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==Untitled== |
==Untitled== |
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http://www.smother.net/interviews/oxbow.php and http://www.metal-archives.com/review.php?id=45822 both discuss [[Marianne Faithful]]'s vocal contribution to the cover of [[Willie Dixon]]'s "Insane Asylum." I initially thought to look here to find out who did the vocals, so it might be worth including. However, I'm wary of starting a new section and I think someone else may have a better idea for working the info into the existing article. It isn't mentioned in her article either, but relative fame may not make it noteworthy enough for her page. I did go ahead and add Oxbow/Faithful to the list of covers of Willie Dixon songs. --[[Special:Contributions/208.81.105.101|208.81.105.101]] ([[User talk:208.81.105.101|talk]]) 19:48, 13 May 2008 (UTC) |
http://www.smother.net/interviews/oxbow.php and http://www.metal-archives.com/review.php?id=45822 both discuss [[Marianne Faithful]]'s vocal contribution to the cover of [[Willie Dixon]]'s "Insane Asylum." I initially thought to look here to find out who did the vocals, so it might be worth including. However, I'm wary of starting a new section and I think someone else may have a better idea for working the info into the existing article. It isn't mentioned in her article either, but relative fame may not make it noteworthy enough for her page. I did go ahead and add Oxbow/Faithful to the list of covers of Willie Dixon songs. --[[Special:Contributions/208.81.105.101|208.81.105.101]] ([[User talk:208.81.105.101|talk]]) 19:48, 13 May 2008 (UTC) |
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:Mention of Faithfull's contribution added with source. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 21:20, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
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== Photos == |
== Photos == |
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There are free photos of the band avalaible on flickr. [[User:Xic667|Xic667]] ([[User talk:Xic667|talk]]) 11:47, 14 September 2008 (UTC) |
There are free photos of the band avalaible on flickr. [[User:Xic667|Xic667]] ([[User talk:Xic667|talk]]) 11:47, 14 September 2008 (UTC) |
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:Thanks. Images now added. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 21:20, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
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== Undue weight == |
== Undue weight == |
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By a word count, this article devotes almost 20% of it's prose to describing poor habits of Robinson. Could this be resolved by stating that he is known for his unconventional behavior, or something along those lines? [[User:Ryan Vesey|'''''Ryan''''']] [[User talk:Ryan Vesey|'''''Vesey''''']] [[Special:Contributions/Ryan Vesey|<small>Review me!</small>]] 20:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
By a word count, this article devotes almost 20% of it's prose to describing poor habits of Robinson. Could this be resolved by stating that he is known for his unconventional behavior, or something along those lines? [[User:Ryan Vesey|'''''Ryan''''']] [[User talk:Ryan Vesey|'''''Vesey''''']] [[Special:Contributions/Ryan Vesey|<small>Review me!</small>]] 20:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:It may be that the singer's non-singing is the major topic of discussion in sources, perhaps dubious. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 20:18, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
:It may be that the singer's non-singing is the major topic of discussion in sources, perhaps dubious. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 20:18, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:Not any more, and it's a matter of opinion whether these are 'poor habits'. Replacing specific details with vagueness would not be an improvement. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 21:20, 17 July 2012 (UTC) |
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== Cajun Man == |
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This was a brief mention in a review of one track that Robinson contributed to another artist's album. I don't fell that it is really helpful or useful to the reader to include this comparison here. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 16:40, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:''The Village Voice'' was the one reliable source from a reputable news publication in the article, and so it stood out. I was surprised to see that you had cited it to establish that Robinson was the singer of Oxbow. |
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:It seems to me that the description of Robinson's singing should have some mention of criticism, particularly if reliable sources contain criticism even more than comparisons to Robert Plant and Nick Cave. 20:31, 18 July 2012 (UTC) <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|Kiefer.Wolfowitz]] ([[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Kiefer.Wolfowitz|contribs]]) </span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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::It is an offhand comment about one track and is not representative of the coverage of Robinson's vocals, while the others are consistent with the majority of coverage. Why don't you give it a rest and walk away. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 20:35, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:::Michig, |
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:::WP is a collaborative encyclopedia, and this article is not your playpen. You have complete control of your sandbox---why not use it? |
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:::<small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 20:40, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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::::Your position is clear here and I see no point continuing this discussion with you. The views of other editors would of course be welcome. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 20:55, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:::::The Voice has some of the world's most influential critics. The other sources are barely reliable and certainly low quality, if reliable. Can you find a reliable source ever reporting on one of the "awards" you listed? <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 21:53, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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::::::On the topic of awards does being rated 2011's greatest LP by "Adam Anonymous" really count? I don't know what they do about their contributors, but it appears like this is the view of one man, not Drowned in Sound. [[User:Ryan Vesey|'''''Ryan''''']] [[User talk:Ryan Vesey|'''''Vesey''''']] [[Special:Contributions/Ryan Vesey|<small>Review me!</small>]] 21:59, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:::::::Well, Michig is deleting sourced quotations by the Village Voice, an article he added as a citation, which contains nothing on Oxbow apart from the Cajun Man slam of Robinson. |
