71.159.31.82 (talk) taking list of family out of view |
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== Documents of the the German Family of Johann Dzierzon == |
== Documents of the the German Family of Johann Dzierzon == |
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I am posting this (temporarily) to show the Dzierzon family menbers in Silesia and Saxony. Website http://www.familysearch.org LDS, Utah |
I am posting this (temporarily) to show the Dzierzon family menbers in Silesia and Saxony. Website http://www.familysearch.org LDS, Utah (type in Dzierzon) |
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Johann Dzierzon wrote down his own biography and stated that he lived with his brother's youngest son '''Franz Dzierzon'''. There are about 150 Dzierzons in the 2006 German Telephone book, including several Franz Dzierzon. |
Johann Dzierzon wrote down his own biography and stated that he lived with his brother's youngest son '''Franz Dzierzon'''. There are about 150 Dzierzons in the 2006 German Telephone book, including several Franz Dzierzon. |
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Line 309: | Line 309: | ||
Result from |
Result from {http://www.familysearch.org LDS ] |
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search for: Dzierzon |
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Exact Spelling: Off |
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[refine search] |
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Prepare selected records for download |
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International Genealogical Index / Germany - 194+ |
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Select records to download - (50 maximum) |
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1. Adam Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1726> <Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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2. Mrs Adam Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1730> <Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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3. Adolph Thomas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 11 FEB 1849 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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4. AGATHA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 08 FEB 1852 Katholisch, Falkowitz, Schlesien, Preussen |
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5. Alwine Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 16 DEC 1850 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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6. Alwine Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 14 DEC 1855 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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7. Andreas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 19 NOV 1785 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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8. Andreas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 28 FEB 1797 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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9. Andreas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 28 FEB 1797 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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10. ANDREAS DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 28 FEB 1797 Kunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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11. Andreas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 08 JUL 1821 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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12. Andreas Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1842 Of Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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13. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 21 JAN 1777 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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14. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1800> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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15. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1800> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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16. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 29 APR 1802 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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17. ANNA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 29 APR 1802 Kunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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18. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 29 APR 1802 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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19. Anna dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 26 OCT 1827 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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20. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 JAN 1833 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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21. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1842 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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22. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1848 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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23. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1848 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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24. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 08 MAY 1848 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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25. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 23 JUN 1849 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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26. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 26 JUL 1863 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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27. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 24 MAY 1864 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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28. Anna Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Marriage: 16 NOV 1916 Breslau,Nreslau, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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29. Anton Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 10 JAN 1850 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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30. Anton Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 01 JAN 1864 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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31. Apollonia Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 09 FEB 1846 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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32. ARNO KURT DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 27 AUG 1915 Grobschirma, , , Sachsen |
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33. Augustin Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 17 AUG 1853 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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34. August Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 29 AUG 1854 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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35. Balzer Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1816 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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36. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1763 Of Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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37. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 16 NOV 1789 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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38. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 16 NOV 1789 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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39. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1834 Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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40. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1834 Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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41. BARBARA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 06 DEC 1854 Katholisch, Falkowitz, Schlesien, Preussen |
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42. Barbara Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 03 DEC 1855 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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43. BARTHOLOMAEUS DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 25 AUG 1844 Katholisch, Falkowitz, Schlesien, Preussen |
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44. Beata Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 14 DEC 1855 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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45. Bertha Alma Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 OCT 1876 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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46. Bertha Alma Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 OCT 1876 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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47. BERTHA ELSA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 02 MAY 1900 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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48. BERTHA ELSA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 02 MAY 1900 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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49. Christine Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 29 AUG 1854 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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50. Christina Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 20 JUL 1868 Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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51. Christina Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 29 FEB 1868 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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52. Daniel Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1814> Bodland, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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53. Daniel Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1814> Bodland, Schlesien, Preussen |
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54. Dominik Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1799> <Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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55. Mrs Dominik Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1803> <Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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56. Dominik Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 31 JUL 1850 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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57. Ella Martha Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 JUN 1898 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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58. Ella Martha Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 JUN 1898 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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59. Ella Martha Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 JUN 1898 Grossvoigteberg, , Dresden, Sachsen |
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60. Ella Martha Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 JUN 1898 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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61. ELLI EMMA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 13 AUG 1907 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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62. ELSA BERTHA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 02 MAY 1900 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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63. ELSA BERTHA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 02 MAY 1900 Grossvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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64. EMMA ELLI DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 MAR 1907 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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65. EMMA ELLY DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Marriage: 13 APR 1929 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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66. Erna Elsa Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 24 SEP 1905 Kleinvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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67. Erna Elsa Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 24 SEP 1905 Kleinvoigtsberg, Dresden, Sachsen |
