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::Awesome. The more the merrier. [[User:Beeblebrox|Beeblebrox]] ([[User talk:Beeblebrox|talk]]) 03:04, 20 January 2016 (UTC) |
::Awesome. The more the merrier. [[User:Beeblebrox|Beeblebrox]] ([[User talk:Beeblebrox|talk]]) 03:04, 20 January 2016 (UTC) |
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::{{u|Yamaguchi先生}} I regret to inform you that we have not received an e-mail from you. In any case, to volunteer you can simply [https://utrs.wmflabs.org/register.php register an account here]. We're currently developping a new OAuth system to auto-authenticate admins, bypassing the need for individual registration, for that's just a project. :) <span style="font-size:10pt;color:white;background:black;padding:0 3px;"><big>☺</big> · [[User:Salvidrim!|<span class="smallcaps" style="font-variant:small-caps;"><span style="color:white">Salvidrim!</span></span>]] · [[User talk:Salvidrim|<span style="color:white">✉</span>]]</span> 03:47, 20 January 2016 (UTC) |
::{{u|Yamaguchi先生}} I regret to inform you that we have not received an e-mail from you. In any case, to volunteer you can simply [https://utrs.wmflabs.org/register.php register an account here]. We're currently developping a new OAuth system to auto-authenticate admins, bypassing the need for individual registration, for that's just a project. :) <span style="font-size:10pt;color:white;background:black;padding:0 3px;"><big>☺</big> · [[User:Salvidrim!|<span class="smallcaps" style="font-variant:small-caps;"><span style="color:white">Salvidrim!</span></span>]] · [[User talk:Salvidrim|<span style="color:white">✉</span>]]</span> 03:47, 20 January 2016 (UTC) |
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== Advice on AE procedures == |
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Another editor has just made some pretty [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement&diff=700749815&oldid=700743812 serious accusations] about me (in a thread that was originally about something else). I am pretty taken aback and I would like advice on the relevant AE procedures. Am I allowed to ask for time to compose a response? Am I allowed to call witnesses? [[User:Darkfrog24|Darkfrog24]] ([[User talk:Darkfrog24|talk]]) 13:13, 20 January 2016 (UTC) |
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Requests for comment
RfC: Change INFOBOXUSE to recommend the use of infoboxes?
(Initiated 68 days ago on 15 March 2024) Ready to be closed. Charcoal feather (talk) 17:02, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
new closer needed |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
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WP:RSN#RFC:_The_Anti-Defamation_League
(Initiated 46 days ago on 7 April 2024) Three related RFCs in a trench coat. I personally think the consensus is fairly clear here, but it should definitely be an admin close. Loki (talk) 14:07, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Enforcing ECR for article creators
(Initiated 45 days ago on 8 April 2024) Discussion appears to have died down almost a month after this RfC opened. Would like to see a formal close of Q1 and Q2. Awesome Aasim 00:11, 8 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Brothers of Italy#RfC on neo-fascism in info box 3 (Effectively option 4 from RfC2)
(Initiated 44 days ago on 8 April 2024) Clear consensus for change but not what to change to. I've handled this RfC very badly imo. User:Alexanderkowal — Preceding undated comment added 11:50, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: The RfC tag was removed the same day it was started. This should be closed as a discussion, not an RfC. voorts (talk/contributions) 22:03, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Mukokuseki#RfC on using the wording "stereotypically Western characteristics" in the lead
(Initiated 42 days ago on 11 April 2024) ☆SuperNinja2☆ TALK! 09:41, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- See Talk:Mukokuseki#Close Plz 5/21/2024 Orchastrattor (talk) 20:34, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Tesla,_Inc.#Rfc_regarding_Tesla's_founders
(Initiated 36 days ago on 17 April 2024) Will an experienced uninvolved editor please assess consensus? There has been a request at DRN now that the RFC has completed activity, but what is needed is formal closure of the RFC. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:36, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Done Robert McClenon (talk) 04:59, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:SpaceX Starship flight tests#RfC: Should we list IFT mission outcome alongside launch outcome?
(Initiated 32 days ago on 20 April 2024) An involved user has repeatedly attempted to close this after adding their arguments. It's a divisive topic and a close would stop back and forth edits. DerVolkssport11 (talk) 12:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- To clarify, the RfC was closed in this dif, and an IP editor unclosed it, with this statement: "involved and pushing"
- In just over an hour, the above editor voiced support for the proposal.
- I reclosed it, and the same IP opened the RfC again, with this message: "pushing by involved users so ask for more comments".
- I reclosed once more. And then the editor who opened this requests opened it. To avoid violated WP:3RR, I have not reclosed it, instead messaging the original closer to notify them.
- The proposal itself was an edit request that I rejected. The IP who made the request reopened the request, which I rejected once more. They then proceeded to open an RfC. Redacted II (talk) 12:58, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Hunter Biden#RfC: Washington Post report concerning emails
(Initiated 28 days ago on 24 April 2024) There's been no comments in 5 days. TarnishedPathtalk 03:20, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
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Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 April 27#Category:Unrecognized tribes in the United States
(Initiated 46 days ago on 7 April 2024) This one has been mentioned in a news outlet, so a close would ideally make sense to the outside world. HouseBlaster (talk · he/him) 13:56, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:Stress marks in East Slavic words
(Initiated 17 days ago on 6 May 2024) * Pppery * it has begun... 17:30, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
Place new discussions concerning XfDs above this line using a level 3 heading
Other types of closing requests
Talk:1985_Pacific_hurricane_season#Proposed_merge_of_Hurricane_Ignacio_(1985)_into_1985_Pacific_hurricane_season
(Initiated 113 days ago on 30 January 2024) Listing multiple non-unanimous merge discussions from January that have run their course. Noah, AATalk 13:50, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Talk:12 February 2024 Rafah strikes#Merge proposal to Rafah offensive
(Initiated 100 days ago on 13 February 2024) The discussion has been inactive for over a month, with a clear preference against the merge proposal. CarmenEsparzaAmoux (talk) 19:35, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Rupert_Sheldrake#Talkpage_"This_article_has_been_mentioned_by_a_media_organization:"_BRD
(Initiated 36 days ago on 16 April 2024) - Discussion on a talkpage template, Last comment 6 days ago, 10 comments, 4 people in discussion. Not unanimous, but perhaps there is consensus-ish or strength of argument-ish closure possible. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 07:24, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
- It doesn't seem to me that there is a consensus here to do anything, with most editors couching their statements as why it might (or might not) be done rather than why it should (or should not). I will opine that I'm not aware there's any precedent to exclude {{Press}} for any reason and that it would be very unusual, but I don't think that's good enough reason to just overrule Hipal. —Compassionate727 (T·C) 01:01, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Move review/Log/2024 May#Multiple page move of David articles
(Initiated 22 days ago on 1 May 2024) * Pppery * it has begun... 18:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Press_Your_Luck_scandal#Separate_articles
(Initiated 20 days ago on 2 May 2024) Please review this discussion. --Jax 0677 (talk) 01:42, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Agroforestry#Merge_proposal
(Initiated 19 days ago on 3 May 2024) As the proposer I presume I cannot close this. It was started more than a week ago and opinions differed somewhat. Chidgk1 (talk) 13:46, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Move review/Log/2024 May#2018–2019 Gaza border protests
(Initiated 13 days ago on 9 May 2024) * Pppery * it has begun... 18:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
Talk: Political controversies in the Eurovision Song Contest#Requested move 13 May 2024
(Initiated 9 days ago on 13 May 2024)
Move proposal on a contentious area which has been going more than long enough.