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:::::::Why not continue selecting only positive evaluations, no matter how bizarre or incredible? ''The Screwtape Letters'' and ''Vice'' magazine's accolades trump WP's "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" policy. "Album of the Year" indeed. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 08:18, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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Robinson ain't David Thomas (Pere Ubu), but Oxbow does appear in several reliable sources. We don't need to quote from ''Wayne's World''. Highbeam has several discussions of the band. Let's get rid of the sources discussing the nonsensical ("most unique") and absurdly vacuous ("sings between Robert Plant and Nick Cave"), and use RSes in English. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 22:17, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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*A few points here to hopefully knock this on the head: Firstly, the descriptions of the album as the best of 2007 are not awards, nor are they claimed to be - I will copyedit that section to clarify this. Secondly, this article is about the band Oxbow, and the Musical style section is about the musical style of the band Oxbow. What Eugene Robinson may or may not have sounded like on a guest vocal on a single track on an album by another artist is not relevant to this article. Finally, the fact that a writer uses poor English in a sentence has no bearing on the reliability of the publication in which the article appeared (or on my command of English since this insult has been thrown around elsewhere), otherwise we could use this as a reason to exclude virtually every publication in existence. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 16:49, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:*I'll agree with you on Cajun Man. There is nothing stating that he sounds like that when singing with Oxbow. I still object to the reliability of the Drowned in Sound source and have marked it as possibly unreliable. [[User:Ryan Vesey|'''''Ryan''''']] [[User talk:Ryan Vesey|'''''Vesey''''']] [[Special:Contributions/Ryan Vesey|<small>Review me!</small>]] 16:55, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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::DiS has been accepted for some time as a reliable source for album reviews. --[[User:Michig|Michig]] ([[User talk:Michig|talk]]) 17:07, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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== Highbeam sources == |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-179308546.html Oxbow: The Narcotic Story (Hydra Head Records).] Colorlines Magazine |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-21664652.html Oxbow's latest is a challenge worth taking] The Buffalo News |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P3-2467233041.html In Your Face] The Independent Weekly |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-116914938.html Culture: Fierce competition for your attention; Terry Grimley picks some highlights from the annual Fierce! Festival of groundbreaking and controversial art and performance.(Features)] The Birmingham Post (greatest rock band in the world-Vice Magazine) |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-132792786.html CULTURE: Nothing succeeds like sweet Excess; Terry Grimley meets the women behind cutting edge music promoter Capsule.(Features)] The Birmingham Post |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-107669633.html READINGS / SIGNINGS.(What's Happening)] Seattle Post-Intelligencer |
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*[http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P3-2184098161.html Chicago Luzerne Exchange] Pittsburgh City Paper |
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This is an only slightly filtered list of sources I received in a search for Eugene Robinson Oxbow on Highbeam. Feel free to reformat the list in any way you like. [[User:Ryan Vesey|'''''Ryan''''']] [[User talk:Ryan Vesey|'''''Vesey''''']] [[Special:Contributions/Ryan Vesey|<small>Review me!</small>]] 22:31, 18 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:Good work! <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 07:37, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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:The Buffalo News (a hs junior) wrote "it's all in his delivery. He doesn't necessarily scream or sing; he falls apart. His vocals are equally awkward, incomprehensible, disturbing, and forceful. Putting them together with the equally bizarre music creates a dizzying sense of gloom unlike anything you've probably heard." [http://www.coderanch.com/t/486841/md/Intelligence-Smartness-Where-do-they Jerry Seinfeld made a similar comment about sky-diving by a blind man and his seeing-eye German shepherd]. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Kiefer.Wolfowitz|<font style="color:blue;background:yellow;">'''Kiefer'''</font>]][[User talk:Kiefer.Wolfowitz#top|<font style="color:blue;">.Wolfowitz</font>]]</span></small> 07:48, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
Revision as of 17:07, 19 July 2012
Metal Unassessed | |||||||
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Marianne Faithful Guest Vocals
Untitled
http://www.smother.net/interviews/oxbow.php and http://www.metal-archives.com/review.php?id=45822 both discuss Marianne Faithful's vocal contribution to the cover of Willie Dixon's "Insane Asylum." I initially thought to look here to find out who did the vocals, so it might be worth including. However, I'm wary of starting a new section and I think someone else may have a better idea for working the info into the existing article. It isn't mentioned in her article either, but relative fame may not make it noteworthy enough for her page. I did go ahead and add Oxbow/Faithful to the list of covers of Willie Dixon songs. --208.81.105.101 (talk) 19:48, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
Photos
There are free photos of the band avalaible on flickr. Xic667 (talk) 11:47, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Undue weight
By a word count, this article devotes almost 20% of it's prose to describing poor habits of Robinson. Could this be resolved by stating that he is known for his unconventional behavior, or something along those lines? Ryan Vesey Review me! 20:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
- It may be that the singer's non-singing is the major topic of discussion in sources, perhaps dubious. Kiefer.Wolfowitz 20:18, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
- Not any more, and it's a matter of opinion whether these are 'poor habits'. Replacing specific details with vagueness would not be an improvement. --Michig (talk) 21:20, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
Cajun Man
This was a brief mention in a review of one track that Robinson contributed to another artist's album. I don't fell that it is really helpful or useful to the reader to include this comparison here. --Michig (talk) 16:40, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- The Village Voice was the one reliable source from a reputable news publication in the article, and so it stood out. I was surprised to see that you had cited it to establish that Robinson was the singer of Oxbow.
