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BIOVIA Draw (the current version of ISIS/Draw)
There is a discussion about the settings to be used with BIOVIA Draw taking place at WT:WikiProject Chemistry/Structure drawing workgroup#Default BIOVIA Draw ACS template which may be of interest to those who use this software for their chemical drawings. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:06, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Please ignore! The "issue" was of my own making and does not require further discussion. Mike Turnbull (talk) 18:26, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
Fluoroaspirin
I've opened a discussion about talk:fluoroaspirin, trying to find out whether that is the common name of the chemical and whether the article ought to be moved. --Trovatore (talk) 18:53, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
Organic/pharma editors needed
Fellow editors are encouraged to review the recent burst of contributions by unregistered editor User:88.105.135.216. The edits are highly specific (I think too specific), but do not suggest self-promotion. Artwork does not render well. --Smokefoot (talk) 14:53, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
What is Violett's solution?
While deep in a rabbit-hole from WP:RD/S, I came across a statement in proceedings from a 1906 meeting:
- "tests made for the comparison of Violett's and Fehling's solution"[1]
Fehling's solution is (now:) well-established. From context, Violett's must be some other analytical reagent to test for reducing sugars. But I cannot find any other reference to it. Help please? DMacks (talk) 05:16, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
- Should read Violette's solution. https://www.google.com.au/books/edition/Handbook_for_Cane_sugar_Manufacturers_an/_6w5AQAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=violetts+solution&pg=PA62&printsec=frontcover It is copper sulfate, rochelle salt and caustic soda in water. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 08:53, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
Re: TOXNET has moved
Reviving this old thread. I just came across a broken ref link using {{HPD}}, so obviously nothing has been done about this yet and it still needs doing. Since it's only used on 30-some-odd pages, replacing them all with a hardcoded link to the appropriate CPID page wouldn't be too hard, but... if anyone can think of a way to modify just the template to fix all the links, that would be preferable -- if it's even possible, and it may not be. I haven't found the old chemical ID numbers anywhere on the new site yet. Thoughts?
-Garrett W. {☎ ✍} 20:13, 29 December 2022 (UTC)
Splitting discussion for Zinc oxide
An article that been involved with (Zinc oxide ) has content that is proposed to be removed and moved to another article (Zinc white). If you are interested, please visit the discussion. Thank you. AngusW🐶🐶F (bark • sniff) 17:32, 30 December 2022 (UTC)
Toad toxins move
If this move (reasoned with https://wjpr.s3.ap-south-1.amazonaws.com/article_issue/1469860166.pdf) was correct, what about Category:Bufanolides and Bufanolide? --Leyo 08:42, 4 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Leyo The quoted article says
Bufadienolides or compounds with similar structures are not only found in toads but also in many plant species, fireflies (Photinus sp.), Snakes (Rhabdophis sp.) and mammals (Steyn[57] and Heerden 1998)
. Thus it is arguably a mistake to place these compounds only within a "toad toxin" category. Our article section at Bufadienolide#Classification gives the full MeSH classification. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:12, 4 January 2023 (UTC)- Thank you for the feedback. @Yyfroy and Túrelio: Pinging the two involved users on Commons. --Leyo 15:05, 4 January 2023 (UTC)
- Bufadienolides and bufanolides are two distinct categories, but MeSH puts them in the same category! That's not logical!And I'm wondering why "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Bufanolides" still exists! It is outrageous that "bufadienolide belongs to Category:Bufanolides"!
- Choosing "Toad toxins" as the catergory's name may not be perfect, but it's like humans can have swine flu.Yyfroy (talk) 04:09, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
- If there are actual structure classes of chemicals, each should have its own category with a specific name. If one class is a subclass of another, then that's easily accomodated too. But if some of the chemicals happen to come from a certain source or have a certain lay-language description, that can be a distinct type of categorization. DMacks (talk) 04:22, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
Various chemicals articles that attract much attention
Some chemicals that attract so much attention:
- Dimanganese heptoxide is one, a volatile derivative of permanganate. About 120 views/day. Totally useless.
- Hexafluoroantimonic acid, a superacid. About 500 views/day. There is so much interest in its strength, sort of a testosterone thing: "my acid is stronger than yours".
- Thioacetone, which is misrepresented because it unlikely to exist as shown. Its really smelly but so what? 1200 views/day.
- Xenon hexafluoroplatinate. Its not even a compound. 43 views/day.
--Smokefoot (talk) 20:14, 12 January 2023 (UTC)
Oh, I like this game!
