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== Bounty Notice == |
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:Awesome! Anyone have any specific ideas on what would need to happen before we could nominate it? Off the top of my head, I've been meaning to add relevant quotations and ideas from [Robert Simpson (composer)|Robert Simpson]'s ''The Essence of Bruckner''. This is a good impetus to get on that. [[User:Andrewski|Andrewski]] 22:39, 25 July 2006 (UTC) |
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== Bruckner rhythm == |
== Bruckner rhythm == |
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Revision as of 22:39, 25 July 2006
Bounty Notice
- Awesome! Anyone have any specific ideas on what would need to happen before we could nominate it? Off the top of my head, I've been meaning to add relevant quotations and ideas from [Robert Simpson (composer)|Robert Simpson]'s The Essence of Bruckner. This is a good impetus to get on that. Andrewski 22:39, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Bruckner rhythm
- Symphony No. 6 in A major, written in 1879-1881, is an oft-neglected work. Whereas the Bruckner rhythm (3+2) is completely absent from the previous Symphony, in this one it permeates everything, appearing both horizontally and vertically.
I don't know Bruckner as well as I should - what is this "Bruckner rhythm"? The (3+2) makes it sound like it might be three triplet quavers (or crotchets, or whatever) followed by two straight quavers (crotchets, whatever) - is this right? Isn't two straight notes followed by a triplet actually more common Brucker (ie, 2+3)? Also, how can a rhythm appear vertically? --Camembert
Yes, that's what the Bruckner rhythm is, and you're probably right that 2+3 is more common in Bruckner, or at least that's the form more common on prominent themes. As to how can a rhythm appear vertically? Perhaps there is a better way of expressing this. Sometimes, Bruckner might give the first violins to play 3+2 and in the same bar give the second violins 2+3. This isn't so bad for performers if it's all, say, in crotchets or in quavers, making a bar look more or less like this:
1--2--,1-2-3-
1-2-3-,1--2--
But when Bruckner uses the 2+3 or 3+2 in quavers in one part and in crotchets in another part in the same bar, such as is often the case in Sym. 6, performers start complaining. But then again, performers who don't like Bruckner's music will complain about anything ("He expects us to play tremolo pianisimo? He must be crazy!"). -- Del_arte
Camembert is quite right. Bruckner rhythm started long before the 6th symphony (which might well be regarded as a fantasia on Bruckner rhythm). In its original form it was 2+3 (not 3+2, which is a later variant). One only has to listen to the 4th symphony to capture the true essence of Bruckner rhythm. -- Chuck 17:05, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
- Whereas the Bruckner rhythm (3+2) is completely absent from the previous [i.e. the 5th] Symphony, in this one it permeates everything, appearing both horizontally and vertically
Isn't the Bruckner rhythm present "vertically" in the slow movement of the 5th symphony? The main theme has duplets in the oboe against triplets in the pizzicato string accompaniment. Grover cleveland 17:37, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
- Sure, but I don't think that Bruckner's (biographical) article is the place to discuss specific instances of it. I think we should work on the Bruckner rhythm article and list notable instances there, of which this would be one. Also, we could probably make mention of the Bruckner rhythm in each of the symphonies' movements' notes. Andrewski 21:25, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Delinking Vienna institutions
I delinked Vienna Conservatory, Vienna University and Wiener Hofbibliothek because there appears to no interest in writing articles on these institutions in the English Wikipedia or even the German Wikipedia. -Del_arte
Nicknames
I inserted the nicknames for the symphonies from the book The Da Capo Catalog of Musical Compositions, by Chwiałkowski. Anyone have more info on these names? CoolGuy 21:46, 27 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Disregard below comment.. whoops.. I apparently cannot read. I have no info nor any other source but am glad that there is some source for them aside from the website I mentioned. (Well, aside from 4 which is Romantic always and 3 which because of the Wagner-quotations in the first version- many of them excised in the 2nd vers.- and the dedication, is likewise, etc.) 9 I have heard referred to as Laus Deo - this may be an inscription? Yes, I have seen 8 referred to as Apocalyptic before; the other nickname may refer to the main theme of the scherzo. The nicknames of 6 and 7 I have not seen though they make some sense ;) ... Schissel : bowl listen 04:53, Feb 28, 2005 (UTC)
Bruckner 1 nickname
Is Bruckner 1 indeed nicknamed "The Saucy Maid" (in any of its versions)? I know the Web is not the be-all and end-all of references, still less a search engine and still less google, but google turns up only various varieties of Amazon sites as sources for this... Schissel : bowl listen 04:49, Feb 28, 2005 (UTC)
I too have not heard much about this, and when I asked on a discussion board that included many people who know a lot about bruckner, they all had no idea what I was talking about. Unless there are objections, I am going to remove it.
Squeemu
Bruckner conductors
I'm greatly surprised to see that Herbert von Karajan is listed as a famous interpreter of Bruckner while Bruno Walter is not. I suspect that von Karajan was really riding the CD wave, while Bruno Walter has been largely ignored for his taught, dramatic interpretations of Bruckner because his recordings were largely made at or before the dawn of the Hi-Fi era. Additionally, Walter (having had to relocate to the States) never had the opportunity to enjoy a long tenure with a top-flight orchestra - in contrast to von Karajan's affiliation with the Berlin Philharmonic. The Walter recording of the Bruckner 9th is still a gold standard for interpretation. Simply compare the Herbert von Karajan page (which makes no mention of his Bruckner conducting at all) with the Bruno Walter page. While I admire much in von Karajan's Bruckner discography, I absolutely treasure my Bruno Walter recordings of Bruckner, even though most are on well-worn LP's. -- Chuck 17:05, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
Wikipedian Brucknerites
I created a user category for Wikipedian Brucknerites. I hope you all will join! :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedian_Brucknerites Andrewski 17:26, 19 March 2006 (UTC)