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Criticism Section Needed. |
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:Nope they won't work. Also we don't really condone piracy on Wikipedia so you shouldn't be asking those types of questions on here. [[User:Nintenboy01|Nintenboy01]] ([[User talk:Nintenboy01|talk]]) 01:42, 17 April 2008 (UTC) |
:Nope they won't work. Also we don't really condone piracy on Wikipedia so you shouldn't be asking those types of questions on here. [[User:Nintenboy01|Nintenboy01]] ([[User talk:Nintenboy01|talk]]) 01:42, 17 April 2008 (UTC) |
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::As far as im aware, Wikipedia neither condones or supports anything. If the PS3 can be used for it, then it would be a fact that should go in the article, as it doesnt, it wont. <font color="#9966ff">[[User:John.n-irl|John]]</font><font color="#cc6699">[[Special:Contributions/John.n-irl|.n-]]</font><font color="#33cc66">[[User talk:John.n-irl#top|IRL]]</font> 01:49, 17 April 2008 (UTC) |
::As far as im aware, Wikipedia neither condones or supports anything. If the PS3 can be used for it, then it would be a fact that should go in the article, as it doesnt, it wont. <font color="#9966ff">[[User:John.n-irl|John]]</font><font color="#cc6699">[[Special:Contributions/John.n-irl|.n-]]</font><font color="#33cc66">[[User talk:John.n-irl#top|IRL]]</font> 01:49, 17 April 2008 (UTC) |
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== Criticism Section == |
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=== Kojima === |
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This article should include some of the criticism people have had of the PS3. At present, there are none. |
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Of the PS3 Kojima has just said; |
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"But when we actually started developing the game, we realized there were a lot of restrictions and so it turned out how you see it today." |
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and |
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"I remember saying three years ago that we wanted to create something revolutionary, but in reality we couldn't really do that because of the CPU. We're using the Cell engine to its limit., actually." |
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http://kotaku.com/381412/kojima-disappointed-with-metal-gear-solid-4 |
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=== Carmack === |
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Of the PS3's development environment, John Carmack has said; |
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"Developers are forced to sweat blood to take advantage of the Cell" |
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http://kotaku.com/gaming/video/carmack-hates-the-ps3-173732.php |
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"Xbox 360 has far and away the best development tools," Carmack said. "PS3 is probably marginally more powerful, in terms of raw flops and graphic operations, but that’s not really the best way to look at things. When you look at these development cycles that stretch over years and years, being 20% easier to develop on is much more important than being 20% more powerful." |
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http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/10/18/1556 |
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"But the honest truth is that Microsoft dev tools are so much better than Sony's. We expect to keep in mind the issues of bringing this up on the PlayStation 3... they're not helpful to the developers... I suspect they're not going to overwhelmingly crush the marketplace this time, which wasn't clear a year ago. A lot of people were thinking it's going to be a rerun of the last generation, and it's now looking like it might not be. I've been pulling for Microsoft, because I think they've done a better job for development support, and I think they have made somewhat smarter decisions on the platform. It's not like the PlayStation 3 is a piece of junk or anything. I was not a fan of the PlayStation 2 and the way its architecture was set up. With the PlayStation 3, it's not even that it's ugly—they just took a design decision that wasn't the best from a development standpoint." |
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http://kotaku.com/gaming/carmack/carmack-prefers-360-to-ps3-227899.php |
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http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200701/N07.0109.1737.15034.htm?Page=3 |
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http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3156329 |
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=== Newell === |
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Valve's Gabe Newell has said: |
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"Statements about 'Oh, the PS3 is going to be twice as fast as an Xbox 360' are totally meaningless . It means nothing. It's surprising that game customers don't realize how it treats them like idiots. |
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http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=510&Itemid=2 |
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=== Controller Ergonomics, Lack of Features === |
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"PS3 Packs Promise, Lacks Punch" From Wired; |