- Arsole, putrid smell, puerile humour. 27 views a day. (sorry...)
Anyway... I was curious so I did some digging. Fluoroantimonic acid has 279 results on google scholar but 22,700 results in youtube. Manganese heptoxide is also very popular (instant fire!). I'm not sure what's driving the other two, maybe TikTok? --Project Osprey (talk) 23:19, 12 January 2023 (UTC)
- I'm not sure if it's a good thing or a bad thing we don't have arsepane. DMacks (talk) 15:47, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
- I'm not finding much in the literature about arsepane. It's kind of irritating, but I guess it will have to stay red for a while. DMacks (talk) 15:49, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
- Probably for the best, it's a ugly looking ring. --Project Osprey (talk) 16:16, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
- I'm not finding much in the literature about arsepane. It's kind of irritating, but I guess it will have to stay red for a while. DMacks (talk) 15:49, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
- The xenon-containing species in xenon hexafluoroplatinate was the first noble gas compound to be discovered. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 15:48, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
Chembox: adding AITS spectral database external link (SDBS)
- See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chemistry § Linking Chembox to spectroscopic data on the AITS database (AITS: SDBS database external link).
DePiep (talk) 11:46, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
Articles with long titles
When the title of an article is too long and it doesn't contain any hyphens enabling a line break, there might be a layout issue: The chembox is then moved to the left (see e.g. Methoxymethylenetriphenylphosphorane). These articles might be affected: hastemplate:chembox intitle:/[A-Z\(\)]{33}/i (redirects filtered out) --Leyo 08:09, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- I cannot reproduce this on my browser, Google Chrome in macOS Monterey. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 08:23, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- At the even longer title Phosphoribosylaminoimidazolesuccinocarboxamide (46 letters), it just made the chembox wider than, say, Pyran (5 letters). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 08:28, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- I use Firefox. In Edge, it is the same as you describe for Google Chrome. Anyway, both widening the chembox and moving it leftwards is undesirable. --Leyo 10:52, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- (ec) How should the chembox handle this? Hard to automate, better require an editor to add {{SHY}}. We could start with categorising when title length > n. DePiep (talk) 11:24, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Applied {{SHY}} to
|Name=
. See Methoxymethylenetriphenylphosphorane [2] (at the right place?) DePiep (talk) 11:26, 20 January 2023 (UTC)- @Leyo @LaundryPizza03 @DePiep The problem is easily solved by using the |Name parameter to give the image a shorter name and override the default. I've just done that for Phosphoribosylaminoimidazolesuccinocarboxamide, so you can see the result. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:26, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- See also 5′-Phosphoribosyl-4-carboxy-5-aminoimidazole: these automated breaks are OK right away? -DePiep (talk) 11:30, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- And DePiep's alternative using {{SHY}} is also fine if you instead want to add a hyphen. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:30, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- @DePiep and Michael D. Turnbull: Thanks. Have you gone through the whole list? Or have you got a search link with less false positives? --Leyo 22:51, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- re Leyo. I changed the regex (add
\d
etc), found ca. 850 article titles of which 600 are redirects. Resulting List is at User:DePiep/sandbox2. Also in therekept some ~50 really long Redirect names (because: in target article, is the infobox title shortened for this wrong reason?). Redlinks must be typo's from my cleanup. (Source cannot output raw datalist). - It's yours to use (c/p), I don't have time to check them. DePiep (talk) 07:24, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you. There seem to be quite some with hyphens (i.e. an optional line break). --Leyo 10:41, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Leyo, @DePiep I've extracted DePiep's list into an Excel spreadsheet and easily found the names where there is already a hyphen or a blank that allows the names to line-break automatically and hence no need for the {{shy}} trick. I'll go through all 86 articles that I have found which do need a soft hyphen and put one in. I should easily complete this today. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:38, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yes, formal in-name true character U+002D - HYPHEN-MINUS will do some linebreaking already. But it is my impression that these (chemistry name induced) hyphens might be positioned bad for linebreaking. Again, {{SHY}} is our friend. DePiep (talk) 11:39, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- OK all done, I think. Any left over can be done as people spot them. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:32, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you. I found 18 additional articles that I changed accordingly. --Leyo 16:43, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- OK all done, I think. Any left over can be done as people spot them. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:32, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you. There seem to be quite some with hyphens (i.e. an optional line break). --Leyo 10:41, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- re Leyo. I changed the regex (add