PicturePerfect666 (talk) 03:43, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Relisted by editor BilledMammal on 21 May 2024. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. put'er there 02:20, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
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Standard offer request for Bazaan
Hello,
I am passing along a Standard offer unblock request from Bazaan (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). This request was sent to UTRS. The user has requested that the content of the unblock request be forwarded to the noticeboard. The relevant content is as follows:
I agree to another Standard Offer if necessary, although it would be the second time. I would like the content of my unblock request to be forwarded to the noticeboard. I promise to never repeat the behaviour which led to my initial block, and the subsequent indefinite block.
Why do you believe you should be unblocked? It's been six months, please give me another chance. At least give me a rope.
If you are unblocked, what articles do you intend to edit? Most South Asian, but wide ranging
Why do you think there is a block currently affecting you? If you believe it's in error, tell us how. I purposefully brought a sock puppetry ban on my account. It's my fault. I have suffered enough, including tremendous personal attacks.
Is there anything else you would like us to consider when reviewing your block? Plenty of accounts have been blocked in my name, although most aren't mine.
The ones used by me are Bazaan, Rainmaker23, Uck22, JKhan20 and Merchant of Asia.
The user has not received any additional blocks on the account and is therefore tentatively eligible for Standard Offer consideration. Thanks, Nakon 01:23, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- See Sockpuppet investigations/Bazaan. BMK (talk) 01:46, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- There were issues concerning Bazaan and his or her socks other then sockpuppetry itself, which the editor doesn't mention. Search on "Bazaan" in the noticeboard files. I'd like to hear what the editor has to say about that behavior. BMK (talk) 01:52, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- I've modified Bazaan's block to permit him to edit his talk page: if we're willing to consider unblocking someone, the situation isn't so bad that talk access should remain disabled, and it's easier if the user can post messages on his own talk page instead of relying on UTRS assistance. Nakon, would you mind sending Bazaan an email asking him to make further replies on his talk page? Nyttend (talk) 02:31, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- I've sent User:Bazaan an email update regarding their talk page. Thanks, Nakon 02:34, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- Apart from the sockpuppetry, there was some copyright issues way, way back. Is there anything else, from a content perspective, that would merit a conditional unblock? By which I mean, an "unblock conditional on an acceptance of a topic ban in articles relating to XYZ." Blackmane (talk) 06:01, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment - I may be unusually strict, but I oppose any sort of standard offer when there has been sockpuppetry/ I don't think that anyone who has engaged in sockpuppetry can be trusted at their end, at least not until the twenty-second century. That is my opinion. It just reflects a distinction between editors who make mistakes and editors who choose to game the system. I know that other editors are more forgiving than I am, and I am very forgiving of flaming, but not of sockpuppetryl Robert McClenon (talk) 06:48, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
- Further note from Bazaan's talk page:
This was left as an unblock request, which I've declined because it wouldn't be right for me to unblock him as this discussion's still ongoing. It was a procedural decline (don't think of it as a frivolous request), and I've asked him to use {{helpme}} when writing future comments for this discussion. Nyttend (talk) 13:40, 9 January 2016 (UTC)I am responding to issues raised in ANI. I again commit myself to never repeating the behavior which caused my indefinite block. In 2013 and 2014, I had differences with a few editors of WP:Bangladesh, which unfortunately swelled into a rather traumatic cycle of personal hostilities. This included pointless edit wars and conflicts over what pictures to be placed in what article. The absence of Wikipedia administrative or arbitration personnel caused the situation to deteriorate further. Initially when I joined Wikipedia around 2007, I was much younger and faced several issues like copyright infringement. But I now have a stronger understanding of Wikipedia policies. I believe I have matured over time. My contributions were never questioned for pushing an unacceptable POV, but a few people at times disagreed with its relevance. However, I used reliable and credible references. If my editing privileges are restored, you will not see any dramatic rise in editing activity. If there are any issues, it will be brought to either DRN or ANI. I've learnt my lesson truly well. I don't deserve a topic ban as I never had serious content disputes. It was mostly personal attacks over pictures and relevant sentences. Lastly regarding sockpuppetry, please have a look at the first investigation. As one administrator notes, he didn't even consider what happened to be sockpuppetry. I opened a second account after being blocked. My mistake. I have always made good faith contributions. Never in bad faith of gaming the system.