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"But for ergonomics, I like the Xbox controller better" |
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"Microsoft's controller also includes force feedback, which PS3's lacks. This is a disappointment" |
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"the Friends list is not integrated into games. On the Xbox, if you meet players in an online game, you can add them to your universal buddy list with one click, then invite them to join you in any game. Not on PS3 -- you must maintain separate Friends lists for each game" |
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http://www.wired.com/gaming/gamingreviews/news/2006/11/72183 |
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=== Conclusion === |
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In short, I think there needs to be a criticism section. And it should (at least) include the following: Kojima's comments (or others) about performance, Carmacks' (or others) comments about development troubles, lack of in-game Friends Lists and Lack of Custom Soundtracks. |
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Further, some commentary on the state of the game libary should be included. There is ample commentary on PS3 lacking quality games. I could find links very readily, but this is getting long enough. |
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These ideas and commentary are widely reported and many citations to these effect can easily be found. |
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[[User:Wageslave|Wageslave]] ([[User talk:Wageslave|talk]]) 18:40, 18 April 2008 (UTC) |
Revision as of 18:40, 18 April 2008
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Accomplishments / Entitlements / Skill Points
Does anyone have any info on this, the only game that currently supports in-game xmb "Accomplisment" messages is Devil May Cry 4. Sony at GDC 07' said during their Home demonstration that accomplishments were Sony's version of 360's Achievements. This is the first game to have this feature. This section is to be a sub category under Home since the Accomplishments are Home based. DevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)DevonTheDudeDevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
- DMC4 doesnt have the final accomplishments system(hopefully), as they take over the entire screen when being displayed. It'll probably be released with home anyway. john.n-irl (talk) 19:24, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Yea they do take the entire screen but only at the end of each level, not while the game is in progress. There are smaller messages (non XMB messages) skill points in games like Burnout Paradise, Uncharted, Ratchet and Resistance. DevonTheDude (talk) 23:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
Here is more progress on Accomplishments/ Entitlements: Dark Sector is going to use Entitlements which are another version of PS3 Accomplishments http://kotaku.com/364390/dark-sectors-ps3-entitlements DevonTheDude (talk) 23:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
RSX/Cell Processor Chipset Sizes
I posted earlier that as of the 40gb model only the Cell processor uses the 65nm chipset, someone erased my citations and info about how the RSX chipset is still using a 90nm process. DevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)DevonTheDudeDevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC) My citations were from Kotaku.com
Found more info on the Cell processor shrinking down to 45nm, it will reduce power consumption 40% to to the older 65nm chipset. "Production is due to start in the summer so expect them on the shelves in time for Christmas." There is also a handy graph detailing the differences in power use between 90nm, 65nm, 45nm chipsets. I got all this info from here: http://n4g.com/tech/News-118530.aspx
-
Graph of Cell B.E. Power ConsumptionGraph of Cell B.E. Power Consumption
40gb Black
It's not a gloss finish like the other consoles, it is a matte finish--213.40.133.120 (talk) 08:34, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Rip Itunes DRM files to the HDD
I haven't put this in the article yet but, if you hook up an Ipod (via USB) to the PS3 you can rip Itunes DRM protected files. All you do is go to the Music section of the XMB, then select the Ipod from the list of removable media (i.e. memory cards, usb flash drives), hit Triangle and select view all. You will then see a folder named Itunes or Music I cant remember, then dig around and you will see your Ipod's Itunes DRM library. You must have ACC playback enabled in the system settings to play the files. Unfortunately when your viewing the files, the artist and the track name are gone. The music folders and songs themselves look like someone mashed a keyboard (i.e. "hdwqv" would be the name of an music file). Check it out, I have a bunch of songs on my PS3 HDD. The PS3 cant play the Ipod though, but who cares when you can rip DRM files. DevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)DevonTheDudeDevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
- I cant see how its relevant. And discussion pages work from the bottom up, not down. john.n-irl (talk) 19:22, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
I mentioned it b/c software to unlock DRM Itunes files is very scarce, even on PC. Just glad to know the PS3 can do it with out any additional software / hacks. It's a great way to put music on your PS3, epically if you use Itunes /Ipod.