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68. Erna Elsa Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 24 SEP 1905 Kleisvoigtsberg, , Dresden, Sachsen |
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69. Eva Katharina Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 OCT 1861 Wittendorf, , , Germany |
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70. EVA KATHARINA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 OCT 1861 Wittendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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71. EVA KATHARINA DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 18 OCT 1861 Wittendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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72. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1837 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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73. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1844 Of Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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74. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 22 NOV 1845 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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75. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 27 MAY 1847 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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76. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 20 JUL 1853 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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77. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 24 FEB 1861 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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78. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 10 APR 1863 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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79. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 07 JUL 1865 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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80. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 17 JAN 1866 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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81. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 01 DEC 1867 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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82. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 25 JUN 1870 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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83. Franz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 25 JUN 1870 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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84. Franciska Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 19 SEP 1844 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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85. Franciska Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1848 Of Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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86. Francisca Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 14 FEB 1853 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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87. Frieda Dora Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 JUN 1911 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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88. Frieda Dora Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 JUN 1911 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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89. Frieda Dora Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 JUN 1911 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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90. Frieda Dora Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 11 JUN 1911 Grossschirma, Dresden, Sachsen |
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91. Gregor Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1717 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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92. Gregor Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1717 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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93. Gregor Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1756 Of Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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94. gregor dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1765 Of Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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95. Gregor Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 06 MAR 1806 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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96. Gregor Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 06 MAR 1806 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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97. GREGOR DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 06 MAR 1806 Kunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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98. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1760 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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99. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1760 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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100. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1763 Of Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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101. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 10 OCT 1771 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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102. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 12 OCT 1778 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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103. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1785> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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104. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1785> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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105. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1831 Of Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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106. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1841 Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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107. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: About 1841 Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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108. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 22 SEP 1847 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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109. Hedwig Francisca Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 04 OCT 1849 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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110. HEDWIG DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Christening: 27 SEP 1849 Katholisch, Falkowitz, Schlesien, Preussen |
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111. Hedwig Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 17 OCT 1856 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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112. Ignaz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 28 JUL 1848 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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113. Ignatz Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 05 MAY 1856 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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114. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 25 APR 1788 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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115. Jacob dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 04 MAY 1825 <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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116. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 20 JUL 1835 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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117. Jakob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 20 JUL 1835 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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118. Jakob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 20 JUL 1835 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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119. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 28 JUN 1853 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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120. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 27 APR 1856 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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121. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 15 JUL 1862 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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122. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 23 JUL 1863 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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123. Jacob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 23 JUL 1863 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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124. Jakob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 30 MAR 1866 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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125. Jakob Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 30 MAR 1866 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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126. johanna dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: 29 JUL 1795 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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127. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1749 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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128. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1749 Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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129. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1752 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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130. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1752 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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131. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1753> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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132. Mrs Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1757> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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133. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1763> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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134. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1766 Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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135. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1766 Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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136. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 11 OCT 1777 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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137. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 01 DEC 1780 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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138. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 15 MAY 1782 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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139. johann dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 14 NOV 1791 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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140. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1800> <Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen> |
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141. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1802 Of Lowkowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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142. Mrs Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1804> <Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen> |