- @DePiep and Michael D. Turnbull: Thanks. Have you gone through the whole list? Or have you got a search link with less false positives? --Leyo 22:51, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- And DePiep's alternative using {{SHY}} is also fine if you instead want to add a hyphen. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:30, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- See also 5′-Phosphoribosyl-4-carboxy-5-aminoimidazole: these automated breaks are OK right away? -DePiep (talk) 11:30, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Leyo @LaundryPizza03 @DePiep The problem is easily solved by using the |Name parameter to give the image a shorter name and override the default. I've just done that for Phosphoribosylaminoimidazolesuccinocarboxamide, so you can see the result. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:26, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Applied {{SHY}} to
- (ec) How should the chembox handle this? Hard to automate, better require an editor to add {{SHY}}. We could start with categorising when title length > n. DePiep (talk) 11:24, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- I use Firefox. In Edge, it is the same as you describe for Google Chrome. Anyway, both widening the chembox and moving it leftwards is undesirable. --Leyo 10:52, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Long ago when chembox validation was getting started, we centralized on not inserting anything that would make the display appear different than the actual name, in order to improve discoverability from external search-engines. DMacks (talk) 10:49, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- 1. By adding {{SHY}} in
|Name=
, the article title is not changed. - 2. The external search argument is handled by {{DISPLAYTITLE}}. {{Chembox}} is not to make exceptions in this. DePiep (talk) 11:31, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- 1. By adding {{SHY}} in
Should certain organic compounds have a "Variants" section?
Inorganic compounds like sodium chloride often have a short "Related compounds" section in their infobox, because there are only so many related binary salts you can make. Lithium chloride, potassium chloride, sodium fluoride, sodium bromide, etc. This isn't practical for organic compounds though, because there's hundreds to thousands of different variations of an organic compound, just from different functional groups you can add on, isomers. Should "base" organic compounds have a variants section, containing variants which have articles, which can be moved into a separate article if it gets long enough? For examples I just made, see Phenylacetic acid, Dibenzyl ketone, and Tetraphenylcyclopentadienone. This would help make articles easier to find by weaving the web of links. Then hypothetically long lists could be moved to e.g. "List of phenylacetic acid variants". Michael7604 (talk) 21:03, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Michael7604 I don't like that idea: as well as the reason you mention, "variants" are in the eye of the beholder. To take a specific example, acetone does have a "related compounds" section which currently has Butanone, Isopropyl alcohol, Formaldehyde, Urea and Carbonic acid. To my eye, the relationship between acetone and urea is tenuous at best and downright misleading at worst. Professional organic chemists use the word analog in a way that is still not very precise but usually refers to some sort of Markush structure, especially in relation to patents. Mike Turnbull (talk) 22:32, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- One idea, maybe the criteria being counted as a "related compound" could be if the name contains the main compound. E.g., 4-bromophenyl acetic acid contains "phenylacetic acid". One of the names of butanone, "methylacetone", contains "Acetone". But isopropyl alcohol has nothing to do with "acetone". This would also apply if the name gets split up, e.g. Bis(4-bromobenzyl) ketone is a variant of Dibenzyl ketone. With this criteria just adding a functional group to a molecule always makes it a related compound. One way or another there should be a way for curious readers to learn about similar compounds, since mobile readers can't see categories. Michael7604 (talk) 22:40, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- That would be a good argument for getting the mediawiki folk to add such a facility. Note that we do have a system of templates that is much superior, in my opinion. Hence for a herbicide like 2,4-D, the only "related compound" in the chembox is 2,4,5-T but at the bottom of the article there's a template {{herbicides}} that does a very good job of linking to relevant additional articles. Mike Turnbull (talk) 22:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Michael D. Turnbull Footer templates aren't visible for mobile either, that is why it is important to weave the web with links in article bodies. Michael7604 (talk) 23:05, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- First, proposals like this are healthy, so thank you Michael7604. Second, however, I'm 95% with Michael D. Turnbull on being opposed. One reason is that selection of variants is just too subjective. And the idea invites contributions from editors who know isolated factoids but lack an appreciation of the landscape of organic chemistry. Then the handful of knowledgeable editors would be forced into doing a lot more pruning vs content creation, our prime mission. On the other hand, there is nothing to stop an editor from adding an ad hoc "related compound" as someone did today on 2-octanone by noting its relevance to filbertone. Filbertone is not really a variant, but the link nicely complements our article, IMHO.