- Bazaan writes "I believe I have matured over time", but he also writes "The absence of Wikipedia administrative or arbitration personnel caused the situation to deteriorate further" and "I don't deserve a topic ban as I never had serious content disputes. It was mostly personal attacks over pictures and relevant sentences." These don't appear to me to be the statements of someone who has "learnt [their] lesson truly well", as they are still blaming others and not taking responsibility for their actions. And for an editor who used multiple sockpuppets to write "Lastly regarding sockpuppetry, please have a look at the first investigation. As one administrator notes, he didn't even consider what happened to be sockpuppetry. I opened a second account after being blocked. My mistake." is not acceptable. Perhaps we can accept that one sockpuppet was a "mistake", but what about the other three they admit to? (That's assuming we can take their word that other accounts which were blocked as theirs were incorrectly identified.) I'm not yet closing the door on this, but, at least so far, I do not find the editor's comments to be persuasive. BMK (talk) 00:43, 10 January 2016 (UTC)
- Although I'm often in agreement with BMK's opinions, in this case I do believe a few of Bazaan's statements are somewhat excusable. Articles about the sub continent can be very contentious considering articles about India and Pakistan ended up at Arbcom. Perhaps Bangladeshi articles should fall into that category given the nation's history with India, but that's a discussion for another page. The sockpuppetry issue is certainly of concern. Perhaps a quick check by a CheckUser would alleviate this concern. [Iff] no socking is revealed in the last 6 months, I could probably support a conditional unblock. Bazaan has admitted to having issues in Bangladeshi articles in the past and letting him back into this area may not be healthiest. If no socking is revealed, then I could support an unblock provided a 3 month topic ban from Bangladeshi articles is levied to encourage Bazaan to edit somewhere else so the community could regain some confidence and to truly prove that he has "matured over time". However, if socking is revealed within the last 6 months, then the offer is off the table. Blackmane (talk) 05:29, 10 January 2016 (UTC)
- I have similar concerns to Blackmane; given how controversial such articles can be, and the past troubles this editor has had while editing them,
Most South Asian, but wide ranging
doesn't seem the best space to dive straight back into. Perhaps a 3-month topic ban from all sub-continent / South Asian articles would be a good place to start? GoldenRing (talk) 11:12, 12 January 2016 (UTC)
- oppose unblock - I had edited with him and I would say that it was a bad experience. Yes he has evaded his block enough times for like a year, I can see that some of his nationalistic edits on Bangladesh subjects had been removed, a few more are still left to be checked. You need to read his unblock request, "My contributions were never questioned for pushing an unacceptable POV" or "I opened a second account after being blocked" and "I have always made good faith contributions. Never in bad faith of gaming the system"[1] tells that he rejects that he was totally wrong with his blatant policy violations that he has made, which includes vandalism and block evasion. How he can be trusted with this? I understand that I had socked too but blaming others or failing to accept it is not good. Capitals00 (talk) 03:57, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Oppose unblock - this is a historically highly disruptive user. Normally I'm quite lenient with supporting standard offers, but this is not a case of an editor going off the deep end one time and then seeing the error of their ways. Here we have an editor who was indef'd for outright vandalism who attempted to abuse a process to erase their history, and then socked through their siteban for almost another full year. That behaviour ended less than a year ago, and I don't think we should even be considering the standard offer until at least that much time has gone by. Call it punitive, whatever: I do think a very strong message needs to be sent to this user. Nevertheless, I have a proposal: that Bazaan be conditionally unblocked, under the conditions that they are indefinitely topic banned from any topics related to Bangladesh, broadly construed, and may not operate more than one account for any purpose; conditions may be appealed after no less than one year. They are encouraged to contribute constructively in other areas and to follow all content and behavioural guidelines during this time. (Non-administrator comment) Ivanvector 🍁 (talk) 23:16, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Oppose unblock as requested Several of the requesters statements seem to indicate that they do no realize which behaviour of theirs was disruptive. Capitals00 has gone over some of those statements. I would not oppose a conditional unblock that involves a topic ban from areas this user was disruptive in in the past. HighInBC 23:21, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support unblock, and accept standard offer, though only with close scrutiny, and the understanding that if he even so much as leaves a major edit marked as minor, would be enough for a total site ban. Besides that, I sensed a of ring of truth and sincerity that gave me a rather brief reprieve, but just enough to give him another chance, but only ONE chance.. after this, this is it.. gone for good. I think his gaming the system and bad behaviour in the past is simply his way of beating the system.. he had a genuine interest in improving the project but for whatever reason his way of going about it is breaking some site rules that he seems to feel are not as binding (to him) as they inevitably are; plus his intellect and wit would get him past it it without a scratch, and got a rude awakening that he can't just breeze his way past our site policies. Anyway.. my characterizations may be totally off-beat here but this was my two cents and initial impressions that colored by my decision to support. Thanks very much. -- Ϫ 04:33, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
Adding Template:Empty-warn-deletion and other post-deletion notices to Twinkle
Not sure about the rest of you, but I didn't even know these templates existed until recently. I have been doing a terrible practice of first using Twinkle to request speedy deletion, then deleting it (never mind if this was done too hastily, let's assume it wasn't). That way the user gets that important info they need about why the page was inappropriate, along with a welcome template, etc. I know of other admins who also follow this less-than-ideal procedure.
So, I thought this workflow should be incorporated into Twinkle. This would be a whole new interface change, that I figure would mimic the Block module. That is, you have a "delete page" checkbox, and another for "add deletion notice to user talk page". The latter would welcome the user if they haven't been already, and issue a deletion notice if they've haven't already received a notice about the page being nominated for deletion. We'd need to map each rationale to one of the existing post-deletion templates, or create a few new ones as needed.
Any thoughts or suggestions on this matter? Is this effort worthwhile - as in, would you use it!? =P
Related: Around midday GMT on 15 January I'm going to deploy a big update to the Twinkle CSD module. This will just make it so that admins can delete under multiple rationale, enter in URLs for copyright vios, etc, just like you can for requesting speedy deletion. More on that later! — MusikAnimal talk 04:39, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- (Non-administrator comment) Cool! That sounds absolutely appropriate for certain types of speedy, like ones dealing with copyvio, since those almost never can be successfully contested. I'd be more concerned about enabling an instant A7 with no warning, though. —/Mendaliv/2¢/Δ's/ 04:54, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- I had the same thought, however the page could have been up for a while with no modifications, in which case A7 without prior notice might be appropriate. I feel like Twinkle functionality can have a big influence on what users do, so maybe there should be an additional confirmation for certain criterion like A7 — MusikAnimal talk 05:20, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- You wouldn't be "enabling an instant A7 with no warning", that option is available to every admin anyway, and some (many?) use it (I do, to give an example). Whether a page gets tagged for A7 by an editor and deleted two minutes later by an admin, or gets deleted straight away, won't make much of a difference for the user being informed / warned. I have no objection to the proposal, automatically informing the user isn't a problem, but this shouldn't be used to impose new restrictions on what can be deleted. Fram (talk) 09:03, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- No, we don't want Twinkle to introduce any unaccepted restrictions. However there is a somewhat accepted norm to allow users some time to work on their article before deleting under less serious criterion like A7. I'm thinking once you hit submit to delete under any of the A-criteria (except maybe A2), Twinkle will check when the article was created. If was created say, less than 30 minutes ago, it will prompt if you are sure you want to proceed with deletion. This functionality should probably also be applied when requesting speedy deletion. The idea here again I think is not to enforce some practice, rather to recommend and/or make it easier to follow that practice — MusikAnimal talk 19:19, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- You wouldn't be "enabling an instant A7 with no warning", that option is available to every admin anyway, and some (many?) use it (I do, to give an example). Whether a page gets tagged for A7 by an editor and deleted two minutes later by an admin, or gets deleted straight away, won't make much of a difference for the user being informed / warned. I have no objection to the proposal, automatically informing the user isn't a problem, but this shouldn't be used to impose new restrictions on what can be deleted. Fram (talk) 09:03, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- I had the same thought, however the page could have been up for a while with no modifications, in which case A7 without prior notice might be appropriate. I feel like Twinkle functionality can have a big influence on what users do, so maybe there should be an additional confirmation for certain criterion like A7 — MusikAnimal talk 05:20, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- I've got a better idea. Unless it's a copyvio / attack or something actually urgent, one editor should CSD tag it, and then another editor can delete it if they agree with the assessment. It's best to keep the "editor" and "administrator" roles separate. NE Ent 21:16, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Why? When I come across an article written by FirstNameLastName with the text "FirstName LastName is a Software developer who works for Tata Consultancy Services Lmtd.", I don't wait for a second opinion, I A7 delete on sight. Tagging articles for deletion is hardly part of the "editor" role, it is maintenance, just like deletion is. People are made admins (or remain admins) because their judgment in deletion discussions is judged to be sound and because they are trusted not to use the tools too fast normally. If admins regularly make bad deletions, they are normally called upon this. Adding bureaucracy (the need to have two people involved in a speedy, the need to wait 30 minutes, the need to first inform the page creator, ...) will only result in poor pages being kept longer (with more pages slipping through the cracks), encouraging people to create more of the same. Is there an actual problem your "better idea" is solving, or is it just a philosophically "better" idea? Fram (talk) 08:05, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
Big update to Twinkle CSD module
I've just deployed a big update to the CSD module. You can now delete under multiple rationale, and the deletion summaries are generated by the corresponding speedy deletion template. This means they live in one place, and you don't need a Twinkle developer to update them. If a page is already been tagged for speedy deletion, the CSD module will presupply the edit summary created by the speedy template, just like it does now if you delete manually. You also can use the same parameters you can use when requesting speedy deletion. For instance, if you delete under G12 you can provide URLs which will appear in the deletion summary.