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143. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1805> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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144. Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1807> <Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen> |
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145. Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1807> <Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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146. Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1808> <Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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147. Mrs Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1809> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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148. Mrs Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1811> <Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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149. JOHANN DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 16 JAN 1811 Low Kowitz, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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150. Mrs Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1812> <Of Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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151. Johann dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 07 APR 1814 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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152. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1817 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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153. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1819 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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154. Johann dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 19 MAR 1820 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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155. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 JUN 1825 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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156. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1825 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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157. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 JUN 1825 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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158. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1827 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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159. Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1830 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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160. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 12 DEC 1830 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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161. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 12 DEC 1830 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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162. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 12 DEC 1830 Niederkunzendorf, , , Germany |
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163. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1830 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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164. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 12 DEC 1830 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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165. JOHANN DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 DEC 1830 Kunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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166. Johann oder Jan Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 03 JUN 1832 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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167. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 22 JUN 1838 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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168. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 22 JUN 1838 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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169. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1847 <Bischdorf,Rosenberg, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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170. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 23 MAY 1850 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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171. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 24 MAY 1853 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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172. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 19 MAY 1856 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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173. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 13 DEC 1857 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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174. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 02 NOV 1859 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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175. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 21 AUG 1860 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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176. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 21 AUG 1860 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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177. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 31 DEC 1861 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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178. Johannes Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 03 SEP 1865 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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179. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 17 OCT 1865 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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180. Johann Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 24 JAN 1869 Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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181. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 01 JAN 1787 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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182. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1796> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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183. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1796> <Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen> |
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184. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 JAN 1796 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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185. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 JAN 1796 Niederkunzendorf, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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186. JOSEPH DZIERZON - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 12 JAN 1796 Kunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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187. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: < 1800> <Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen> |
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188. Mrs Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Female Birth: < 1804> <Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen> |
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189. Joseph dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Christening: 11 APR 1812 Lowkowitz, , Schlesien, Preussen |
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190. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1822 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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191. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: 1824 Oberkunzendorf, Schlesien, Preussen |
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192. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1826 Of Oberkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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193. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1839 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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194. Joseph Dzierzon - International Genealogical Index |
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Gender: Male Birth: About 1841 Of Niederkunzendorf, Kreuzburg, Schlesien, Preussen |
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== I hope you will be the person who will change errors on Ge Wiki == |
== I hope you will be the person who will change errors on Ge Wiki == |
Revision as of 02:05, 17 December 2006
Insistence on Polish
Dear 1) Dzierżon first name is Jan. This name was given him at baptism and should be respected. 2) His family name is Dzieżon the second z is with dot on top. This is how he signed himself in Polish language. 3) He left clear statement saying: “As my name says I am Polish..” so he is Polish not only by origin but from choice. 4) He resigned from presbytery in 1868 but it does not mean he become free of priesthood orders. 5) His family was Polish not ethnic Polish. Both father and mother did not speak German at all. 6) You have no evidence about joining Old Catholic Church by Dzierżon. You supposition are on the base of wrong Soltisec statement. You do not have any other documents as registration from the Old Catholic Church etc.
I revert you changes, also some that could be matter of comas. It is just to much to repair all you ravage step by step. Please take for consideration the 6 major points above and start discussion and proving. Also be sure I will not be convinced by some Nazi or neo Nazi publications dated decades ago. In Polish and English newest publication discuses facts and documents. I do not know any recent SCENTIFIC publications in German which would support you statements. If you have some let me know and we will look for mediator. Andrew Serafin 20:06, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
Hello Andrew/Serafin
First off, I agree fully with you that names should be respected. You do not show an actual document , but I go along with Jan. Wikipedia does not respect names though. German names are constantly translated. Only Polish names are wide-spred- despite wikipedia policy against this. The German Wikipedia article and the Silesian 2006 newspaper show the Old Catholic. To your point about Polish or ethnic Polish. He was born in Silesia, Prussia and died in Silesia, Germany. There was no Poland in his lifetime. There was a Polish Russia, be he did not live there. If you think you want to ravage the article again and remove all info, I will not make any further corrections on it. I inserted the 2006 article from Silesia on him.
I added Family website with photo of Johann Dzierzon's grave. Labbas 29 Nov 2006
Record of Johann Dzierzons birth filmed by LDS Mormons
For his name look here... --80.133.9.237 09:19, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
- type in Dzierzon, search, for a number of Dzierzons in Germany, etc result several 100's Germany, 5 Poland
Kirchenbuch (church book) entries of Lowkowitz, Kreis Kreuzburg
At the Mormon LDS Fimily History Centers FHS one can order and look at the filmed records of the original Kirchenbuch (church book) entries of Taufen, Heiraten, Tote, Birth, Marriage, Death) of inhabitants. The church book for Lowkowitz, Silesia, Germany was filmed and is available at the LDS from 1765 - 1948, when Communist Soviet Union and Poland conquered and administered eastern Germany.
Labbas 4 December 2006
Good you agree with Jan since in English would be John but not Johann :) Regarding the Old Catholic issue, I sent a request to the author to fix his mistake. It is no matter that Poland did not existed on the map (thanks the Prussian aggressions anyway). Are you suggesting that a country seize other and can additionally arrogantly claim achievements of grabbed population as its own culture? I will ask you something if you country would be sized by other one would you accept the occupants statements you are no German? Thanks for you good attitude you will not destroy the article content. I will continue my effort to provide true information about Dr Jan Dzierzon with my best knowledge. Best regards, Andrew Serafin 05:43, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello Andrew /Serafin someone # 131. had removed a number of facts, which I had gathered in the meanwhile.
