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:::WP:OTHERSTUFF not withstanding, they aren't officially TV credits, at least not in the sense that the other listings are. [[User:SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b>]] ([[User talk:SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">talk</b>]] / [[Special:Contributions/SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">edits</b>]]) 15:03, 24 December 2015 (UTC) |
:::WP:OTHERSTUFF not withstanding, they aren't officially TV credits, at least not in the sense that the other listings are. [[User:SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b>]] ([[User talk:SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">talk</b>]] / [[Special:Contributions/SNUGGUMS|<b style="color:#454545">edits</b>]]) 15:03, 24 December 2015 (UTC) |
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Unfortunately, this nomination has now been open for 2 months without garnering a lot of (valid) support, so in order to keep the nominations queue moving I'm going to have to close it. No prejudice against re-nominating at a later date. --'''[[User:PresN|<span style="color:green">Pres</span>]][[User talk:PresN|<span style="color:blue">N</span>]]''' 03:24, 2 January 2016 (UTC) |
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Revision as of 03:24, 2 January 2016
Elvis Presley filmography
Elvis Presley filmography (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
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Talk about a guy who needs no introduction, Elvis Presley inspired a generation of musicians. His film career began with great promise, but soon became little more than a profit gimmick for both his manager and the studios. The bulk of this list was created by an IP many years ago, but was in need of being brought up to Wikipedia standards, which I believe I have done. Within the lead, I've endeavored to explain how the promise turned to disappointment for Presley. — Maile (talk) 14:40, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
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Comments from FrB.TG
Any chance you could look at my one? -- Frankie talk 22:35, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
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- Support – now that everything has been taken care of, I can gladly endorse it. Good job! -- Frankie talk 13:18, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
- Comments from SNUGGUMS
Oppose for now
- "other cast members" and the TV listings (except for the specials) aren't necessary.
- As for photos, just the Jailhouse Rock publicity shoot will suffice.
- No need for his military service; that belongs in his main article.
- There is nothing on the levels of critical or financial success his films had
- What I've check above was taken care of. Per what Frankie linked above, there is a consensus that budget and box office do not belong in a filmography. I've looked through Julia Roberts filmography, Ronald Reagan filmography, Charlie Chaplin filmography, James Cameron filmography, Amy Adams filmography - there doesn't seem to be budget and box office (financial success) in them. I don't see "critical success" in these either, unless you are talking about winning an Oscar. Elvis didn't win awards for his acting. I think what you're asking for here really belongs on the articles for the individual films. — Maile (talk) 22:54, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
- Awards not withstanding, what I mean is include whether critics liked or didn't like his films. See Madonna filmography for a good example. I should note that the link FrB.TG gave pertains to tables, though, does not say anything against including box office figures in lead's prose. Snuggums (talk / edits) 23:57, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks for the explanation. I understand what you mean, but I don't see that in the Featured Lists I've linked above, or in any number of others. I still believe that kind of information belongs in the individual articles for the films, and is otherwise covered in the Focus on movies section of his biography article. — Maile (talk) 00:16, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Fair enough. Just remove all the TV listings prior to The Frank Sinatra Timex Show: Welcome Home Elvis since talk shows and radio shows aren't supposed to be listed in filmography articles (unless hosting them), and this will be good to go. Snuggums (talk / edits) 01:03, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Let me make sure I am clear on your concerns. You are asking that talk shows and radio shows be removed. Well, there are no radio shows, so that takes care of that. Hy Gardner was a televised interview where Elvis and Gardner were the only people involved, not exactly a talk show, but I think it fits into what you are getting at. The Teenage Dance Party was a local version of American Bandstand. The only clip I've ever seen about that, is where Elvis and Wink are talking about a ring Elvis has donated for auction, and maybe that's all Elvis did there. So, maybe on a technicality that's something you are referring to. The other shows were musical variety shows with Elvis as the entertainment, no interviews involved, same thing as the Frank Sinatra show. Those shows have been out on DVD for a long time. I question whether or not anything but the Hy Gardner and Wink Martindale should be deleted. Please advise. — Maile (talk) 13:40, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Televised interviews and variety shows don't really belong either. What sets the Sinatra show apart from those is that it was a television special. Snuggums (talk / edits) 15:00, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Just so we get everything in a row, so there is no later question about this. I will delete what you ask, if you can provide links to policy or guidelines that back this up. This being Elvis, I can see later edit wars, maybe even during this process, if there is nothing to substantiate this. — Maile (talk) 15:13, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Looking through WP:FILMOGRAPHY, it seems only films, TV shows (with episodes), and TV specials (which include TV films) are included. Snuggums (talk / edits) 15:33, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Then maybe it might be more prudent to move the article, because we have Peter Sellers on stage, radio, screen and record with "Television: guest appearances of Peter Sellers" (one of which was Steve Allen); Lauren Bacall on screen and stage appearing on 3 episodes of a quiz show and voicing a character on an animated episode; Terry-Thomas on screen, radio, stage and record on Toast of the Town, which was the Ed Sullivan show , and a whole slew of variety shows; Ralph Richardson, roles and awards whose credits look to include variety and/or awards shows; David Niven on screen, stage, radio, record and in print appearing on Jack Benny's variety show and an awards show; Stanley Holloway on stage and screen same thing. So, maybe this might work better if I just move the article. What do you think? — Maile (talk) 