- There's a gazillion programs which can get your itunes off an Ipod. Try Comparison_of_iPod_managers or floola for a multi platform program which does this. Furrycushion (talk) 08:59, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
Are the programs legal and do they come pre-installed on the computer? The PS3 rips DRM Itunes files right out of the box, no 3rd party software required. A great feature since more games are including custom soundtracks and someday (Summer 08' according to SCE) In-game XMB music. http://n4g.com/ps3/News-118249.aspx DevonTheDude (talk) 23:52, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I am not a lawyer but it all might depend on whether you live in the US or a country with more freedoms, like China. However 30 of them on the link I gave are free. Furrycushion (talk) 13:36, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Sales/Shipped
The sales chart should be seperate from the shipped chart. when they're put on the same chart it's misleading. does anyone have quarter shimpments to make a seperate shipped chart?200.109.223.204 (talk) 00:15, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Got new end of the week of February 23rd 2008 #'s, the PS3 beat out the 360 again, barely: Wii: 209,561 (+339%) [47,702] DSL: 116,674 (-30%) [166,899] PS3: 94,106 (+17%) [80,214] 360: 87,569 (+11%) [79,204]
citation: http://n4g.com/News-116557.aspx
- These figures come from vgchartz(first line of the article) john.n-irl (talk) 13:09, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
People are getting beside the poin, there is a large gap between sales and units shipped, and we should have both. Seanor3 16:59, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
Playstation 3 Slim
Are you guys gonna add a part on the article about the Playstation 3 Slim? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.90.174.173 (talk) 03:45, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Uhhh what are you talking about? You sure you don't mean PSP Slim? there's no such thing as PS3 Slim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Camilo101 (talk • contribs) 17:49, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
- There was a rumour about a PS3 slim being made, but it was just a rumour so no need to put it in, unless it actually happens. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chris huh (talk • contribs) 17:54, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
It will be confirmed soon. I heard DLB talking about it on P.O.B. 70.90.174.173 (talk) 01:01, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Why someone deleted my section, I dont know who but the PS3 slim is if anything in development and is YEARS out not a few months. As I stated the Cell, RSX, and Blu-ray Diode need to shrink down to at least a 45nm process before this can happen (for size, power consumption, and heat reduction). The internal fan in the PS3 is huge b/c the heat the 90nm chips put off, and 65nm (only the cell processor) for the 40gb. I also mentioned that SCEA has NEVER released a slim Playstation in the beginning of the Playstation product life cycle (i.e. the first 3-4 years of a console's life span). The only exception is the PSP. There is a NEW PS2 slim thats going to come out soon, it is the redesigned Ps2 slim with a built in power supply (the current model is external, like a laptop/ xbox 360 power supply). This new Ps2 is supposed to ship for $99 but is still not at market yet. There is lots of info on gaming publications to back up my allegations.
- Well, so long as it stays a rumour there is no need to mention it. Thus far all that you've mentioned seems like original research, so yeah, we'll wait until something official comes out. Chan Yin Keen | Talk 18:32, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Sony opens PS3 to in-game Ads
In-game advertisements, like the ones often seen in EA games, could soon become far more commonplace as Sony opens up its in-game advertising platform on PlayStation 3.
The move will allow major game advertisement companies IGA, Double Fusion and AdScape to sell 'dynamic' advertisements to go into games on the PS3, who will compete to strike deals with major publishers EA, Activision and Ubisoft.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=183294
Denzelio (talk) 10:50, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Here's another article http://kotaku.com/360864/sony-allowing-competition-for-ps3-in+game-ads
Does anyone know if these ads are; in-game, in Home and in the XMB (ala 360's blade ads)?
- These are for in game ads only. The XMB does not and from what I can tell will not have any ads at any point in the future. Home will most likely feature ads, but that is my opinion, we won't know until Home is out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by WhereAmI (talk • contribs) 20:29, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
80 GB Motorstorm Bundle to be replaced with 80 GB Metal Gear Solid Bundle - June 12th
The new 80 GB PS3 Bundle will remain the same but with a few changes,
Metal Gear Solid instead of Motorstorm.
DualShock 3 controller instead of the Sixaxis controller
the system contains the same emulated PS2 b/c as the other 80 GB system.
http://www.kotaku.com.au/games/2008/02/metal_gear_solid_4_ps3_bundle_announced-2.html
http://kotaku.com/361158/metal-gear-solid-4-the-ps3-bundle-the-cardboard-box - (picture included)
This 80 GB cancels out any rumored 120 GB model or slimline models for the moment.
Denzelio (talk) 03:09, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
- I noticed an IP added something today about Emotion Engine being restored to this new 80 GB model. Has that been confirmed? Do we have a source for this information as well? Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 01:42, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
I dont see why they would include it in the new MGS4 PS3 pack, especially when the pack is $499 with a game and an 80gb PS3 (better than the current $499 just for the console with out DShock3). I would speculate that the next model above the 80gb (the Elite version for the PS3) would likely have it. In Japan the value of the 60GB and 20GB has surpassed the 40 and 80gb trade in values. This shows that people do want full b/c back. DevonTheDude (talk) 00:01, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
PS3 In-game Music / Custom Soundtracks
The list of in-game custom soundtracks music is growing, I'm not referring to In-game XMB music but just "Custom Soundtracks". Here is the first games that currently or will support custom soundtracks: 1. High velocity Bowling 2. Super Stardust HD (ver. 1.1) 3. MLB The Show 08' 4. Wipeout HD 5. Burnout Paradise (ver 1.3) 7. GTA 4 (maybe) 8. LBP (maybe) 9. Echochrome (maybe)
All the "maybe" are unconfirmed, but may support the custom soundtrack feature, I am 100% positive the first 4 games do support the feature.