It has become clear, that Dzierzon was born in Silesia in the Kingdom of Prussia , and he died in the same place , when it was Germany. His grave stone shows Dr. Johann Dzierzon, the entry of his birth (actual filmed Kirchenbuecher (church books), shows Johann Dzierzon, father Simon, mother Maria. Hundreds of other Dzierzon with German first names are listed in the church book entries at the LDS, Utah. There are less than a handfull entries of Dzierzon claimed to have been born in Poland. There is one entry for Jan Dzierzon, claimed to have been born in Poland.
Sorry , but the last king of Poland resigned and left and there was no Poland. Besides that, Johann Dzierzon did never live in the part, that was Poland, but he lived in Silesia, Prussia, Germany. It might well have been that at same previous time some of his ancestors might have been Polish, that was or is standard for many Germans, because a thousand years ago, when the German emperors gave Land in Lien (Land on Loan) to Mieszko I, by making him the first duke of the Polans there was never a line that said Poles are not allowed to live in Germany or vice versa, not until the 20th century anyway, when allied super powers for the first time in a thousand years came up with those dividing lines and took land away from people and 'gave' it to others ('Treaty' of Versailles) (Potsdam Agreement).
Until you can post here actual documents (copies) showing otherwise, he was born and he died Johann Dzierzon, a Silesian, Prussian, German with perhaps Polish ancestors. Labbas, 1 December 2006
I possibly mentioned to you that the grave stone was put there by Austrian Beekeeping Society (it is free translation of the name). The German was the official language of that time and was preferred by the founders. Originally for first year there was simple wooden cross and plate in Polish language (Brożek 1978). The grave stone is not prove that his Christian name was Johann. Kingdom of Prussia existed from 1701 up to 1918, thus Dzierzon was born and died (1906) in Prussia. Again, he was born in Prussia but he was Polish, is it impossible? It is one thing to be citizen of a country (even fully accepting citizen duties and the country boarders) and be a Polish or German nationality. Why A. Einstein is not call German? (see English and German Wiki). The Poland continued its existence in hearts of Poles for centuries – prove the Silesian plebiscite in 1918. Actually I feel offended by a German who recall nonexistence of my country as a prove to his doubtful hypothesis. I repeat nonexistence of Poland ON MAPS was a result of Prussian aggression, as one of main things.
Silesia was part of Polish Kingdom at least from X century and it is very possible Dzierzon was the descent of the native Slavic population in Silesia. Name of his great-grandfather Jerzy (1717-1800) appears in the oldest Polish chronicles of Lowkowitz (W. Kocowicz 1987). His father and mother did not spoke a word in German it is known since in courts cases a translator was employed (W. Kocowicz 1987). Also his nephew Franciszek confirmed that (L. Brożek 1978, W. Kocowicz 1987 and others). Thus not his ancestors but most closely his parents were Polish.
It is very nationalistic and unfunded claim that German emperors give land to Mieszko I, nobody make him duke. You do not have prove he pledged to German emperors, do you? In addition, Bolesław I Chrobry was not vassal but considered as sovereign and friend of emperor in 1000. For the Potsdam and Versailles was a god reason, was it not? I feel much more assured with such separation that there will be no more wars, conflicts or just simple argues. Regarding you request for posting documents: 1) I agree he was born in Kingdom of Prussia (it is secondary – non important fact) 2) I give you two publication in English: W. Kocowicz 1987 and W. Chmielewski 2006 seems to me you ignored it. Also I provided three possition in Polish. I suppose if you want dissuse Jan Dzierżon history you should study the positions also – as I study publications in German. It is obvious for me that to talk about subject you should study the oposite views also. If you do not know Polish you should leave the discussion to some German who knows it. I will give you a name of sombody like that. He disscussed with me on German and Polish Wiki, he knows my arguments. 3) There is no doubts about his parents origin so you “perhaps” shows absolute lack of knowledge. 4) Jan Dzierzon said: “As my name says I am Polish…” he considered himself as Pole. Call [1]for this confiramtion. 5) Also there at the link: [2] if you would make a minimum effort the “Urodzony w polskiej rodzinie…” means “Born in Polish Family…” 6) Because of this family staff his given name was Jan.