Other unrelated changes you'll notice are that talk pages now open in a tab by default, not a window. This change has been a long time coming, and I assume it will be welcomed by most. E.g. beforehand you needed to disable popup blockers!
Let me know if you have any issues. Regards — MusikAnimal talk 16:57, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- This, and the section above, all sounds like good stuff to me. As a long-time Twinkle user, I thank you for all your hard work. Boing! said Zebedee (talk) 17:35, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- My pleasure, so to offer a promotional statement for those who haven't been using Twinkle to delete pages... Delete a page, it's talk page, and all of it's redirects, in as little as two clicks. If you have "When to go ahead and tag/delete the page" set to "As soon as I click an option" in your preferences, you can do all of this in one click. I don't really recommend that though, so as to avoid mistakes. Your choice! — MusikAnimal talk 17:52, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Good stuff MA- have I also noticed a change in what happens in an edit-conflict- being able to save the changes without reloading the page? Or do I not know what I'm talking about??? Cheers! Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi 17:57, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Hmm not sure, wouldn't have been part of this release — MusikAnimal talk 18:16, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Well. Thank you for confirming I don't know what I'm talking about MusikAnimal. Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi 19:32, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- I never really used Twinkle's CSD module as I thought t was a bit clunky. Just tried this out, seems much better, thanks! Beeblebrox (talk) 21:43, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Well. Thank you for confirming I don't know what I'm talking about MusikAnimal. Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi 19:32, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Hmm not sure, wouldn't have been part of this release — MusikAnimal talk 18:16, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Good stuff MA- have I also noticed a change in what happens in an edit-conflict- being able to save the changes without reloading the page? Or do I not know what I'm talking about??? Cheers! Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi 17:57, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- My pleasure, so to offer a promotional statement for those who haven't been using Twinkle to delete pages... Delete a page, it's talk page, and all of it's redirects, in as little as two clicks. If you have "When to go ahead and tag/delete the page" set to "As soon as I click an option" in your preferences, you can do all of this in one click. I don't really recommend that though, so as to avoid mistakes. Your choice! — MusikAnimal talk 17:52, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
Proposal to community ban the "Best known for IP"
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
I think I personally have blocked the user described in Wikipedia:Long-term abuse/Best known for IP about 15 times now, including several lengthy rangeblocks for chronic block evasion, edit warring and incivility, and I'm not the only admin to do this, and I'm now a bit fed up of blocking the same person for the same policy violations over and over again. Unlike most long-term abusers, he's never actually been community banned, merely repeatedly blocked ad infinitum after evasion. While this might seem like an exercise in pointless red tape, it does give us a firm consensus to say "you are banned, goodbye" without any possibility of wasting anyone's time arguing about it. Our banning policy does permit it, though it's rare. Your thoughts, please.
- Support as proposer Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 11:47, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support their long term abuse page seems eminently justified. Any editor who is a long term abuser should also be site banned, in my opinion. Also, being an IP editor should not be a "get out clause" for chronic sockpuppetry. --Jules (Mrjulesd) 13:19, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support This editor has taken up far too much admin time. Any suggestions for long-term solutions? Liz Read! Talk! 13:38, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- As is well known, I make only high quality edits, which are often reverted for no reason at all by a clique of editors who simply hate people without usernames. Ritchie333 has led a long term campaign of attacks against me, creating a policy violating page to coordinate them. He has a) blocked large ranges of anonymous IPs for months or years at a time in contravention of blocking policy, b) declared himself "involved" and unable to block me only to then block me, as he says, many times, c) abused the revision delete policy to delete my edits, with the claim that the word "idiot" is "grossly offensive"; d) encouraged others to revert my edits for no reason - see "Beyond My Ken"'s 200+ reverts last night; e) encouraged others to break the 3RR and to violate core policy; f) used his adminstrative tools to prevent spelling and grammar corrections being made to severely deficient articles, including acting to keep the word "should't" in an article for more than a year; g) encouraged a racist editor to remove sourced statements describing the reaction to a referendum, on the grounds that he finds them personally offensive.
