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:::I am reverting your edits because they undermine the fine work of multiple researchers who have devoted years to PROVING that FBI actions and motives were unlawful and immoral. I do agree that the article needs more sourcing, however even the sourcing we have at present is sufficient to establish the facts presented. [[User:Apostle12|Apostle12]] ([[User talk:Apostle12|talk]]) 22:20, 13 August 2012 (UTC) |
:::I am reverting your edits because they undermine the fine work of multiple researchers who have devoted years to PROVING that FBI actions and motives were unlawful and immoral. I do agree that the article needs more sourcing, however even the sourcing we have at present is sufficient to establish the facts presented. [[User:Apostle12|Apostle12]] ([[User talk:Apostle12|talk]]) 22:20, 13 August 2012 (UTC) |
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::::If you say there's enough information to provide reliable sources, then do so. [[WP:NOT#SOAPBOX|Wikipedia is not your soapbox]], nor is it a place to [[WP:NOT#BATTLE|import conflicts]]. Sorry you had a bad brush with the feds, but that's not sufficient reason to violate [[WP:BLP]]. My edits do not "undermine" the work of others; [[WP:OWN|you do not own this article]]. [[User:Kafziel|Kafziel]] <sup>[[User talk:Kafziel|Complaint Department: Please take a number]]</sup> 22:32, 13 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Academic standards, please.
- Citing a PBS webpage (basically, an editorial) is emphatically not up to academic standards for an assertion as strong as "assassination."
- Assertions of terrorism are no go as well.. that's an editorial stance, plus the use of the words "terrorist" and "terrorism" is verboten in Wikipedia (unless referring to the US, apparently). Ling.Nut (talk) 08:35, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
- Um, what? Where are you getting the idea that terrorism is a "forbidden word?" Beeblebrox (talk) 21:57, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
- I don't personally use the word "terrorism" (too imprecise), however I see plenty of references to "anti-terrorism" on Wikipedia, which would seem to indicate that "terrorism" shouldn't be off limits. Please explain: are you one of those editors who just make up rules and state them in an officious way hoping to hold sway with other editors?Apostle12 (talk) 06:21, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- Please see the fever swamp that is Wikipedia:Words to avoid. Using "terrorist" or "terrorism" or whatever with respect to any individual or organization has been strictly nixed by folks who support the IRA and similar organizations. What's good for the goose is good for the gander: you can't use it with respect for US organizations, either. Cheers Ling.Nut (talk) 12:17, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- Well, I see what you are talking about, but it's not that it's totally forbidden, WP:TERRORIST says "If a reliable source describes a person or group using one of these words, then the description must be attributed in the article text to its source, preferably by direct quotation, and always with a verifiable citation. If the term is used with a clear meaning by multiple reliable independent sources, then citations to several such sources should be provided in the sentence where it appears." so the issue is one of being absolutely certain that a reliable source described them in this manner. Al-Queda has an example of this, of course they've been called terrorists by lots and lots of sources, probably not the case here... Beeblebrox (talk) 16:43, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
- Please see the fever swamp that is Wikipedia:Words to avoid. Using "terrorist" or "terrorism" or whatever with respect to any individual or organization has been strictly nixed by folks who support the IRA and similar organizations. What's good for the goose is good for the gander: you can't use it with respect for US organizations, either. Cheers Ling.Nut (talk) 12:17, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
FBI COINTELPRO
In the 1960's, when COINTELPRO was active, Malcolm X was assassinated. The alleged perpetrators of this were thought of as related to the FBI as agentes provocteteures. Why is there no discussion of this topic, though it appears germane, and the "target", was well within the scope that is documented the COINTELPRO's range? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.210.30.160 (talk) 03:20, 2 October 2009 (UTC)
deletion of edit
I am a lawyer. I tried to cite legal encyclopedia Corpus Juris Secundum. My edit was deleted within seconds.137.148.217.216 (talk) 14:48, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
Political assassinations
This article suggests that the FBI conducted political assassinations. If this is true, why is not one example of such an assassination provided? 69.133.126.117 (talk) 23:25, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
- Please refer to the following section of "Methods" and its associated sources, especially those having to do with the assassination of Fred Hampton:
- Extralegal Force and Violence: The FBI conspired with local police departments to threaten dissidents; to conduct illegal break-ins in order to search dissident homes; and to commit vandalism, assaults, beatings and assassinations.[18][19][20]