http://kotaku.com/361224/wipeout-hd-features-custom-soundtracks http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/02/13/mlb-08-the-show-weekly-update-my-mlb-music-demo-details/
Here is a quote from the official playstation blog moderators on HV bowling "Very nice observation! One of the things that we are shipping with (and may be the first) is the ability to play your own music from within the title." (this is posted in the comments section of the blog) http://blog.us.playstation.com/2007/11/13/bowling-anyone/
Another quote, "an update to PlayStation 3 downloadable favorite Super Stardust HD. The update adds rumble support for the DualShock 3 and adds custom soundtrack support, among other visual changes" http://kotaku.com/343521/super-playstation-store-update-hd
Dualshock 3
As announced yesterday (2.26.08) the Dualshock 3 controller will arrive day and date with GT5 prologue (April 15th 2008) for an MSRP of 54.99. I included the link to the official news direct from SCEA: http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/02/26/destination-playstation-news-mgs-ps3-bundle-kratos-psp-and-dualshock3-release-date-by/ http://kotaku.com/360931/dualshock-3-dated-for-us (for the April 15th date citation)
"Yes - Software Emulation"
This is partly wrong on the 60GB PAL and 80GB NTSC models of the PS3. It should be made clear note in that chart of PS3 SKU's that the Graphics Synthesizer of the PS2 is present in both of these models allowing the PS3 to gain near perfect backwards compatibility with PlayStation2 software. The absense of high-bandwidth EDRAM from the PS3's hardware prevents a viable PS2 emulation software solution from being produced for the PS3. Thus the GSX's inclusion in the higher end models(60GB PAL and 80GB NTSC) is extremely necessary to achieving backwards compatibility with PS2 software. It's a mix of hardware and software, not completely software. Whereas the early 20GB and 60GB NTSC models included both the PS2's Emotion Engine CPU and the Graphics Synthesizer GPU, however the GSX GPU from the PS2 is the most important part of this formula, as the Cell has about no trouble emulating the Emotion Engine. TonyFreakinAlmeida (talk) 17:00, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
- Talking about software, perhaps we could include a section on the programming language that the PS3 uses for games? I don't see any mention of that, surely this is important as far as tech specs go? If there is no opposition then perhaps can someone find out the programming language used for games and mention this?
I condsider it an interesting point as ease of programming is instrumental to game quality. For eg, Xbox360 games can be coded in C++ (I believe, correct me if I am wrong) and one can also use established DirectX libraries and API's, so any PC game programmer worth his salt would find Xbox360 programming reasonably easy. Since I am unsure of PS3's language, I can't comment on its ease of use?74.210.56.135 (talk) 07:09, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
- Programming languages are not strait-forward. At a fairly basic level the CPU code will have to be in Cell, but it could be written in any language, provided you have a compiler. If someone could find out what language is most common however, I think it would be a good addition to the article. John.n-irl (talk) 07:36, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
Official PS3 Accessories
An official Sony Playstation Bluetooth headset is set to ship on the day that Socom: Confrontation arrives (Summer 08'). This bundle which will retail for $59.99 is similar to the Warhawk headset deal offered in August 07'. The BT headset will be also available as a standalone product @ $49.99 for the headset and charging dock. The headset is slated for an early August or late July 2008 release which will likely be the time Socom: C comes out too (since it comes w/ a headset packed in). http://akayuki.com/2008/03/11/ps3-bt-headset-psp-gps-unit-details/
Here is a link to the image of the headset http://akayuki.com/wp-content/ps_bluetooth842.jpg DevonTheDude (talk) 21:28, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
- That pic looks too fake/unofficialjohn.n-irl (talk) 22:20, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
More confirmation: http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2008/03/11/rumor-socom-confrontation-bundle-includes-new-bluetooth-headset/ DevonTheDude (talk) 23:52, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
- Confirmation or rumor? Says rumor john.n-irl (talk) 18:16, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
I would expect true confirmation at Sony Gamer day in May 08' DevonTheDude (talk) 20:53, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
- And if it is announced by sony or a reliable source it can go in the article. Also, if you could please type ":" before your comments, makes talk pages easier to read. john.n-irl (talk) 20:59, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
"Exactly, I am waiting till then. Sony did talk about a headset in the past prior to Warhawk's retail release, maybe this is it. It wont be posted till it's official thats what I expect at Sony gamer Day 08' in May." DevonTheDude (talk) 23:48, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
- Sorry, thought you meant for it to go in. My mistake. I do recall them talkin about a headset that wasn't the Jabra...i think. And I didn't mean quotations, the colon. john.n-irl (talk) 23:57, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Editing the Page