- I am not and have never been banned. I am not and have never been a "long term abuser", as falsely claimed here. An absurd block placed for spurious reasons by a subsequently desysopped admin is being used as justification for the most obscene attacks yet on my character and edits. It should be obvious who is causing the problems here. If you think that admin time is being wasted, then tell the policy abusing admins to stop wasting their time. If you'd only stop reverting and blocking for no reason at all, there would be no problem here. 85.13.238.124 (talk) 14:03, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- And by the way, stopping your attacks on me is the only plausible long term solution. I will never stop what I do here, because what I do here is write an encyclopaedia. 85.13.238.124 (talk) 14:06, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Saying "I bet you pissed yourself laughing at the latest series of 50 or so pointless reverts, didn't you?" and then violating WP:3RR to edit war over it [2], [3], [4] [5] is not "writing an encyclopedia". I don't think I've ever done this, but I'm now going to formally ask you to stay off my talk page and never comment there again. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 14:46, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment if you're so unfairly treated, can you explain all of your sock-puppetry? --Jules (Mrjulesd) 14:12, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- I have never used sockpuppets. Why are you lying about me? Who are you, anyway? To the best of my recollection we've had no previous interaction whatsoever. 85.13.238.124 (talk) 14:18, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- If have seen you keep the same IP for weeks, then switch within minutes of being blocked. You are not innocently changing IPs, you are deliberately doing it to circumvent policy. You sock puppetry is very real and intentional. You are not fooling anyone. HighInBC 17:09, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Looking at your LTA page makes it clear you have used IP hopping in a way that highly suggests it contravenes Wikipedia:Sock puppetry. If you disagree, to avoid doubt, you should edit from an account. If you were to do this I would support a fresh start. --Jules (Mrjulesd) 14:49, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- I have never used sockpuppets. Why are you lying about me? Who are you, anyway? To the best of my recollection we've had no previous interaction whatsoever. 85.13.238.124 (talk) 14:18, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- And by the way, stopping your attacks on me is the only plausible long term solution. I will never stop what I do here, because what I do here is write an encyclopaedia. 85.13.238.124 (talk) 14:06, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support - Of course. Extremely disruptive editor. Actualy, the IP he's using now needs to be blocked for the same reasonm his other IPs were blocked yesterday. BMK (talk) 14:22, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- You have made more than 10 reverts in the last 24 hours on more than 40 separate articles. You are engaging in extreme disruption. I only ever make high quality and highly necessary edits. You and your ilk don't like quality, do you? 85.13.233.118 (talk) 14:30, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- (edit conflict) Ritchie333 is entirely correct -- it is an exercise in pointless red tape Oppose NE Ent 14:23, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- I have no doubt that they appear "pointless" to you, but clearly other editors do not agree. We either have a blocking and banning policy, and we follow through with it, or we don't. Allowing long time abusers such as the "Best known for IP" to edit at will when they are under an active block, and are de facto banned as an LTA, is detrimental to the community, and an insult to those editors who actually try (obviously, not all of all always succeed) to edit according to the rules and policies of the space. If an LTA is given the freedom to evade their block/ban, why should anyone else feel obligated to follow any other policies? BMK (talk) 16:22, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support – Allowing this guy to continue is an admission that Wikipedia has no blocking policy. The fact that he improves articles by 0.1% on an occasional basis does not outweigh the interminable attitude, abuse and insults that he throws around and the incessant block evasion. He has even admitted on this page that he will "never stop". So can we effectively block someone or not? Contrary to his claims, his edits are moderately useful at best, very rarely "high quality" and he never writes anything anyway. He's 10% value, 90% tedious, disruptive childishness. He has sometimes been reverted for no reason, for sure, but if you revert him for a good reason, he will frequently tear into you with a tirade of disgusting abuse. Moreover, he has been allowed to do it for years and years. Unacceptable. Bretonbanquet (talk) 14:54, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban: I see nothing wrong with formalizing the ban. My understanding of the preference for leaving de facto bans as de facto is to avoid using noticeboard space in a formal ban discussion in a way that somewhat undermines the goals embodied in WP:DENY. Well, the die is cast: Ritchie333 made the thread. I'm not saying it was a mistake... it is certainly unusual to have someone on LTA who isn't banned, and maybe there's been trouble in dealing with this editor that isn't immediately obvious that would be aided by the mechanisms available for a formally banned user. In any event, as I said, I see nothing wrong with formalizing the ban. —/Mendaliv/2¢/Δ's/ 14:54, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban The guy's claim he only does quality edits isn't true. Its those occasions where his edits don't improve the encyclopedia that are the most problematic. He will return again and again, edit warring to impose his edits, whilst grossly abusing anyone who disagrees. He doesn't actually create content, never seen him create an article and the minor spelling corrections and grammar polishing he does do is not worth the problems he creates. WCMemail
15:27, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- As I mentioned in several places, if any editor in good standing wants to restore any of this editor's contributions that I reverted (which are easily found by scrolling through my contribution list) and take personal responsibility for them, I have absolutely no problem with that. Several editors have already done exactly that, and I have not touched those restorations. BMK (talk) 16:18, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban LTA, edit warring, disruption, block evasion... A net negative to the project. Keri (talk) 15:34, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban Quality edits? Are you kidding me? That's a serious insult to those who are actually writing the encyclopedia. He's a negative to the project and a ban discussion is long overdue. Katietalk 15:40, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban. All his edits at the moment are block evasion at this point, so even those that may be seen as constructive are problematic. Add the abuse makes the point perfectly clear for me. I'm not quite sure what difference a ban will make compared with the current situation (I don't think there are any tools not at our disposal that will become available if we get consensus), but it may be useful to make the position more unambiguously clear. Kahastok talk 16:41, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban Block evasion, abuse of editors, this guy needs to find another website. While the ban may not make much of a technical difference it will at least discredit his constant complaining that his blocks are unfair. HighInBC 17:06, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support - while editing from different IPs, all by itself, isn't evidence of bad faith, doing so right after the old IP was blocked, repeatedly, is. If you add any other disruption bad enough to justify many of these blocks, then a ban is appropriate. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 17:33, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support Persistent block evasion. It's well-known that this editor's IP has a tendency to change immediately after being blocked. That's block evasion, plain and simple. Having a dynamic IP is no defense. Blocks are levied against the editor, so switching to a new IP does not absolve them of the block. This is, of course, in addition to the personal attacks they spew when they don't get their way. Useful edits or not, this editor is persona non grata because of their behavior. clpo13(talk) 18:30, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban If reverted, he will edit-war his own version, even if the article has subsequently been checked against the sources and corrected. See [6] (not to mention the edit summary). Burninthruthesky (talk) 18:48, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban After reading the LTA report, it is less about the nature of the edits and more about the extreme incivility that this editor has shown others. They repeatedly edit war, spew personal attacks whenever challenged, and from looking at the evidence they purposefully change IPs to avoid blocks. The personal attacks are enough to warrant blocks and the repeated block evasion and sockpuppetry is enough to warrant a ban. I also don't appreciate being duped into thinking I am helping someone with a problem and it turns out that the person is a LTA case (ie. Jimbo's talk page last night). --Majora (talk) 18:57, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Strongly oppose ban. This is an overwhelmingly positive editor on whom a long-term abuse page was originally made to correlate reports on their edit-warring. However, much of the edit-warring