16:04, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- You have brought up a valid concern here. For lack of any policy or guideline to substantiate it, I've posted a question on WT: FLC Elvis Presley filmography - TV appearances. — Maile (talk) 16:17, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- With or without variety shows, at least get rid of televised interviews. They're not exactly television credits and pretty much anyone can give an interview when on TV. What makes me inclined to remove them is that simply appearing on such shows doesn't really count as TV roles in the same playing playing/voicing a character on a TV show. Hosting such shows would be different since one is known to be running the show as opposed to just making a guest appearance on public TV. Essentially, "host" is a role, "guest appearance" as oneself on such shows isn't. Snuggums (talk / edits) 16:25, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- You have brought up a valid concern here. For lack of any policy or guideline to substantiate it, I've posted a question on WT: FLC Elvis Presley filmography - TV appearances. — Maile (talk) 16:17, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Then maybe it might be more prudent to move the article, because we have Peter Sellers on stage, radio, screen and record with "Television: guest appearances of Peter Sellers" (one of which was Steve Allen); Lauren Bacall on screen and stage appearing on 3 episodes of a quiz show and voicing a character on an animated episode; Terry-Thomas on screen, radio, stage and record on Toast of the Town, which was the Ed Sullivan show , and a whole slew of variety shows; Ralph Richardson, roles and awards whose credits look to include variety and/or awards shows; David Niven on screen, stage, radio, record and in print appearing on Jack Benny's variety show and an awards show; Stanley Holloway on stage and screen same thing. So, maybe this might work better if I just move the article. What do you think? — Maile (talk) 16:04, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Looking through WP:FILMOGRAPHY, it seems only films, TV shows (with episodes), and TV specials (which include TV films) are included. Snuggums (talk / edits) 15:33, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Just so we get everything in a row, so there is no later question about this. I will delete what you ask, if you can provide links to policy or guidelines that back this up. This being Elvis, I can see later edit wars, maybe even during this process, if there is nothing to substantiate this. — Maile (talk) 15:13, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Televised interviews and variety shows don't really belong either. What sets the Sinatra show apart from those is that it was a television special. Snuggums (talk / edits) 15:00, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Let me make sure I am clear on your concerns. You are asking that talk shows and radio shows be removed. Well, there are no radio shows, so that takes care of that. Hy Gardner was a televised interview where Elvis and Gardner were the only people involved, not exactly a talk show, but I think it fits into what you are getting at. The Teenage Dance Party was a local version of American Bandstand. The only clip I've ever seen about that, is where Elvis and Wink are talking about a ring Elvis has donated for auction, and maybe that's all Elvis did there. So, maybe on a technicality that's something you are referring to. The other shows were musical variety shows with Elvis as the entertainment, no interviews involved, same thing as the Frank Sinatra show. Those shows have been out on DVD for a long time. I question whether or not anything but the Hy Gardner and Wink Martindale should be deleted. Please advise. — Maile (talk) 13:40, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
- Awards not withstanding, what I mean is include whether critics liked or didn't like his films. See Madonna filmography for a good example. I should note that the link FrB.TG gave pertains to tables, though, does not say anything against including box office figures in lead's prose. Snuggums (talk / edits) 23:57, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
- What I've check above was taken care of. Per what Frankie linked above, there is a consensus that budget and box office do not belong in a filmography. I've looked through Julia Roberts filmography, Ronald Reagan filmography, Charlie Chaplin filmography, James Cameron filmography, Amy Adams filmography - there doesn't seem to be budget and box office (financial success) in them. I don't see "critical success" in these either, unless you are talking about winning an Oscar. Elvis didn't win awards for his acting. I think what you're asking for here really belongs on the articles for the individual films. — Maile (talk) 22:54, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
I also concur with all of what FrB.TG says (especially with music career not belonging here). Snuggums (talk / edits) 23:16, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
Quick comments –
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Ref 4 has a page range with a p. which should be pp. (the second one in the cite) -
Unwanted quotation mark at the end of ref 17.Giants2008 (Talk) 21:13, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks. Taken care of. — Maile (talk) 21:29, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
For the second comment, you'll want to have a period at the end of the cite, for consistency with the other references.Giants2008 (Talk) 19:09, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks. Taken care of. — Maile (talk) 21:29, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
- Thank you for your support. — Maile (talk) 13:15, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
- Delegates, take this thread into account if you end up making a decision on this FLC. Giants2008 (Talk) 19:29, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
- @Giants2008: Thanks for catching. Credibility of account being the question, I've also reverted the change to the list suggested by this editor. — Maile (talk) 21:00, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
- Delegates, take this thread into account if you end up making a decision on this FLC. Giants2008 (Talk) 19:29, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
- Delegate note
Trying to keep this moving along; with the holidays everything around here is slowing to a crawl (happens every year). @SNUGGUMS: are you still opposing this FLC? --PresN 01:41, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
- I am until the TV listings prior to The Frank Sinatra Timex Show: Welcome Home Elvis are removed Snuggums (talk / edits) 04:32, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
Unfortunately, this nomination has now been open for 2 months without garnering a lot of (valid) support, so in order to keep the nominations queue moving I'm going to have to close it. No prejudice against re-nominating at a later date. --PresN 03:24, 2 January 2016 (UTC)
- Closing note: This candidate has been not promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.