When I added the NPD results for February the Hardware section vanished, among other things, but when I went to edit the page again to rectify the mistake it said that all of that info was still there. What did I do wrong??????????Einstein the afrodude (talk) 00:21, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
- Fixed, possibly an error in wp, all the hardware text was still in your version of the page, just not being displayed.john.n-irl (talk) 01:15, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
- The ref tags weren't closed properly, it was
<ref> <ref>
instead of<ref> </ref>
. --Silver Edge (talk) 01:20, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
Loss of money
Though I have no citation, I've heard that sony lost money from the PS3. Many people bought it for the blu-ray playing abilities. Sony was actually losing money from selling the PS3's because they expected people to buy games. Though I don't see anything about this in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.159.22.4 (talk) 18:23, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
- This is common practice in the VG industry, and is mentioned in the Sales and Production Cost section john.n-irl (talk) 19:09, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
SCEI has taken losses (at launch) on every playstation model that has come to market including the PSP. 69.228.116.112 (talk) 21:48, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
80GB PS3 for Europe this Summer?
http://www.n4g.com/ps3/News-127990.aspx
Retailers have told CVG that they expect the 80GB PS3 - currently out in the US - to hit UK stores by the end of the summer.
UK cash and carry superstore chain, Costco, told a CVG reader that it was clearing out its supply of 40GB PS3 units in preparation for the arrival of the 80GB consoles some time soon. But it's not the only retailer expecting the bigger console in the near future.
A HMV staffer told CVG that, although he had been given no confirmed release date by the retailer, he expects the 80GB console will "very likely" hit the UK soon, especially considering the 40GB PS3's inability to play PS2 games. The 80GB model in the US does include the functionally to play PS2 games.
Denzelio (talk) 04:13, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
User's repeated query
Hello its user: Political Dweeb again, I’ll try communicating this point in an understandable manor.
Is using a PS3 memory card on a Play station 2 possible? Because then a PS3 memory card can get transferred PS2 memory card game data by using a PS3 memory card adaptor and transfer cable.
Here’s source’s website address below http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080210075026AAWMhJk)
Please let me know because then people like me and anyone else here could transfer their Play station memory card data onto other Play station memory cards instead of deleting the data.Political Dweeb (talk) 10:00, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Wikipedia is not a forum, this would not really be relevant for the article. John.n-irl (talk) 20:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, to put you out of your misery, no you cannot use a PS3 memory card on a PS2, because a PS3 memory card does not exist. Perhaps you mean 'can one transfer PS2 data onto the PS3?' To that question yes. However you have to buy a little adapter to plug into the PS3, that has a dongle that takes a PS2 memory card. Then one copies the PS2 card data onto the PS3's hard drive. I believe you can also work with the PS2 card directly whilst playing a PS2 game, or, just save it to the PS3's HD, dispensing with the adapter and PS2 card once the data is transferred.74.210.56.135 (talk) 07:03, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
PS3 sales vs Xbox 360 for 2008
I think it should be clear that so far the PS3 had consistently sold more than the Xbox 360. Official NPD results for January and February show this. And on a week to week basis this has also been true. Plus, it should be included that the 80GB has been selling out at Amazon as well as they other numerous signs of sales increase.201.248.250.105 (talk) 22:14, 30 March 2008 (UTC)
- Do you think Xbox 360 sales are relevant to this article? Details of the hardware shortage and the resulting Xbox 360 sales slow-down are probably properly documented elsewhere, it wouldnt seem to be in the scope of this article would it?
- Wageslave (talk) 06:29, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
New SKU model AK8CBEH1101
"The Federal Communications Commission has let slip news of one more addition to the PlayStation 3 hardware family. At some unspecified date, we'll be welcoming little AK8CBEH1101 into the gaming world, kicking and screaming with a new antennae gain for both the Bluetooth and Wi-fi modules. Hopefully, that means less SIXAXIS wonkiness, the kind that leads to Drake walking off a cliff unintentionally. The rest of the new spec is under a confidentially agreement, due to expire on April 14, so we'll hold tight until then for this potentially underwhelming reveal."
http://www.kotaku.com.au/games/2008/04/at_least_one_more_playstation_3_model_coming.html
Denzelio (talk) 11:12, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Could be a new 40GB with Dualshock 3 packed in, or maybe a "premium" model with large HDD and EE+GS PS2 chipset included (for full B/C)(60 and 20GB trade-in values have skyrocketed in Japan due to full B/C). DevonTheDude (talk) 03:19, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Sixaxis is now Discontinued in the U.S. (replaced with DS3)
Now that the DualShock 3 controller has been released in the U.S. the Sixaxis controller has now been discontinued.