- The FBI specifically developed tactics intended to heighten tension and hostility between various factions the black militancy movement, for example between the Black Panthers, the United Slaves and the Blackstone Rangers. This resulted in numerous deaths, among which were the United Slave assassinations of San Diego Black Panther Party members Jim Huggins, Bunchy Carter and Sylvester Bell.[18]
- The FBI also conspired with the police departments of many U.S. cities (San Diego, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Oakland, Philadelphia, Chicago) to encourage repeated raids on Black Panther homes—often with little or no evidence of violations of federal, state, or local laws—which resulted directly in the police killing of many members of the Black Panther Party, most famously the assassination of Chicago Black Panther Party Chairman Fred Hampton on December 4, 1969.[18][19][20]
- See, especially, Special Agent Swearigan's testimony, as well as the supporting statements in the Church Report--"D. Cooperation Between the Federal Bureau of Investigation and Local Police Departments in Disrupting the Black Panther Party"
- Some of this sounds like original research, or at least a shifting of weight towards a minority POV. Whatever our personal interpretations, I don't believe most mainstream sources describe these events as political assassinations, nor do they list political assassinations as one of the purposes of cointelpro. ClovisPt (talk) 20:02, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
- I believe the article stays on point by confirming that the purpose of Cointelpro was to protect national security, prevent violence, and maintain the existing social and political order through infiltration, disruption, marginalization, and subversion of the targeted groups. That the FBI used violent means to accomplish this purpose, including provoking violence among rival Black Nationalist groups, is beyond question--the official U.S. Congressional Church Report details exactly how the FBI went about these provocations and the deaths that occurred as a direct result. Special Agent Swearigan's testimony makes it clear that the FBI's intent was to terrorize Black Nationalist groups by partnering with local law enforcement to conduct deadly raids that resulted in several assassinations, including that of Fred Hampton. These facts are supported by mainstream sources, and they are widely accepted. Apostle12 (talk) 06:34, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
- This is not OR -- many reliable sources refer to these as political assassinations, especially Fred Hampton. In fact, I know of very few reliable sources that don't call Fred Hampton's murder (a pre-planned murder, set up by the FBI once he was nominated as national spokesman for the BPP) an "assassination". -- Jrtayloriv (talk) 19:30, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
- Sorry, lost the "a": 3 or 4 students from Ron Karenga's black nationalist group US shot Bunchy Carter and another Panther. There are rumors (statement by Panther renegate Earl Anthony), that the LAPD or FBI helped the gunmen get away from the scene.--Radh (talk) 19:34, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
I do not believe that there is sufficient evidence on this page yet to suggest that any of these individuals were murdered directly on the orders of the FBI. If there is hard evidence, I suggest we provide it. If not, I suggest we remove the word "assassinations" from the page, or at least say that they have been ACCUSED of orchestrating assassinations. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.10.90.26 (talk) 22:13, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
COINTELPRO Records
I have acquired and posted FBI records pertaining to the COINTELPRO operations directed at Violence Prone Yugoslav Emigres in U.S. http://historyanarchy.blogspot.com/2010/08/newly-declassified-cointelpro-files.html I tried to add them but the link got nuked. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Historypunk (talk • contribs) 03:43, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
Puerto Rico
I have to ask...why in the beginning is the independence for Puerto Rico in quotes ("")? Wikipedia is supposed to be unbiased. The fact that it is in quotes, supposes somebody's personal and subjective belief that puertorricans have no sound, legal claim for independence. The quotes imply that "independence for Puerto Rico" is a concept invented by a group. The UN has repeatedly spoken against US colonialism in Puerto Rico, and in favor of our claim for independence (as a distinct nation that was invaded and robbed as a geopolitical experiment in the Caribbean). I won't change it, but I ask here that the quotes be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.23.202.38 (talk) 00:59, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
US vs. United Slaves
While it is technically correct to refer to the US Organization by its formal name, much of the literature (both official and academic) refers to the US Organization as "the United Slaves." Perhaps we should mention this fact, since it did become common usage. Apostle12 (talk) 22:37, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
Einstein
Albert Einstein is listed as a target of CoIntelPro. Einstein died in 1955, and the article states that the CoIntelPro program began the next year, in 1956.