I ask you to enter the German new links in order after those which were first - nobody removed this new links they were put in different order.
Lowkowitz, Landkreis Kreuzburg O.S. (from 1936-1945 called Bienendorf after him) and after 1945 Łowkowice, where he died on 26 October 1906, at the age of 95. It has no sense. Rychbach was renamed after his name. Łowkowice was renamed Bienendorf in years 1936-1945. In 1945 returned to the original name. You removed more important subject.
He discovered the parthenogenesis in 1835 and publicized 10 years later. Just he wanted to be sure. OK?
That was 1838 when he modernized Christa’s hive to some level. This was not movable-frame but movable comb hive. Movable frame was devised in 1852 by Berlepsch on base of Dzierzon discoveries and directions.
There is the link to his Ausführliche Biografie [3] let me know where is the Old Catholic story. I could not find in the past or present search.
He reported that most of his publications were done at Beck-Verlag in Nördlingen is little interest I think. Best, Anderew Serafin 03:37, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Polish?
Isnt it somewhat strange, to call someone Polish when 1) all his works mentioned in this article where written in German, 2) he was born in Germany, lived in Germany and died in Germany, 3) he went to school and studied in Breslau (which was a German city than) where of course he had speak and write German, 4) his grave stone reads Johann, which is a German name (and not Jan), 5) his own biography was written in German description of his live by him self 6) his relatives now live in Germany (like here gand-grand-niece Ursula Nordhorn)? There is still no proove for the constant claim by Mr Anderew that he called himself Polish. Might we see some Polish patriotism at work here? --Adbo2009 01:08, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
According to Kluczbork city site Dzierżon's parents were Polish. It means probably that they talked Polish/Silesian at home. I don't know what was the opinion of Dzierżon's about himself, I would rather believed he was German. However points 1 to 6 don't prove he was German. The same points can be used to describe many Lithuanians/Ukerainians who learned Polish and their relatives now live in Poland. Many points are true for allegedly pure Lithuanian Laurynas Gucevičius. Was Joseph Conrad English? It's not obvious. Xx236 16:17, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Right, not obvious. As my grandfather came from the village Chudowa, close to Kluczbork, most of the people there were quite well integrated in German society, although they had Polish names and spoke both languages (more or less). But that does not prove a thing about Dzierzon himself. I was just surprised he was definetely Polish. Difficult to describe. --Adbo2009 12:56, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
The introduction
I mentioned him as a Prussian-German in the lead as per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (biographies)#Opening paragraph:
- Nationality (In the normal case this will mean the country of which the person is a citizen or national, or was a citizen when the person became notable. Ethnicity should generally not be emphasized in the opening unless it is relevant to the subject's notability.).
I listed both his Polish and German name and mentioned that he published in both languages (as mentioned at de:Johann Dzierzon). Olessi 17:59, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Article title
Putting aside the argument over whether he was Polish or German, this article should be at a title that is English (dubious for this individual) or is most recognizable.
From Google Books:
- Johann Dzierzon
- Bees In America: How the Honey Bee Shaped a Nation by Tammy Horn [4]
- Bee by Claire Preston [5]
- Bramble-Bees and Others by Jean-Henri Fabre [6]
- Science, History and Social Activism: A Tribute to Everett Mendelsohn by Garland E Allen [7] (also uses Johannes Dzierzon)
- Psyche: Journal of Entomology and A Century of Mendelism in Human Genetics also use " Johann Dzierzon", although their contents have been removed from Google Books.