"A Sony rep tells me that the Sixaxis is indeed on the way out: “Sixaxis will no longer be offered after it’s completely sold through at retail (likely by the summer timeframe).”
http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2008/04/02/sony-non-shocker-sixaxis-discontinued/
http://gizmodo.com/375452/lightning-review-playstation-3-dualshock-3-rumble-controller
Denzelio (talk) 21:37, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Article outdated?
May I ask why this featured article is almost a year out of date? Just curious.65.12.233.213 (talk) 01:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
- May I ask what parts of the article appear to be out of date to you? Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:20, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
- Just the parts discussing the models available; given that the 80 gb is now being phased out and a new model is being developed. Also, no mention of the 80 gb bundle w/ MGS4 coming out soon.65.12.233.213 (talk) 22:25, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
- I believe it was in the article at an earlier date, no idea why it was removed(if im not imagining it). Th position of the 80gb model is not clear currently. However if there is anything you feel the article needs(be it bundles or models), feel free to edit the article, citing relevant sources. John.n-irl (talk) 23:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
- Can never please everyone can you. The section involving models is primarily to show the differences in which the PS3 models offer both in hardware and compatible software, the table also shows which models are and are not still in production, the table isn't really meant to show which games or Blu-ray come with each system.Denzelio (talk) 12:59, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
- I believe it was in the article at an earlier date, no idea why it was removed(if im not imagining it). Th position of the 80gb model is not clear currently. However if there is anything you feel the article needs(be it bundles or models), feel free to edit the article, citing relevant sources. John.n-irl (talk) 23:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
- Just the parts discussing the models available; given that the 80 gb is now being phased out and a new model is being developed. Also, no mention of the 80 gb bundle w/ MGS4 coming out soon.65.12.233.213 (talk) 22:25, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
Code of Death - 80010514 Error
This article should include some detail on Error 80010514.
"Sony appears to be having problems with failure rates on the new 40GB PlayStation 3 model, according to retail sources. Speaking to Dutch site Gamed.nl, Belgian games retailer Games Mania has said that while the new 40GB model is selling well, some 40 per cent of the new consoles sold so far have been returned due to hardware defects that result in the console being unable to read Blu-Ray and other discs."
http://www.gamer.tm/news.php?id=1700 http://www.gamed.nl/view/33860
The story is further covered on respected game site Destructoid here http://www.destructoid.com/ps3-owners-does-the-code-80010514-mean-anything-to-you--80697.phtml
Where Destructiod Editors say "However, it should be known that at least a couple people on staff know of others who have had issues with their PS3's giving up the ghost."
Another post on the topic is here: http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=26751
Where they say "The error code most people have been getting for this is '80010514', sometimes referred to as the "code of death." Most forum members have said Sony will replace the unit with no fuss, however if your PS3 is out of warranty it apparently costs $150 to be fixed." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wageslave (talk • contribs) 17:22, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
- "Interestedly, at the time of this writing the PlayStation.com forums are temporarily closed..." [2]
- Wageslave (talk) 18:04, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
- Interestingly, this is coming from teamxbox.com...
- Interestingly must be 360 fanboys who insist on adding this to the article to claim PS3 is as faulty as the 360. Unless there are statistics or a percentage released of how often this actually occurs to owners then it can never be truthfully explained, this could be a very minor problem. Until known any explantation in the article would be misleading. As this is the first time many of us have heard of this particular numbered problem, that and the fact it's usually a faulty hard drive sector (faulty HDD) not the actual system at fault.
- http://www.destructoid.com/ps3-owners-does-the-code-80010514-mean-anything-to-you--80697.phtml
- http://www.destructoid.com/apparently-the-80010514-error-doesn-t-mean-anything-to-sony-either-80938.phtml
- Denzelio (talk) 22:34, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
- The xbox 360 is not relevant to this discussion.
- If you've noticed, I didnt add the information here to the article, I would hope that the regular, neutral editors of this page would add the information themselves. Clearly it is notworthy, and, the datelines on the articles above span about 5 months. This isnt a "new" discussion.
