space and let you know once it's there. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:52, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
There have been some issues found with close paraphrasing/copyvio (see, for example Talk:4 Minutes (Madonna song)#Partial source audit), but I agree with Sven that the majority of the problem seems to be falsifying sources and claiming that sources include information that they don't actually cover. Dana boomer (talk) 14:57, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm. :/ Well, the report is stowed at User:Legolas2186/Major contributions. Reverts and minor edits are excluded. I would imagine that the top 200 articles are going to be the biggest concern. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 16:03, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the report. That will be a great help in rooting out the various problems, including close paraphrasing, fabrication of sources, making up quotes from living people, etc. Binksternet (talk) 19:01, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Should a talk page edit where the IP editor has written 'copyright' be rev/del'd?
I've replied at your talk page, but I think we've got no issues. The content is copyrighted; it's just licensed. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:52, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I didn't see a problem either, but you explained it much better than I could! Dougweller (talk) 11:07, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, if you have a moment could you take a look at advice for handling copyright donation in process? Essentially, a librarian at Cornell created some articles using text from the Cornell library website. I informed her that the material was appropriate for wikipedia but needed to be donated and she let me know that she is working to get it donated but would like us to not delete the articles while the process is underway. How do we handle donations that are in process? Thank you, GabrielF (talk) 17:09, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I've taken a stab at replying. Dpmuk (talk) 18:04, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Good reply, thanks. I've added a recommendation to use {{OTRS pending}}. :) Thanks for helping her out, Gabriel! --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:43, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actual Art
I hope this is not a headache...........the Actual Art Foundation says they have made the ownership statement on the website and released the material. Thank you for your help.Palofierros (talk) 18:50, 24 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for letting me know. I have restored the article with the necessary notice on the article and at the top of the article's talk page and created a permanent archived copy of the release in case there are ever any disputes from any of the artists. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:59, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
A favor, please?
This might be outside your bailiwick, but I was hoping you might take a look at the article I have been developing in my user space, Call Me Burroughs, and tell me if you notice any glaring omissions. I know that the article is not finished, but I feel it is close to the point that it can actually be published, and then continue improving it from there. Maybe generate a DYK along the way, and even push it to GA status. At any rate, your thoughts would be appreciated. Cheers! ---RepublicanJacobiteTheFortyFive 14:57, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Isn't this copyvio?
OTRS ticket 2012022610001451 is complaining about the content of our Dachau concentration camp article, which I don't think I'll deal with, but the content they are complaining about was added here [16] and is copied from [17] which seems to be in copyright. Dougweller (talk) 11:09, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, unless we are given some reason to believe otherwise. I have removed the content and cautioned the contributor. However, in looking at other contributions, I am concerned that there are other issues with this contributor's content. I have found duplication in several other articles and am looking more deeply. A full CCI should not be needed, given the small number of articles that meet the evaluation criteria.
Josef Mengele: Y, a tiny trace remaining has been removed. Other content was removed already. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 13:36, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, compare this. I added like 11 sources and removed POV like "BEST diabetes hospital" and dead links to the Indian railway site and such and for some reason it takes 40 minutes and counting for anybody to spot it and revert him. I've reported it at ANI, he's been warned for removing AFD notices but nobody is seeing what he's done. Can you look into it? Cheers.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:06, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I reverted him, but its very disappointing nobody is ever around to support me on things like this. I waited nearly an hour for somebody to revert.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:21, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) Hi. I see that it's at ANI and he's been warned for edit warring. I've warned him about personal attacks and battlefield mentality. I didn't mention WP:OWN, but it seems like that could be the core issue. :/ If I were in your position, what I would do is stop and engage him directly at the talk page of the article, leaving him a note at his talk page to let him know where to look. Give him time to respond, and, if he is editing elsewhere and doesn't or if sufficient time has passed, revert back pending an explanation of issues. If he reverts you, still without response, it makes it more immediately obvious to people what's going on (in other words, he has been told where and how to explain his issues and hasn't) and allows you to go to more easily go to WP:3O to get some dispute resolution. You may not get it immediately, but it generally won't be an emergency, even though it feels like it at the time. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:27, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Can you keep an eye on Gobichettipalayam for me? If you look at the sources and structure of it if he reverts again you'll spot the difference. I had intended continuing working on it and adding more aources but I have a feeling I'm going to be reverted again and nobody will revert it back. Thanks.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:29, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I can try keep an eye on it for ownership issue and personal attacks, but I'm afraid I can't revert him unless he is clearly vandalizing. I'm also not on that much in this account and generally scrambling with copyright problems, as I am today, when I'm here. If you need somebody to help with the content issues, I'd recommend WP:3O, as I mentioned above. Or even the project talk page or WP:DRN. There are ways to raise attention from other editors to get assistance, though you may sometimes need to be patient. :) --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:32, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
OK, but I would consider the removal of references and reinsertion of blatant POV as disruption which shouldn't be tolerated by anybody. Its not as if is a dispute about content or accuracy or something. Thanks for your help anyway.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:39, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actually it seems to be a copyvio from here.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:47, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Great! If you don't think it's a backwards copy, please tag or remove any copied content and let the contributor know about the policies with one of the copyright templates. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:48, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I will be willing to go through it and remove the offending material but I will not do so if I keep being reverted and nobody supports what I'm doing.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:50, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Dr. Blofeld, I understand completely how it feels to think nobody supports what you're doing. :) If you'll pardon my own weary complaint, I'm very happy that there are more contributors working copyright at the moment than there have been in some time - I'm particularly pleased by the increased participation of User:Dpmuk and User:Voceditenore. But I gave every spare minute of my day yesterday to cleaning up copyright, and I have been working for nearly three hours this morning on the issue immediately above yours. Realistically, I may have several hours still to go to finish with that, and probably a four day backlog at WP:CP that I'd like to catch up on while I can. I won't make it, but I'll do my best. :)
There are ways to get support, but it takes effort, I know. I've recommended an approach above that I think will help you - make notes on the talk page, invite the contributor to the talk page, reach out for backup at an appropriate fora if the contributor does not join in building consensus. If you think that the content is clearly an issue, you have the option of listing the contributor at WP:AIV, but, if it is not so clear, you do have to go through other processes, such as dispute resolution noticeboards and ANI.
While I would like to help you, and took time off the work I'm doing to at least try to address the behavioral issues, I feel that assessing the content weakens my ability to remain WP:UNINVOLVED in case I am called upon as an administrator, and I feel that I can't become involved as an editor due to both a lack of time and the fact that you have approached me at my talk page, which might seem to predispose me to agree with your point of view. This is why I recommend the dispute resolution fora to you. I believe it's the best approach for you to take. I hope it helps. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 14:59, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I believe I've now addressed most of the copyvios.♦ Dr. Blofeld 16:31, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello, Moonriddengirl. You have new messages at Mystichumwipe's talk page. Message added 17:38, 26 February 2012 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.[reply]
I'm not sure I should be the one to do this, but Vjiced (talk· contribs) continues to add copyvio with no acknowledgement of the problem despite the warnings on his talk page. His latest is at a new BLP he created, Lee Chau Ping, much of which is from [18]. Sorry to be a pain. Dougweller (talk) 19:01, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Wow, that was fast. Thanks. I've already blocked one editor today for copyvio. Dougweller (talk) 19:12, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
And maybe I should have done what you did. I did an indef block and left the editor a note saying what to do to get unblocked. I view indefinite blocks as just that, a block that can often be easily lifted if an editor agrees to comply with policy. In the case of the editor I blocked earlier today, they seem to have never tried to communicate with anyone, unlike Vjiced. Dougweller (talk) 19:20, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I gave him a finite block because it looks to me like he's trying. :) Effort goes a long way. If he continues the issue after this, we might have to question whether he will be able to succeed. And I do indefs sometimes when I'm not sure how long it will be before the editor comes back. If they're erratic in participation, we can't guarantee that a finite block will even be seen. --Moonriddengirl(talk) 19:23, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actual Art
the board at the Actual Art Foundation thank you and believe you are doing a great service for Wikipedia — Preceding unsigned comment added by Palosfierros (talk • contribs) 22:16, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
the green box above does not show Palosfierros (talk) 22:18, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'm glad that we were able to work it out. :) Thank you for your patience with the process.
I'm not 100% sure what you mean about the green box not showing. Do you mean the one at the top of my talk page when you edit it? (If so, it seems to be showing now. :)) Or is there another green box in question? --Moonriddengirl(talk) 23:56, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]