Can someone elaborate?
Aoss (talk) 08:22, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
- They were trying to disprove parts of his Theory of Relativity and travel back in time to harass him? Who knows? 69.42.13.45 (talk) 04:24, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
- Early FBI counterintelligence programs operated during the Roosevelt (FDR) and Truman administrations. Einstein became a U.S. citizen in 1940, and overt racism in Princeton, New Jersey inspired him to become involved in civil rights causes beginning in the late 1940s; his experiences with racism in Nazi Germany had sensitized him to this issue. Because American Communists attached themselves to the Civil Rights Movement, the movement itself attracted the attention of the FBI; Einstein came under surveillance during the years just prior to the official 1956 inaugeration of centralized counterintelligence programs under the COINTELPRO label. The article has now been corrected to reflect these realities and avoid the apparent contradiction. Apostle12 (talk) 19:46, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
Good article
Well done to those who have contributed to this page. This is a very well sourced article with great presentation.--217.35.82.108 (talk) 19:43, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
Methods: Fabricated Content
Whoever composed the section which described "psychological warfare" and attributed certain claims to Brian Glick's book appears to have wildly embellished what it actually says. A preview reveals war at home by brian glick it never said anything about family, friends, landlords etc being "strong armed" but that they were presented false media articles about people. Why do editors make this stuff up, is it that hard to translate simple English? As it stands I think this could even be called a fringe position that this amounts to "psychological warfare" and maybe it shouldn't be in that section or the lede either. There are prolific sources which describe COINTELPRO tactics, is Glick the only one who calls this psychological warfare? "Dirty tricks" is not psychological warfare to my knowledge.Batvette (talk) 02:14, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
- Glick's use of the term "psychological warfare" seems appropriate to me. Of course there are no FBI memos saying, "Now we are going to engage in psychological warfare," but all critics of FBI tactics during COINTELPRO agree that psychological warfare was involved. As far as the article's use of the term "strong armed" to describe tactics that Glick details, I suppose that is a matter of interpretation. In my opinion "strong armed" certainly applies--due to my involvement in Berkeley's anti-Vietnam War movement during the mid 1960s, my father was "strong-armed" by the FBI to get him to discourage my participation. Unless he agreed to co-operate, the FBI threatened to yank his security clearance, which would have made it impossible for him to continue his career at Lawrence Radiation Laboratories. He pretended to go along, and shortly my parents decided to move to Chicago where he could continue his career at Argonne National Laboratories in a less hostile environment. Again, to me "strong armed" seems quite an apt description, and I'm not sure why you object to this term. But we don't have to rely on personal stories such as my own, since to do so would constitute original research. Glick details a number of tactics and examples that could also be described as "strong arming." Or perhaps you don't think physical threats count, even when people's lives are threatened. In fact we know that the FBI's COINTELPRO tactics resulted quite directly in fatal clashes between the Black Panthers and the U.S. Organization. I think "psychological warfare" and "strong armed" should remain. Apostle12 (talk) 04:52, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
- I think we should stick to what the reference states and avoid any embellishment, whether based on OR or an overall perception of what the program was about. Isn't that why we use references and provide them for people to see for themselves? On a separate note, I don't believe yanking someone's security clearance (which ultimately terminates their employment)constitutes a "physical threat". Security Clearances are funny things, they can and do yank them for some pretty silly ****. As for psychological warfare, the basis for wondering if it's relevant is because if it were widely believed to be the case, you'd think the term would appear somewhere in the Church Committee report- but it doesn't, not once. The reason this even came up is the continued claim by people who claim to be victims of "gang stalking" continue to reference COINTELPRO as a precedent to validate their claims- some are real and are likely the targets of some program, many others- perhaps the majority- appear to be suffering from delusions, in particular claiming people surround them all day jangling keys, pretending to talk on cell phones, wearing certain colored clothing, even automobiles driving by them with a license plate of a certain numerical sequence only having significance to them- to torment them with "psychological abuse". One gentleman even claims up to a thousand cars are parked daily in his city along the route he walks in specific color order, part of his ruination.