--Smokefoot (talk) 23:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Michael D. Turnbull Footer templates aren't visible for mobile either, that is why it is important to weave the web with links in article bodies. Michael7604 (talk) 23:05, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- That would be a good argument for getting the mediawiki folk to add such a facility. Note that we do have a system of templates that is much superior, in my opinion. Hence for a herbicide like 2,4-D, the only "related compound" in the chembox is 2,4,5-T but at the bottom of the article there's a template {{herbicides}} that does a very good job of linking to relevant additional articles. Mike Turnbull (talk) 22:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- One idea, maybe the criteria being counted as a "related compound" could be if the name contains the main compound. E.g., 4-bromophenyl acetic acid contains "phenylacetic acid". One of the names of butanone, "methylacetone", contains "Acetone". But isopropyl alcohol has nothing to do with "acetone". This would also apply if the name gets split up, e.g. Bis(4-bromobenzyl) ketone is a variant of Dibenzyl ketone. With this criteria just adding a functional group to a molecule always makes it a related compound. One way or another there should be a way for curious readers to learn about similar compounds, since mobile readers can't see categories. Michael7604 (talk) 22:40, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
This "variant" problem is worse in simple aromatic rings. Some articles like oxazole basically hard to separate the parent compound and everything that have this ring. --Nucleus hydro elemon (talk) 09:37, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Unreviewed Featured articles year-end summary
Unreviewed featured articles/2020/4Q2022
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Restoring older Featured articles to standard:year-end 2022 summary
Unreviewed featured articles/2020 (URFA/2020) is a systematic approach to reviewing older Featured articles (FAs) to ensure they still meet the FA standards. A January 2022 Signpost article called "Forgotten Featured" explored the effort. Progress is recorded at the monthly stats page. Through 2022, with 4,526 very old (from the 2004–2009 period) and old (2010–2015) FAs initially needing review:
Of the FAs kept, deemed satisfactory by three reviewers, or delisted, about 60% had prior review between 2004 and 2007; another 20% dated to the period from 2008–2009; and another 20% to 2010–2015. Roughly two-thirds of the old FAs reviewed have retained FA status or been marked "satisfactory", while two-thirds of the very old FAs have been defeatured. Entering its third year, URFA is working to help maintain FA standards; FAs are being restored not only via FAR, but also via improvements initiated after articles are reviewed and talk pages are noticed. Since the Featured Article Save Award (FASA) was added to the FAR process a year ago, 38 FAs were restored to FA status by editors other than the original FAC nominator. Ten FAs restored to status have been listed at WP:MILLION, recognizing articles with annual readership over a million pageviews, and many have been rerun as Today's featured article, helping increase mainpage diversity.
But there remain almost 4,000 old and very old FAs to be reviewed. Some topic areas and WikiProjects have been more proactive than others in restoring or maintaining their old FAs. As seen in the chart below, the following have very high ratios of FAs kept to those delisted (ordered from highest ratio):
and others have a good ratio of kept to delisted FAs:
... so kudos to those editors who pitched in to help maintain older FAs !
But looking only at the oldest FAs (from the 2004–2007 period), there are 12 content areas with more than 20 FAs still needing review: Biology, Music, Royalty and nobility, Media, Sport and recreation, History, Warfare, Meteorology, Physics and astronomy, Literature and theatre, Video gaming, and Geography and places. In the coming weeks, URFA/2020 editors will be posting lists to individual WikiProjects with the goal of getting these oldest-of-the-old FAs reviewed during 2023. Ideas for how you can help are listed below and at the Signpost article.
More regular URFA and FAR reviewers will help assure that FAs continue to represent examples of Wikipedia's best work. If you have any questions or feedback, please visit Wikipedia talk:Unreviewed featured articles/2020/4Q2022. |
FAs last reviewed from 2004 to 2007 of interest to this WikiProject
If you review an article on this list, please add commentary at the article talk page, with a section heading == [[URFA/2020]] review== and also add either Notes or Noticed to WP:URFA/2020A, per the instructions at WP:URFA/2020. Comments added here may be swept up in archives and lost, and more editors will see comments on article talk. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 21:11, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Enzyme kinetics
- Francium
- Joseph Priestley
- Nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide
- Oxidative phosphorylation
- Uranium
- Xenon
Psilocybin Featured article review
User:DigitalIceAge has nominated Psilocybin for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 11:25, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
Good article reassessment for Iron(III) chloride
Iron(III) chloride has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Nucleus hydro elemon (talk) 08:16, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
Discussion at WP:MCQ § Proactive request for input
You are invited to join the discussion at WP:MCQ § Proactive request for input. -- Marchjuly (talk) 19:42, 23 February 2023 (UTC)