- Jan Dzierzon
- John Dzierzon
- Johannes Dzierzon
- Robbing the Bees: A Biography of Honey by Holley Bishop [12]
- Science, History and Social Activism: A Tribute to Everett Mendelsohn by Garland E Allen [13] (also uses Johann Dzierzon)
- American Philosophical Society Proceedings [14]
- The Dark European Honey Bee by Friedrich Ruttner, Eric Milner, John E Dews [15]
From regular Google with English language searches (disregarding forks):
- Johann Dzierzon
- ScienceDaily.com "Honeybee Gene Find Ends 150-year Search" [16]
- Milestones and Rates of Growth in the Development of Biology by Bentley Glass (JSTOR)
- Gregor Mendel & His Precursors by Conway Zickle (JSTOR)
- The Handbook of Texas Online [17], based on the work of W. Geiser
- NewScientist.com - "Honeybee sex mystery solved at last"[18]
- Journal of Heredity Online - "Some Oddities in the Delayed Discovery of Mendelism" by Conway Zirkle log-in required
- The Emergence of Hymenopteran Genetics by Robert E. Page, Jr., Jürgen Gadau, and Martin Beye [19]
- BioEssays - "The dice of fate: the csd gene and how its allelic composition regulates sexual development in the honey bee, Apis mellifera" by Martin Beye [20]
- Australian EJournal of Theology - "Historical Participation of Christian Church Ministers to the Development of Science: An Ecumenical Survey" by François Barriquand [21]
- "Cultivating a ‘slavic modern’: Yugoslav beekeeping, schooling and travel in the 1920s and 1930s" by Noah W. Sobe [22]
- Jan Dzierzon
- "Apiculture and Culture- Books on Bees and Beekeeping" (exhibit) [23] [24]
- Darwin Correspondence Project "Letter number 2260" [25]
- Core Historical Literature of Agriculture (library listing as "Jan") [26]
- IBRA "International Apicultural Scientific Conference on the Centenary of Jan Dzierzon's Death" [27]
- Ohio History "Volume 57" [28]
- Beedata.com "Apis-UK Issue No.34 April 2005" [29]
- First European Conference of Apidology - "Pollination and the pollinator imperative" [30]
- Kluczbork city history [31]
- National Museum of Agriculture in Szreniawa [32]
- John Dzierzon
- Johannes Dzierzon
- "Life Before Model Systems: General Zoology at August Weismann's Institute" by Frederick Churchill [36]
- History of Biology: Cuvier, Schwann and Schleiden [37]
- "Spermatogenesis of a Haploid Parthenogenetic Hymenopteran, Spilocryptus extrematus (Cresson)" by Carl H. Koonz [38]
- A Review of Parthenogenesis by Everett F. Phillips (JSTOR)
- Brazilian Journal of Genetics "Sex determination in honey bees (Apinae and Meliponinae) and its consequences" by Warwick Estevam Kerr [39]
- "Arrhenotokous / Thelytokous Reproduction" Fred Legner [40]
- 3rd European Congress on Social Insects - "Portraits and puzzles in the history of insect sociobiology" by Christopher K. Starr [41]
While there does not seem to be an overwhelming usage of one name over another, "Johann(es)" seems to be used a little more often in English texts. Olessi 00:04, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Jan Dzierzon
It is offensive to equalize citizenship with nationality. The nationality has nothing to do with citizenship until the interested individual freely integrate with second nation. It is not case of Jan Dzierzon. He considered himself Polish. It is offensive to Polish people to seize achievements of one of us. I ask many people, many time, to give me recent example of serious work in German language (that means German historians, museum) which claim Jan Dzierzon was German. I mean recent since on German Wiki cites Nazi propagandist Karl Fleischer. In the case of Polish biographers, they prove he was not willing to integrate and he considered himself Polish. I already mentioned in previous part of the discussion on En Wiki where you can search for Polish sources. Andrew 06Dec06 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.104.218.46 (talk) 02:46, 7 December 2006 (UTC).
- I mention again the manual of style- Dzierzon was a citizen of Prussia (and later Germany), and the manual of style specifically mentions including citizenship (and places a lesser emphasis on ethnicity). A proper phrasing would be "... was a Prussian-German apiarist of Polish ethnicity. He was famous for ..." Olessi 04:22, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Name Jan
This is since for decades the nationality of Jan Dzierżon had been provided in wrong way. However it can not be continued. The erros have to be fix up for the true. No aceptation for twists of the name. Andrew 06Dec06 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.104.218.46 (talk) 02:54, 7 December 2006 (UTC).
- Keep in mind that there are differences in English between nationality and ethnicity. As an English-speaking American editing on the English Wikipedia, I am interested in how this individual is primarily known in English. Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people) explains that the ideal title is "the most common name of a person or thing that does not conflict with the names of other people or things". Hence, my investigation through Google to find out how he is most commonly known in English.
- I did not pay attention to the publication dates of the material, so some of them may indeed be outdated. Based on the evidence at my disposal, it seems that he traditionally has been known by Germanic names he published under, which is why I suggested the change. The lack of widespread sources mentioning Dzierzon means that there is not a standard designation for him, however, and I am certainly not insisting on a page move. If you can provide more recent English works attesting to the usage of this individual's Polish name, I would certainly be supportive of his name being at the Polish title.