arose out of their being reverted on spurious grounds (I recall the report on Wind waves as an early example, where at least part of the disputed edit was correct), and the existence of the long-term abuse page was taken to indicate they were a vandal. Kww implemented very long blocks on the same basis, set up a filter to identify their edits from edit summaries, and rolled back all their edits. Kww is no longer a sysop but this editor continues to be blocked as if they were a major threat to the encyclopedia; meanwhile, their edits are overwhelmingly good. Yes, this person gets angry and abusive, but I and Drmies worked with them and they greatly reduced the amount of abuse; for some time, it has required diligent searching to identify this editor, since they are not habitually abusive. Meanwhile they have themselves initiated several AN/I reports in an attempt to get out from under this cloud. This is a positive editor determined to help Wikipedia who is being treated like Willy on Wheels. No basis for a ban at all. Yngvadottir (talk) 20:43, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- This is not some poor soul caught up in a bad situation. This person is a nasty[7][8][9][10] IP hopping edit warrior[11]. That is plenty of basis. And a lot of their edits are only good in their opinion. They are certainly not overwhelming positive, in fact they are so negative that they can only exist here by constantly changing IPs. I wonder if you have looked at any of the masses of evidence provided? HighInBC 20:50, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- They're no shrinking violet, but just at random, this edit they reinstated was perfectly fine - it corrected a grammar error and removed a peacock word. I would love it if they would start creating articles. I have sometimes found their copyediting exasperatingly limited (they miss other glaring errors in the article). And I'm ill-equipped to evaluate scientific edits, although my impression is that they're usually right in their corrections to science articles, too (re: Wind waves, what I recall was that the article defined them in the lede as very large and then went on to say in the body that they also occurred in puddles; the IP was being reverted removing the statement from the lede that they were always very large; within my scientific competence, I believe the IP was right). I note your first set of diffs are all slanging Ritchie; well, Ritchie's a big boy and an admin now, and can presumably take a certain amount of that, and the basis of the IP's discontent is that he stated he would not block the IP - and now does just that. As if the IP were community banned. I do not see any basis for such a ban. This emperor has no clothes. Yngvadottir (talk) 21:03, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Some of their edits are good, so what? They edit war, and are nasty, and evade blocks immediately and often. I see you did not look at the masses of evidence provided, they are not just nasty to Ritchie, they are nasty to every person who disagrees with them. Half of the conflicts they get into are with people who don't know who they are. This person creates their own trouble. HighInBC 21:09, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- We want to minimize editors being nasty to each other, but the way to do that is not to endorse the blanket reversal of good edits on spurious grounds. This is a circular mess. The editor is not banned, and who wouldn't react badly to knee-jerk reverts of positive edits? Those who "don't know who they are" are mostly reverting just because the edit was by an unregistered user - there is rarely any other reason per se to revert their edits. And that's harmful to the encyclopedia. So is treating an overwhelmingly positive contributor like a vandal by banning them. The better solution is to give only commensurately short blocks for actual instances of bad behavior, so that they don't get constantly caught for "block evading" when they fix grammar errors, eliminate peacock words, and improve science articles. Yngvadottir (talk) 21:21, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Given that they "evade blocks immediately and often" -- converting a de facto ban into a we-all-voted-on-it ban doesn't actually make any difference to anything. NE Ent 21:26, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
- Strongly oppose. What Yngvadottir said. Most of their edits are high-quality, and they are not always unwilling to discuss--as long as they are not reverted on sight without any justification. Automated and unexplained reverts, which were routinely done, were justified along the lines of WP:BMB, to the detriment of the encyclopedia and the editing atmosphere. But I've said all of this before, as has Yngvadottir, and our claims that the editor was frequently provoked into edit warring and insults by way of passive-aggressively reverting with boilerplate summaries have always fallen on deaf ears. I've frequently edited as an IP, depending on location and circumstance, and I recognize the feeling the IP must have felt frequently--except that they never got the "Oh it's you! Sorry for reverting" apology. But this is all water under the bridge, I see. I'm sure someone will add this to the LTA page and everyone will feel much better about themselves for Having Done The Right Thing. Drmies (talk) 15:10, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- This looks like the same restless energy formerly used to dismember Eric Corbett, now seeking the next sacrifice. --Epipelagic (talk) 15:39, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Provoked into edit warring? Really? Do you remember this exchange from 2013 User_talk:200.104.245.226. He was claiming he was provoked but he hadn't been. People give too much credence to the poor little IP picked on by named accounts meme, it was a fig leaf he hid behind. WCMemail 17:04, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- This looks like the same restless energy formerly used to dismember Eric Corbett, now seeking the next sacrifice. --Epipelagic (talk) 15:39, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Oppose, per Drmies and Yngvadottir, and mostly Ent, although obviously too late, and my apologies for that. I do feel strongly enough about this to post after the close, though. Begoon talk 16:36, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Support ban since it looks like this is heading toward being reopened given the mess of post-close comments. Support per nom. I strongly object to the notion that any editor disruptive enough to earn themselves an LTA case can ever be considered a positive contributor, and I strongly object to the mess of holes being constantly punched in the blocking policy by administrators endorsing constructive actions by blocked users. I say again: if admins aren't going to strictly enforce blocks, then it will save all of us a whole bunch of time if we just stop pretending they exist at all. Ivanvector 🍁 (talk) 16:08, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
Since this discussion was open only for less than half a day, rather untypically for ban discussions, and several substanial oppose votes from well-respected editors were added later, I have asked the closer to consider reopening the thread to allow these concerns a proper hearing. Fut.Perf. ☼ 23:43, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- The opposers have prolonged this problem for quite some time, Fut.Perf.. They don't really have an argument beyond their personal distaste for the concept of reverting edits simply because they were block evasion. This particular editor is the subject of multiple blocks at this time: I think the longest currently running one expires sometime in 2018.—Kww(talk) 17:12, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- WCM, that kind of commentary, that sort of sneering, my kids aren't allowed to do that. You're an adult. And why you don't get that such remarks are a personal attack on me, I'll never know, but thanks for your good faith, pal. Fut.Perf., I appreciate what you did, but it's not going to make much of a difference, given the overwhelming support for the ban. (Note I'm trying to phrase this as neutrally as I can.) Drmies (talk) 19:22, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Well Drmies it wasn't intended as a personal attack, I forget sometimes that text is not always the best means to communicate and as it has upset you, I apologise for my poor use of words. Just for information, not an excuse, it was intended as light hearted remark on my part. However, I do have a serious point to make in reference to assuming good faith; no one set out to provoke the guy. In assuming that they did, you do a disservice to the editors who've been on the receiving end of his abuse for no good reason, other than a good faith attempt to improve wikipedia. WCMemail 22:53, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- I would support this being re-opened for another 14-15 hours if only to put this to bed. Ban discussion are supposed to run for 24 hours, and the last thing we want is another thing for this IP to wikilawyer about. I have no concern that the outcome will be any different, the evidence is clear to anyone who will accept it. HighInBC 03:45, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
Legacypac's persistent bullying
Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Mystery Wolff
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
NOTE: Because of items brought up newly within the Meta Discussion, and discussion on with which group reviews the item, this is moved to the A/R/E board, intact. Mystery Wolff (talk) 20:42, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- See Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement#Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Mystery Wolff. Ivanvector 🍁 (talk) 22:40, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
"This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above."