- So I'm not here to minimize or trivialize what's happened to you, in fact if anything I'd like to prevent that by avoiding such silliness to be associated with COINTELPRO, because if it were, then people would eventually associate COINTELPRO with being delusional- and if such a program IS going on still today, allowing it to be claimed by the delusional that it's happening to them, provides cover for it and keeps them from treatment which could benefit them. In the end I'm about the facts, and what is verifiable. Not believed. With all the above in mind let me know if there's a way we can modify this to your satisfaction.Batvette (talk) 21:19, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
- I never said that the FBI's threat to yank my father's security clearance constituted a "physical threat." I offered it as an example of psychological warfare--the FBI wanted to get to me by threatening to end my father's career as a nuclear physicist, which began with the Manhatten Project and ended with research into ceramic bead storage of nuclear waste in 1983. You do seem to want to "trivialize" what the loss of his career would have meant for him, my mother, and the rest of our family. Plenty of other sources use the term "psychological warfare;" that the Church Committee members didn't happen to use that particular phrase is hardly a reason not to use it. Perhaps you just haven't read widely enough among the sources offered, Glick among them; psychological warfare, physical threats, and physical attacks were quite common during COINTELPRO.
- (BTW, I did not write the section in question, though I do agree with it.)
- I'm going to relate another OR example to underscore the fact that the FBI's use of physical threats was a common ploy. At the height of my involvement in the anti-Vietnam war movement, I arrived home one day to find a man in a dark suit sitting on the living room couch in my Berkeley home. "Who are you?" I demanded, startled to see him. "I'm here from the FBI and I need to ask you some questions," came his reply as he flashed a badge. The front door had been locked and he had let himself in. He had also searched the entire house, as was evident from the open drawers and personal belongings tossed about. "Do you have a warrant?" I asked. To which he replied, "Look,(my last name), I don't need no fucking warrant. If I really wanted you I'd just hit you over the head and take you with me, and that would be the end of it!" We were alone in the house, and I decided my best protection was to take it public, so I turned and walked out the front door, despite his protests. It was a busy street, and I wanted witnesses if he was going to assault me. I shouted for anyone to hear, "This man is an FBI agent. He broke into my home and is threatening to assault me!!!" Obviously enraged, he quickly walked away.
- Look, I'm trying to work with you here and be reasonable and frankly it's hardly important enough for us to get in a pissing contest over. The fact remains the embellishment is the content of the article provides a cite to a reference which does not reflect what the content says. The passages that appear here in the article are thus fiction. We don't do that at wikipedia, it's just plain irresponsible and your personal experiences cannot be used to provide a rationale for keeping material that amounts to someone else's OR they pulled out of their tookas. I didn't touch the article and have offered the opportunity for you to tinker with it in a way that meets wiki standards but if you don't want to do that I'll just delete anything that isn't reflected verbatim in the reference because I won't walk away and leave such OR in the article. If we have to go down the road of RFCs or other means if you're insisting this OR remains its not going to be helpful that your input has been providing more OR when I'm asking wiki policy be followed, surely this can't have slipped by you.
- However since the reference also mentions verbatim psychological warfare it will remain. As a side note your father's experience is interesting but the last thing that is would be psychological warfare, I suggest you take at least a superficial glance at the subject Psychological_warfare and recognize they were actually applying direct coercion tactics. Interestingly enough once the OR content is removed from the passage it actually resembles the wiki article's description of psychological warfare (use of false printed materials presented to relatives) so I have no grounds to remove that in this case. (however it's up to you if you care or not that thousands of yahoos with every silly notion of gov't conspiracies messing with their heads are going to use that to say COINTELPRO targeted them too- I think it isn't healthy for them OR its historically verified targets, and like it or not they are out there in droves- why facilitate it? my personal injection that isn't wiki policy related) So in summary the content must reflect the reference and not contain OR. And never forget "factual" is not wiki policy. Verifiable IS and that's what I'm asking. Batvette (talk) 14:33, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
The Viola Luizzo case
It's very important to have information like this be well documented. Otherwise any errors can be used by those who want to dismiss the subject at hand as a mere conspiracy theory. It's certainly a distinct possibility that a racist organization would use character assassination without requiring the prompting of the FBI.
