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It is not just the Devanagari which has caused complaints. There have also been issues with the Japanese. Unfortunately, making a textual change to a complex rendered 3-D image is extremely complicated to do without the original files and process used to create the rendering. Changing the text on the rendered logo is not possible to do in a way that will yield visually acceptable results. The only acceptable solution is to re-create the logo from scratch so that it will look identical to the current logo, except with the text corrected. To do that requires a high degree of graphical skill. We cannot just "fix" the logo by hacking it up in Paintbrush. It will look terrible. [[User:Nohat|Nohat]] 16:40, 21 December 2006 (UTC) |
It is not just the Devanagari which has caused complaints. There have also been issues with the Japanese. Unfortunately, making a textual change to a complex rendered 3-D image is extremely complicated to do without the original files and process used to create the rendering. Changing the text on the rendered logo is not possible to do in a way that will yield visually acceptable results. The only acceptable solution is to re-create the logo from scratch so that it will look identical to the current logo, except with the text corrected. To do that requires a high degree of graphical skill. We cannot just "fix" the logo by hacking it up in Paintbrush. It will look terrible. [[User:Nohat|Nohat]] 16:40, 21 December 2006 (UTC) |
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:You created it right? Are you saying you don't have the original files anymore? If there are problems on other languages, [[commons:Image talk:Wikipedia-logo.png]] mentions some potential ones, can we have a centralized discussion about making the fixes? - [[User:Taxman|Taxman]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Taxman|Talk]]</small></sup> 16:47, 21 December 2006 (UTC) |
:You created it right? Are you saying you don't have the original files anymore? If there are problems on other languages, [[commons:Image talk:Wikipedia-logo.png]] mentions some potential ones, can we have a centralized discussion about making the fixes? - [[User:Taxman|Taxman]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Taxman|Talk]]</small></sup> 16:47, 21 December 2006 (UTC) |
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::It's not just a question of making fixes. You have to re-render the logo. I have most of the original files used for the rendering, but the process I used on the final rendering from the 3-D renderer to make it look like the current logo has been lost to the mists of the time. I have tried re-creating the logo on several occasions, and it never looks right. [[User:Nohat|Nohat]] 17:00, 21 December 2006 (UTC) |
Revision as of 17:00, 21 December 2006
I completely support this. That character has been a joke for too long. It's going to be very hard to make it change everywhere, but we may as well update the official copy as soon as possible. One of the quiz questions I wrote for Wikimania was related to that backwards character. I was surprised how few people knew about it. Hopefully this petition will change that. Angela. 14:54, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
- What an un-wiki way of doing things. Okay, the logo is wrong, you want the logo changed - then speak to the creator or upload fixed versions. Even 100 people signing a petition won't help if nobody modifies the logo and volunteers (the harder part) for creating 250 new logos for all language wikipedias. --Elian Talk 03:26, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
- The purpose of this petition is to create a positive atmosphere when such changes can be made. Since, it involves an issue directly related to Wikipedia, we need to first make sure that everyone is ready. The purpose of this petition is to convince the Wikimedia Foundation that this logo needs to be changed. When that is achieved, the author of the logo can be contacted to make the changes. Most of the logos I believe are derivatives of the same logo with alternate text embedded at the bottom. So it won't take much time to fix all when one is finished. Also since one person need not do everything, the work can be divided to spped up the process. The only place where wrong logos will be displayed are the screenshots and other forms of archive that archive images also. But I don't think we need to change that. When corporations change their logo, they don't have to wipe out their earlier logos. -Ambuj Saxena (talk) 04:29, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
Bah.
Couldn't we simply *do* this? It's a one-time effort to change the logo of all the Wikipedias, and then the logo is flawless... Please? All this voting is getting us nowhere, and slowly, too... —Nightstallion (?) 12:08, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
It fits the theme of the logo
Am I the only one that thinks it fits with the unfinished theme of the logo? The logo is an unfinished puzzle and File:Incorrect hindi vi.JPG could represent the beginning of a number of words like वक्रिम, वदि, etc. So why change it? - Taxman Talk 21:55, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
- Re: Your comment:
The others don't make full words of their own that I know of. Certainly W in English doesn't, and neither does File:Incorrect hindi vi.JPG. Both are however correct fragments of full words. I reallize the devanagari is incomplete, but my point is that fits with the logo's theme. But it's also not that big a deal to change it. Go to the logo page and contact the three or four editors named in the history and find someone that can make the fix. Then get a commons admin to make the change. There is no need to involve Jimbo in something of this variety. - Taxman Talk 21:44, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
- "W" is an alphabet whereas "File:Incorrect hindi vi.JPG " is an alphabet with a diacritic stressing an unkown alphabet. For a like to like comparison, the greek omega would appear something like this in the Wikipedia logo: Ω ˆ (omega with a circumflex accenting an unknown alphabet). Surely this would not be acceptable on the logo? The purpose of script is to record speech. While I accept that both, W and File:Incorrect hindi vi.JPG, are incomplete fragments that could be used as clues in a puzzle, the fragment must also make sense; more specifically, one should be able to speak it aloud. Even "incomplete fragments" should have rules and not just any fragment will do. For instance, "C" is a fragment of "OWL" but cannot be accepted as a clue for it invites a whole new set of difficulties in deciphering the clue. Regardless of the "puzzle" motif in Wikipedia's logo, each symbol from each of the different languages, should be, in my opinion, complete -- i.e. the symbol should be capable of being spoken aloud. File:Incorrect hindi vi.JPG cannot be spoken aloud. -- mowglee 07:00, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
- I've understood what you're saying all along, I simply don't agree that it's a problem. I think as a fragment of several words it fits with the theme, especially since it has to modify another character, it is exactly like an unfinished puzzle. It needs something else in exactly the same way. You agree don't because it's not a complete syllable and consider that a problem. That's fine, we can agree to disagree. But since other's have agreed with you there certainly is support for making a change and that change won't cause the logo to be more problematic, so might as well go ahead. If the people listed on the commons page don't respond, most anyone talented with image manipulation tools should be able to fix it, and there are a lot of those types of people working on commons. - Taxman Talk 16:38, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
Changing this one thing is not simple and is not the solution
It is not just the Devanagari which has caused complaints. There have also been issues with the Japanese. Unfortunately, making a textual change to a complex rendered 3-D image is extremely complicated to do without the original files and process used to create the rendering. Changing the text on the rendered logo is not possible to do in a way that will yield visually acceptable results. The only acceptable solution is to re-create the logo from scratch so that it will look identical to the current logo, except with the text corrected. To do that requires a high degree of graphical skill. We cannot just "fix" the logo by hacking it up in Paintbrush. It will look terrible. Nohat 16:40, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
- You created it right? Are you saying you don't have the original files anymore? If there are problems on other languages, commons:Image talk:Wikipedia-logo.png mentions some potential ones, can we have a centralized discussion about making the fixes? - Taxman Talk 16:47, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
- It's not just a question of making fixes. You have to re-render the logo. I have most of the original files used for the rendering, but the process I used on the final rendering from the 3-D renderer to make it look like the current logo has been lost to the mists of the time. I have tried re-creating the logo on several occasions, and it never looks right. Nohat 17:00, 21 December 2006 (UTC)