- "Statistics or percentages" are not necessary to warrant inclusion in the article at all. What is know should be included. When new information arrives, that should be integrated.
- Wageslave (talk) 22:50, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Concerning the forums, the forums have been planning this down time for a few number of weeks. No conspiracy im afraid. John.n-irl (talk) 23:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
- So you agree without "Statistics or percentages" the problem can only be mentioned as a minor problem that happens to a rare few people, so really it may only be as harmful as any other error code nothing significant. Along with the fact it is usually the HDD (replaceable) not the system is it worth mentioning?.Denzelio (talk) 23:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
http://blogs.pcworld.com/gameon/archives/006781.html - PC World says that the problem does indeed exist (which is true), but it falls well "within the acceptable failure range for any piece of electronic equipment". I would say is is a bit of a POV issue to be adding this into the article. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 03:29, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
- There are half-a-dozen sources Destructiod, and IGN's teamxbox.com site, and others. PC World, while a fine and repuatable source, that particular page is a Blogger's opinion, no more or less valid than the other sites. The threshold for adding information to the article is Wikipedia:Verifiability "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. "Verifiable" in this context means that readers should be able to check that material added to Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable source.".
- Clearly the information is being published in reputable sources. Presenting "both sides" of the situation may be in order.
- Wageslave (talk) 14:42, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Wageslave is a obsessive disruptive edit troll that normally spends his time hiding any references to the Xbox 360s technical problems. He is also becomes quickly abusive to other editors. Remember to document any abusive editing and insults from him for an upcoming Arbitration against him.--8bitJake (talk) 01:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
UNITS SOLD IN JAPAN
you should change the number of units sold in japan becase sony today confirmed that the ps3 has sold 2 million units in a year and a half from release. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.3.114.33 (talk) 19:12, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Chrome Trim on 40GB system as mentioned in the comparison image
It's NOT chrome. it's silver paint. huge difference. one is shiny. one is not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.75.127 (talk) 23:43, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
- Beyond the luster of the two, there is certainly no chrome on the PS3. The article should be change to say "silver paint". As "chrome" is not a colour.
- Wageslave (talk) 19:58, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
Actually, it is a chrome finish - Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:05, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
- Based on my personal inspection, it is not electroplated, nor is it chromium plating chrome.
- Perhaps if you can find a citation that says it is chrome, and not "chrome-like" (commonly confusing colour with a process & material...) then we'd be cool. At present, I believe that is inaccurate. And, putting [citation needed] on every instance of "chrome" is unsightly. If you'd like to revert my change, I belive the responsibility would lie with you finding some kind of evidence to support that being included in the article.
- Anywho, see what you can do :) Thanks.
- Wageslave (talk) 06:09, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Sorry dude, but the onus is on you to find 100% verifiable proof that is in fact not a chrome finish. And no, your "personal inspection" is not even close to being good enough. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:12, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
- Firstly, "100% verifiable proof" isnt how Wikipedia works. Please read this WP:V, it says "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth". So, no one is required to find "100% verifiable proof" here or anywhere else on Wikipedia.
- Secondly, the claim that it *is* chromium electroplating needs a citation or source for this information, your opinion (nor mine) are sufficient to include this fact. Facts without citations are removed.
- So, we have really two options. To include [citation needed] at every instance of "chrome" or for whoever thinks it should be "Chrome" (you) and not "silver" (me) to find the citation.
- No one wants to see the [citation needed] all over the page, so, we'll just give you some time to support your claims. If you dont choose to do so, wikipedia editors should remove the claim or add the [citation needed] tags..
- Its not a major issue, maybe the regular editors / readers could find it in their regular travels.
- thanks! Wageslave (talk) 06:24, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
It's not an issue at all, mate. The "regular editors", as you put it, have had no complaints about it so far - and rightly so. "100% verifiable proof" is indeed how Wikipedia works - the threshold for inclusion is verifiability not truth. You were the one who came here insisting it is not chrome, but you did not bring any verifiable evidence to support your claims. Furthermore, it is verifiable that this is a chrome trim; it's reported all over gaming sites/press/forums.
And even if it isn't an actual electroplated chrome finish (which all sources indicate it is), it most certainly is chrome "coloured". Your changes of "chrome" to "silver" are no better, because it most certainly isn't the mineral silver.
The underlying issue here is that you, as the editor who wants to change a long standing, unopposed section of the article, must bring reliable sources that can be verified, to support those changes - which you have not done; and until you do so, it will continue to say "chrome". Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:45, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
- There is a claim in the article (that it *is* chrome) that has no citation. I'll wait a while and return to add [citation needed] tags if there arent any citations. Thanks.