- It seems to me that the description of Robinson's singing should have some mention of criticism, particularly if reliable sources contain criticism even more than comparisons to Robert Plant and Nick Cave. 20:31, 18 July 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk • contribs)
- It is an offhand comment about one track and is not representative of the coverage of Robinson's vocals, while the others are consistent with the majority of coverage. Why don't you give it a rest and walk away. --Michig (talk) 20:35, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- Michig,
- WP is a collaborative encyclopedia, and this article is not your playpen. You have complete control of your sandbox---why not use it?
- Kiefer.Wolfowitz 20:40, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- Your position is clear here and I see no point continuing this discussion with you. The views of other editors would of course be welcome. --Michig (talk) 20:55, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- The Voice has some of the world's most influential critics. The other sources are barely reliable and certainly low quality, if reliable. Can you find a reliable source ever reporting on one of the "awards" you listed? Kiefer.Wolfowitz 21:53, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- On the topic of awards does being rated 2011's greatest LP by "Adam Anonymous" really count? I don't know what they do about their contributors, but it appears like this is the view of one man, not Drowned in Sound. Ryan Vesey Review me! 21:59, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- Well, Michig is deleting sourced quotations by the Village Voice, an article he added as a citation, which contains nothing on Oxbow apart from the Cajun Man slam of Robinson.
- Why not continue selecting only positive evaluations, no matter how bizarre or incredible? The Screwtape Letters and Vice magazine's accolades trump WP's "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" policy. "Album of the Year" indeed. Kiefer.Wolfowitz 08:18, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
- On the topic of awards does being rated 2011's greatest LP by "Adam Anonymous" really count? I don't know what they do about their contributors, but it appears like this is the view of one man, not Drowned in Sound. Ryan Vesey Review me! 21:59, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- The Voice has some of the world's most influential critics. The other sources are barely reliable and certainly low quality, if reliable. Can you find a reliable source ever reporting on one of the "awards" you listed? Kiefer.Wolfowitz 21:53, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- Your position is clear here and I see no point continuing this discussion with you. The views of other editors would of course be welcome. --Michig (talk) 20:55, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- It is an offhand comment about one track and is not representative of the coverage of Robinson's vocals, while the others are consistent with the majority of coverage. Why don't you give it a rest and walk away. --Michig (talk) 20:35, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
Robinson ain't David Thomas (Pere Ubu), but Oxbow does appear in several reliable sources. We don't need to quote from Wayne's World. Highbeam has several discussions of the band. Let's get rid of the sources discussing the nonsensical ("most unique") and absurdly vacuous ("sings between Robert Plant and Nick Cave"), and use RSes in English. Kiefer.Wolfowitz 22:17, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- A few points here to hopefully knock this on the head: Firstly, the descriptions of the album as the best of 2007 are not awards, nor are they claimed to be - I will copyedit that section to clarify this. Secondly, this article is about the band Oxbow, and the Musical style section is about the musical style of the band Oxbow. What Eugene Robinson may or may not have sounded like on a guest vocal on a single track on an album by another artist is not relevant to this article. Finally, the fact that a writer uses poor English in a sentence has no bearing on the reliability of the publication in which the article appeared (or on my command of English since this insult has been thrown around elsewhere), otherwise we could use this as a reason to exclude virtually every publication in existence. --Michig (talk) 16:49, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
Highbeam sources
- Oxbow: The Narcotic Story (Hydra Head Records). Colorlines Magazine
- Oxbow's latest is a challenge worth taking The Buffalo News
- In Your Face The Independent Weekly
- Culture: Fierce competition for your attention; Terry Grimley picks some highlights from the annual Fierce! Festival of groundbreaking and controversial art and performance.(Features) The Birmingham Post (greatest rock band in the world-Vice Magazine)
- CULTURE: Nothing succeeds like sweet Excess; Terry Grimley meets the women behind cutting edge music promoter Capsule.(Features) The Birmingham Post
- READINGS / SIGNINGS.(What's Happening) Seattle Post-Intelligencer
- Chicago Luzerne Exchange Pittsburgh City Paper
This is an only slightly filtered list of sources I received in a search for Eugene Robinson Oxbow on Highbeam. Feel free to reformat the list in any way you like. Ryan Vesey Review me! 22:31, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
- Good work! Kiefer.Wolfowitz 07:37, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
- The Buffalo News (a hs junior) wrote "it's all in his delivery. He doesn't necessarily scream or sing; he falls apart. His vocals are equally awkward, incomprehensible, disturbing, and forceful. Putting them together with the equally bizarre music creates a dizzying sense of gloom unlike anything you've probably heard." Jerry Seinfeld made a similar comment about sky-diving by a blind man and his seeing-eye German shepherd. Kiefer.Wolfowitz 07:48, 19 July 2012 (UTC)