Of the four citations given in that part of article two make no reference to COINTELPRO. A third, now dead, was a book review of the fourth citation. The review makes no direct reference to COINTELPRO, though it's a bit closer to what I'm looking for. I think this could best be resolved by a page number or chapter reference within Mary Stanton's book. It's quite important to know exactly where the author is getting her information. I was unable to find such a reference via the horrific Google Books interface.
I was able to fix the dead link via the Wayback Machine, and am holding off tagging the disputed section while awaiting a response to my concerns. C_J_E (talk) 20:10, 26 April 2012 (UTC)
I was able to find the allegations as to Hoover's direct involvement in the Mary Stanton book at Pg 190 Chapter 7. I'm going to make a slight change to the problematic wording in the article, which should resolve the dispute here in a mutally agreeable way. — Preceding unsigned comment added by My initials were taken (talk • contribs) 22:03, 26 April 2012 (UTC)
Allegations vs. facts
Conspiracy theories—even published ones—should not be implied to be commonly accepted facts, and certainly not as they pertain to the still-living persons who may have been involved. As stated previously in the thread above, there is little or no evidence to support accusations of state-sponsored "assassinations". We're not talking about Watergate or Iran-Contra; these allegations have not been tried in any court. While it might be frustrating that the courts have been reluctant to try any COINTELPRO cases, this article should not be a soapbox about it. This all needs to be clarified as allegations, or in some cases (to avoid undue weight), removed entirely. Kafziel Complaint Department: Please take a number 18:23, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
A few examples:
- What makes Noam Chomsky a reliable source for facts—not theories, but facts—about FBI operations? He is free to offer us his analysis, but we are not to treat that analysis as fact. And we are not required to give equal weight to unsubstantiated fringe theories.
- I removed the examples from the "intended effects" section. Deciding which actions (if any) fit which examples, unless they are listed in an official mission statement, handbook, or set of orders, is original research.
- While some may claim that Black Panther Party members were assassinated, others (such as the police and FBI) claim they were killed in the course of legal, anti-crime operations. Until and unless a court finds differently, we can't state that any other way.
Myriad other problems here, but these are a few I've tried to address. We're in desperate need of some neutral (as in, not famously anti-establishment), reliable (as in, not by outside theorists but actual participants) sources. I'll try to find time for that. Kafziel Complaint Department: Please take a number 18:55, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
- Hi Kafziel. I appreciate that this is a contentious article and we have to tread carefully. I was unsure of how to feel, recently, about the removal of the FBI template from the top. But I haven't reverted that change because I wanted to see how others reacted. In response to your comments and your edits:
- Wikipedia does not use trial in court as its standard of evidence. (If it did, there are many statements we do sign off on that we couldn't; conversely, we'd have to accept the 1999 jury's decision that the Assassination of Martin Luther King, Jr. was a government conspiracy).
- We already have a page on "assassination". Some of the events you describe clearly fit within this category. Assassination is a more precise word than killing because it implies that the political motive for the killing is known. AFAICT there is ample evidence that the killing of Fred Hampton was an assassination and not a killing of some other sort.
- I agree that 'conspired' is strong language. But it's known that the FBI worked with local police departments. No reason to change all the way to 'believed to have worked with.'
- I strongly agree that more sources are needed for the article, and that the left-wing rumor mill can produce unsourced and exaggerated claims. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.
- Shalom, groupuscule (talk) 19:02, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
- Hi, Groupuscule.
- Wikipedia does not only use trial in court as the standard of evidence, but we do require some kind of evidence, or at least general agreement by historians in the absence of actual proof. None of that is presented here. It's really not accurate to compare the 1999 MLK civil case to this: On one hand, it did go to trial whereas this did not; and on the other, in 2000 the US Department of Justice found no basis for the 1999 finding. Juries in civil cases can only hand out awards; they can't dictate reality. According to WP:BLPCRIME, we do need to have proof (such as a verdict, in a criminal case) to include what could otherwise be considered potentially libelous claims. Presumption of innocence is mandatory, even on Wikipedia.