The following remedies have been enacted
4) For consistently poor judgment in undertaking administrative actions following a formal admonishment, Kevin Gorman is desysopped. He may regain the administrative tools at any time via a successful request for adminship. Passed 13 to 3 at 17:53, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
For the Arbitration Committee Amortias (T)(C) 18:08, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Discuss this at: Wikipedia talk:Arbitration Committee/Noticeboard#Wikipedia:Arbitration_Requests_Case_Kevin_Gorman_closed
Deceased admin/Dreadstar
Here Dreadstar.(Littleolive oil (talk) 18:24, 18 January 2016 (UTC))
- Sad news. –xenotalk 18:31, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- I don't know if this is outing but can I ask how this information was obtained? I corresponded with Dreadstar as recently as last fall so this is a surprise to me. Regardless of the fact that he was a former admin, he was a longtime Wikipedia contributor. Liz Read! Talk! 18:39, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- FWIW: In my past conversations with Dreadstar - I believe that he preferred that his privacy be respected. — Ched : ? 19:14, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Littleolive oil and Ched in particular, I was wondering whether his family or friends (at some later point) could be asked for a good photograph of him for Wikipedia:Deceased Wikipedians, but I can't work out whether he would have wanted that. I think maybe yes, but I'm not sure. SarahSV (talk) 01:41, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
ANRFC again
Here's a story, for those who haven't met their recommended daily allowance of drama yet: Over the last few months, we've had a series of RFCs at WT:MEDRS, some of which would have benefited from closing statements by experienced admins. Most of these RFCs have dealt, directly or indirectly, with whether sources from a particular country, whose academic journals are under political pressure to publish only The Right Answer™, are desirable sources. (The overall "vote", if you care about numbers, is about 3 to 1 against this idea.)
We've simultaneously, and not really as a result of this, had another one of our periodic fights about the exact scope of MEDRS, with the usual (i.e., very low) level of immediate success, but with some useful and interesting comments that might eventually help us improve that guideline. This fight mostly covered the question of whether and when information about violent crimes needs medical sources, e.g., rather than legal or social ones. Having both of these fights at the same time, and mostly involving the same people, has been more than a little inconvenient.
(I'm omitting names, because identities actually don't matter much, and I don't want to bother with a long string of notifications or to have anyone think that the problem is just one person's personality.)
Order of RFCs:
- The first round was originally closed by a NAC who was TBAN'd (from something unrelated to the RFC) last year. Multiple editors involved in this RFC were also involved in the TBAN discussion. As it happened – I explicitly do not allege any sort of dishonesty here, but rather an unfortunate circumstance that the NAC may not even have noticed – the closing statement was in favor of the minority who favor citing politically manipulated journals and against the editors who voted for the TBAN. "Losing" editors have made this NAC suffer for volunteering to close this enormous discussion.
- Then we had a long fight about whether there exist things that are related to health, but that aren't exactly intended to be covered by MEDRS (e.g., violent crime). Initially, there were two of these RFCs; thankfully, the OP for the first stated that he formally withdrew it in favor of the other, and it therefore did not end up in the laundry list at ANRFC. (If it had, then we might have ended up with contradictory closing statements.) The second one was closed, about two months after it began, by an admin who deserves praise, because this was not a small task and because it was impossible to avoid disappointing some good editors. The thoroughly explained closing statement is getting a few complaints, but IMO they are largely respectful complaints, and I expect the overall dispute to settle down as people find ways to adjust and meet their needs.
- The second round on politically pressured sources demanded that ediotrs pick a way to implement the first RFC even though they objected to everything about the close, from the outcome to the identity of the NAC. This newer one was closed the other day by an apparently innocent editor, who created an account two months ago and has made exactly 384 edits so far, including closing several RFCs and a lot of edits about a movie. The new editor has tried to provide helpful advice, like narrowing down the five options to the two least-contested.
- Now we have another RFC that's trying to force people to pick between the two least-contested wordings about political sources, even though the clear signal from the editors is that they do not want any of those options at all. Realistically, I expect this to either keep going for a month, or for someone to propose a TBAN against the OP.
Why I'm bothering telling you about this:
The fact that two NACs have tried to close some of these incredibly contentious RFCs on hot-button issues means that we have a structural problem with ANRFC. We have a lot of "process" and a lot of "activity", but the RFCs that need admin attention aren't getting that attention.
I don't believe that this is due to having too few admins, because we had too few admins a few years ago, and we didn't really have this problem a few years ago. What's changed since then is:
- One editor has been filling ANRFC with about 90% of the RFCs that have expired. The number of listed RFCs has gone up 3x to 4x compared to 2012, although the number of complicated or highly contentious RFCs does not appear to have changed. (I've checked the RFCs listings for formatting problems off and on for years, so I've got a decent idea of what goes through the pipe.) Listing almost everything might make the signal-to-noise ratio unfavorable for admins. When you see that there are dozens listed, with no sense of priority and with many that can have nothing more than a rubber-stamp on a nearly-unanimous vote, it would not be unreasonable to start ignoring the whole list. It's also on a separate subpage, which means that changes probably aren't appearing in your watchlist.
- We have formally agreed that NACs can and should be encouraged to close all sorts of discussions, and we have relied upon their experience and wisdom to stop them from stepping into a mess like this. I actually saw the ANRFC listing for one of these a while ago, contemplated adding a note warning off NACs, and I decided that such a comment was unnecessary, because it was so obviously contentious that nobody except an admin would touch it. I was wrong. At this point, it might be reasonable for WP:NAC and related advice to stop assuming that all editors have the necessary experience and wisdom figure out which discussions come with a free bull's eye target for their backs.