- Wageslave (talk) 14:22, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Those tags will just be removed since sources are not needed for things that are glaringly obvious, e.g. the sky is blue does not need a citation. You need to provide sources to support your claim that it isn't chrome; and trust me, you won't find any. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
Erm, back to the ORIGINAL discussion, the 40GB version of the PS3 does not have a chrome finish like the 60 and 80GB models do. it just has silver paint. could this be corrected in the chart? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.75.127 (talk) 00:09, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
- Yes it could be corrected. You could do it yourself if you know how; I would do it, but to be honest, I've never seen a 40GB version in real life or on the net, so I don't know if it's true. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
Wageslave is a obsessive disruptive edit troll that normally spends his time hiding any references to the Xbox 360s technical problems. He is also becomes quickly abusive to other editors. Remember to document any abusive editing and insults from him for an upcoming Arbitration against him.--8bitJake (talk) 01:11, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
Just a question...
I know the discussion page is for discussing the article, but if the PS3's ability to read PS2 and PS1 games is based on emulation, does that mean it can read pirated copies?--Axe995 (talk) 05:04, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
- Nope they won't work. Also we don't really condone piracy on Wikipedia so you shouldn't be asking those types of questions on here. Nintenboy01 (talk) 01:42, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Criticism Section
Kojima
This article should include some of the criticism people have had of the PS3. At present, there are none.
Of the PS3 Kojima has just said; "But when we actually started developing the game, we realized there were a lot of restrictions and so it turned out how you see it today."
and
"I remember saying three years ago that we wanted to create something revolutionary, but in reality we couldn't really do that because of the CPU. We're using the Cell engine to its limit., actually."
http://kotaku.com/381412/kojima-disappointed-with-metal-gear-solid-4
Carmack
Of the PS3's development environment, John Carmack has said;
"Developers are forced to sweat blood to take advantage of the Cell"
http://kotaku.com/gaming/video/carmack-hates-the-ps3-173732.php
"Xbox 360 has far and away the best development tools," Carmack said. "PS3 is probably marginally more powerful, in terms of raw flops and graphic operations, but that’s not really the best way to look at things. When you look at these development cycles that stretch over years and years, being 20% easier to develop on is much more important than being 20% more powerful."
http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/10/18/1556
"But the honest truth is that Microsoft dev tools are so much better than Sony's. We expect to keep in mind the issues of bringing this up on the PlayStation 3... they're not helpful to the developers... I suspect they're not going to overwhelmingly crush the marketplace this time, which wasn't clear a year ago. A lot of people were thinking it's going to be a rerun of the last generation, and it's now looking like it might not be. I've been pulling for Microsoft, because I think they've done a better job for development support, and I think they have made somewhat smarter decisions on the platform. It's not like the PlayStation 3 is a piece of junk or anything. I was not a fan of the PlayStation 2 and the way its architecture was set up. With the PlayStation 3, it's not even that it's ugly—they just took a design decision that wasn't the best from a development standpoint."
http://kotaku.com/gaming/carmack/carmack-prefers-360-to-ps3-227899.php http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200701/N07.0109.1737.15034.htm?Page=3 http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3156329
Newell
Valve's Gabe Newell has said:
"Statements about 'Oh, the PS3 is going to be twice as fast as an Xbox 360' are totally meaningless . It means nothing. It's surprising that game customers don't realize how it treats them like idiots.
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=510&Itemid=2
Controller Ergonomics, Lack of Features
"PS3 Packs Promise, Lacks Punch" From Wired; "But for ergonomics, I like the Xbox controller better" "Microsoft's controller also includes force feedback, which PS3's lacks. This is a disappointment" "the Friends list is not integrated into games. On the Xbox, if you meet players in an online game, you can add them to your universal buddy list with one click, then invite them to join you in any game. Not on PS3 -- you must maintain separate Friends lists for each game"
http://www.wired.com/gaming/gamingreviews/news/2006/11/72183
Conclusion
In short, I think there needs to be a criticism section. And it should (at least) include the following: Kojima's comments (or others) about performance, Carmacks' (or others) comments about development troubles, lack of in-game Friends Lists and Lack of Custom Soundtracks.
Further, some commentary on the state of the game libary should be included. There is ample commentary on PS3 lacking quality games. I could find links very readily, but this is getting long enough.
These ideas and commentary are widely reported and many citations to these effect can easily be found.