- I agree that assassination implies that the political motive for the killing is known. We don't have that here. The political motive for the killing has been suggested. Conspiracies have been asserted. Nothing has been proven. The motives—and, in fact, the actions—are not known. Not even the claim that Hampton was drugged and murdered; the presence of barbiturates in his system was disputed by the FBI's medical examiner. There were armed guards, there was shooting, people died. That sort of thing happens all the time. We don't know that the killing was politically motivated. This wasn't a president in a motorcade, or even a resistance leader killed at a rally. It was an armed criminal shot by police while (supposedly) resisting arrest. We'll probably never know the truth of what happened, but it's too great a leap to conclude that it was definitely a political assassination. Even if the FBI actively wanted him dead, that doesn't mean it was an assassination.
- It is known that the FBI worked with police departments, but it is not known that the FBI worked with local police departments "to target specific individuals, accuse them of crimes they did not commit, suppress exculpatory evidence and falsely incarcerate them." We can't ascribe that specific motive without evidence. We can state that some third party has made that claim, but we should not be adding credence to the claim by treating it as a fact.
- Hope that clarifies some of my points. I'll look into better sources soon. They might not exist, though, so we may be stuck with an article full of theories and suppositions. In which case, we just need to be more careful about how we handle them. Kafziel Complaint Department: Please take a number 21:20, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
- Hi, Groupuscule.
- Actually, Kafziel, there is more than enough evidence to prove that the FBI not only worked with local police departments, but worked with them "to target specific individuals, accuse them of crimes they did not commit, suppress exculpatory evidence and falsely incarcerate them." If you review the original trial and the exoneration of Elmer Geronimo Pratt, you will see that his release from prison and the large monetary award he received are definitive in this regard. I have followed this subject carefully since 1966, when the FBI specifically targeted me because of my involvement in early anti-Vietnam War activities in Berkeley, California. I arrived home one day to find an FBI agent sitting in my living room; he had forced open the locked front door and searched my house without permission, a typical "black bag" job. The agent started to question me, and when I demanded to see a warrant he responded, "Look, (name deleted), I don't need no fucking warrant. If I really wanted you, I'd just hit you over the head and take you with me." I realized that I was dealing with an agent who had no respect for my Constitutional rights, so I turned, exited through the front door, and took it public. Once on the busy street, I announced to anyone who would listen that an FBI agent had broken into my home, searched it without a warrant, and was illegally harassing me. Fortunately, he left as quickly and quietly as possible.
- Freedom on Information Act requests have been extremely useful in documenting FBI motives and approach during this era. Especially with respect to the Black Panthers, Curtis Austin's work has been seminal. His book, UP AGAINST THE WALL: VIOLENCE IN THE MAKING AND UNMAKING OF THE BLACK PANTHER PARTY, meticulously documents FBI harrassment of the Panthers. Even journalists who have been very critical of the Black Panther Party (e.g. Hugh Pearson, SHADOW OF THE PANTHER) agree with Austin's conclusion that Panther Fred Hampton was assassinated--the Chicago Police Department even took the macabre step of making sure the the involved officers were black, and we know that a police informant led them to the bed where Hampton was sleeping with is girlfriend.
- With respect to Viola Liuzzo, there is no question that the FBI spread rumors that it knew were false specifically to discredit her and undermine her efforts during the civil rights movement. Similar fates befell several Hollywood figures who offered support to the Panthers.
- I am reverting your edits because they undermine the fine work of multiple researchers who have devoted years to PROVING that FBI actions and motives were unlawful and immoral. I do agree that the article needs more sourcing, however even the sourcing we have at present is sufficient to establish the facts presented. Apostle12 (talk) 22:20, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
- If you say there's enough information to provide reliable sources, then do so. Wikipedia is not your soapbox, nor is it a place to import conflicts. Sorry you had a bad brush with the feds, but that's not sufficient reason to violate WP:BLP. My edits do not "undermine" the work of others; you do not own this article. Kafziel Complaint Department: Please take a number 22:32, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
- I am reverting your edits because they undermine the fine work of multiple researchers who have devoted years to PROVING that FBI actions and motives were unlawful and immoral. I do agree that the article needs more sourcing, however even the sourcing we have at present is sufficient to establish the facts presented. Apostle12 (talk) 22:20, 13 August 2012 (UTC)