I'm not really proposing a specific solution here. Instead, I want to point out that there is a problem, and that I have identified two separate factors that I believe are contributing to it. There may be others; I would really appreciate hearing ideas about other probable factors. I think that if we can identify the probable causes for this, then we might be able to find a way to make this system more functional. WhatamIdoing (talk) 07:48, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- WP:NAC is less relevant than WP:Requests_for_comment#Ending_RfCs and WP:Closing_discussions#Closure_procedure. You were wrong in thinking a non-admin would not close the discussion because becoming an admin bestows no magical consensus deciding powers. In fact the majority of admins have little/no more experience in that area than many long-time editors. Not to mention the 'this is a contentious RFC' line is trotted out whenever someone disagrees with the result. Just because people have different opinions does not make something contentious. Although I will agree that most of the MEDRS stuff does follow that path by MEDRS own design. The problem at this point is not with non-admin closures, or closures in general, its that MEDRS is full of people who want MEDRS to apply everywhere. Even when it really shouldnt. Some of the recent articles I watch where people insist on a MEDRS compliant source - crime articles for example - are not remotely medical, yet people are seriously arguing crime is always a health issue so MEDRS should apply. Now couple that with the fact that at MEDRS, people generally fall into two camps, a)editors demanding the highest possible quality source (the inference being: Western published) and b)editors who want the criteria lowered so they can use all sorts of crap as a source anywhere MEDRS applies. This wouldnt normally be a problem (people arguing in their walled gardens) except for the aforementioned over-reach of MEDRS scope. It has the potential to impact large sections of wikipedia. At this very minute people are arguing over wording that (as it reads) says "Do not reject a high-quality type of study due to personal objections to the study's inclusion criteria, references, funding sources, country of origin, or conclusions." Anyone who spends any time at RSN knows that (apart from possible country of origin) those are considered all the time. The problem isnt with ANRFC, discussion closing etc, the problem is MEDRS and the crap thats argued over there. Only in death does duty end (talk) 10:03, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I don't know anything about this specifc situation but I do agree with WhatamIdoing regarding over-reporting at ANRFC. It's become a bloated mess that is often longer than the whole rest of this noticeboard, and as a result suffers from disinterest. I think a re-organization of ANRFC is in order, something that would make it clear what is a priority that really needs a close and what is just a low-level content dispute that petered out days or weeks ago. Beeblebrox (talk) 04:17, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- When I tried to deal with the over-reporting some time ago, merely removing stuff that didn't need to be listed, I got reverted: [13] and [14] were followed by reversions by Dicklyon (who hasn't touched ANRFC since his unblock) and by the 90%-filling editor. We need to enforce WP:ADMINSHOP — when an admin has responded to your request, don't re-post the request as if it had been removed by accident or by a vandal. If you don't like being told that it doesn't need a formal close, ask another admin privately; I'm not trying to shut down the asking entirely. Nyttend (talk) 04:39, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
Arbitration motion regarding Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically modified organisms
The Arbitration Committee has resolved by motion that:
- The Discretionary Sanctions remedy which currently says that " Standard discretionary sanctions are authorised for all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, agricultural biotechnology, and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed" are replaced with "Standard discretionary sanctions are authorised for all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, commercially produced agricultural chemicals and the companies that produce them, broadly construed."
For the Arbitration Committee, Miniapolis 14:44, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Archived discussion
Admins needed at UTRS
It seems that I am practically the only admin reviewing unblock requests that come in through UTRS lately, and as a result it is getting backlogged. Some of them are appeals of blocks I did, so I can't review them. UTRS is generally actually simpler than on-wiki unblock reviews as it is mostly semi-automated. If you don't have a UTRS account it is easy to get one, see WP:UTRS for details. More checkusers would be handy as well, I'm still pretty new to CU and some of these appeals need a more experienced CU to handle them. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:19, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Thanks a lot for your dedication and time Beeblebrox. I don't have a lot of time to respond to appeals these days but I remain the active tooladmin and will approve accounts for any admins who can volunteer some time. Most appeals are either easy declines (trolling or companies) or referrable to on-wiki. ☺ · Salvidrim! · ✉ 21:34, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- There's a couple there right now that I'm not sure what to do with. They are from IPs that are blocked as proxies. The persons filing the appeals claim to be in mainland China, which is one of the valid reasons for granting IPBE, but they don't have an account, they just want the proxy unblocked. I know that's a bad idea, but what I'm not sure about is if they can create an account at all while stuck behind the great firewall, so I really don't know how to respond. Any ideas? Beeblebrox (talk) 22:11, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I did a few of them and I'm waiting for blocking admin input on a couple others. I'll do more once my latest headache fades away. Katietalk 22:41, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I'm back from my unexpected break and will be able to help out more. I'm knocking a bunch of the outstanding requests back now.--Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 23:52, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- PS @Beeblebrox: I created a new template for IPBE requests where the range is hardblocked if you would like to use it in the future. (title: "IPBE request on hard rangeblock").--Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 00:28, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- Sounds good. Beeblebrox (talk) 00:40, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- PS @Beeblebrox: I created a new template for IPBE requests where the range is hardblocked if you would like to use it in the future. (title: "IPBE request on hard rangeblock").--Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 00:28, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- I'm back from my unexpected break and will be able to help out more. I'm knocking a bunch of the outstanding requests back now.--Jezebel's Ponyobons mots 23:52, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I did a few of them and I'm waiting for blocking admin input on a couple others. I'll do more once my latest headache fades away. Katietalk 22:41, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- There's a couple there right now that I'm not sure what to do with. They are from IPs that are blocked as proxies. The persons filing the appeals claim to be in mainland China, which is one of the valid reasons for granting IPBE, but they don't have an account, they just want the proxy unblocked. I know that's a bad idea, but what I'm not sure about is if they can create an account at all while stuck behind the great firewall, so I really don't know how to respond. Any ideas? Beeblebrox (talk) 22:11, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Hello Beeblebrox. I have emailed the UTRS admins list to offer my assistance. Regards, Yamaguchi先生 (talk) 00:57, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- Awesome. The more the merrier. Beeblebrox (talk) 03:04, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
- Yamaguchi先生 I regret to inform you that we have not received an e-mail from you. In any case, to volunteer you can simply register an account here. We're currently developping a new OAuth system to auto-authenticate admins, bypassing the need for individual registration, for that's just a project. :) ☺ · Salvidrim! · ✉ 03:47, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
Advice on AE procedures
Another editor has just made some pretty serious accusations about me (in a thread that was originally about something else). I am pretty taken aback and I would like advice on the relevant AE procedures. Am I allowed to ask for time to compose a response? Am I allowed to call witnesses? Darkfrog24 (talk) 13:13, 20 January 2016 (UTC)