- I would like to advise all involved parties to assume good faith and tone down some of the rhetoric used. Please remember that Wikipedia works by building consensus. Olessi 04:22, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Citation needed
I added the [citation needed] template to the statement that he "recognized himself as Pole". While I have no opinion on the accuracy of the statement (I had never heard of him before this week), it is vitally important to provide verifiability, and I could see the statement being challenged in the future. Olessi 04:29, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Are you on duty from Ge Wiki? You did not heard about Jan Dzierzon up to recent week and you want switch article, yes? You have given there two English position and three Polish in Literature. Please read it. In this circumstances, direct you also to contact Kluczborg museum and ask for facts. There was an article in: Dziennik Zachodni 1961, nr 190 B. S.: "Samo moje nazwisko mówi, żem Polak z urodzenia". There should be most of answer to you questions regarding citation. I will be appreciate if you will first ask me question before changing the text. Because you are completely unfamiliar with the subject I sense you action as hostile intrusion. See my comments to revisions also. Andrew 07Dec06 1:02am
- I am not "on duty" from the German Wikipedia; practically the only editing I do there is interwiki linking. As I mentioned before, I am disinterested in how his name is presented in Polish or German, rather I am interested only in English sources (WP:UE). Unfortunately, I do not speak Polish and have no way to access Dziennik Zachodni. I did not list [citation needed] to doubt you, but so that a reference can be added to the article. Please see Wikipedia:Citing sources for how and why to cite references. I will incorporate Dziennik Zachodni into a References section to assist you.
- I am not a monarchist or revanchist; I listed both Prussian and German since those were the states he held citizenship with. Wikipedia's manual of style explicitly states to mention that. Additionally, including "only" when describing his Prussian Order of the Crown (4th class) is not describing the situation from a neutral point of view. It can be included if there is a published reason why Dzierzon "only" received it in the 4th class, but not just if you are simply of the opinion that he deserved a higher honor.
- Keep in mind that there is no ownership of articles. It is unusual for my actions to be seen as a "hostile invasion"; I ask again that you assume good faith.Olessi 07:39, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Prussian citizenship
Yes Dzierzon was citizen of Prussia and I will fix it to “citizen of Prussia”. Ethnicity is = “An ethnic quality or affiliation resulting from racial or cultural ties.” This is something different then Nationality = The status of belonging to a particular nation by birth. Ethnicity is very weak term. Nation is something more then ethnic group. Please do not switch.
- As an English-speaking American editing on the English Wikipedia, I am interested in how this individual is primarily known in English.
I am not interested in the English way of dealing with words. This can be used for names of thinks like knife or building. We deal with historic person whose name should be respected according to his wish – even if totalitarian, occupant or somebody like this changed it - actually for his sneaky purpose.
- Based on the evidence at my disposal, it seems that he traditionally has been known by Germanic names he published under, which is why I suggested the change.
I suggest to respect the will of the person and his compatriots, and do not continue the Germanic drift. Looking on you interests on you web page seems to me you are interested in that, are you not?
- The lack of widespread sources mentioning Dzierzon means that there is not a standard designation for him, however, and I am certainly not insisting on a page move. If you can provide more recent English works attesting to the usage of this individual's Polish name, I would certainly be supportive of his name being at the Polish title.
I hope you will not change the name anyway, but I will look for other older edition in English. Take for consideration that we had limited option to do such editions before 1990. I suggest you to look for most current standpoint in Kluczborg museum. At present time when Poland communicate with world more intensively the old Nazi propaganda is there verified.
- Would you happen to know if Dzierzon was of Polish or Silesian background?
You provoking me or you present lack of knowledge. Silesians happened to be Slavic tribe. They spoke Polish or some Polish dialect, if you like. (You can believe me the dialect is not much different from literary (official) Polish language than any other Polish dialect.) Dzierzon recognized himself as Polish. He also consider himself as Silesian since in the same sentence he says: “Regarding my nationality, I am obviously, just as my name says, Polish of birth, since on Silesia people speak Polish…” This is rough (word to word) translation from Polish, however I believe you got the sense. Somebody can call himself Silesian because he lives in Silesia no matter what nationality he is Polish, German or Czech etc. However, true (native) Silesian is somebody like Dzierzon whose family is so ancient that could come from the ancient, native Slavic tribe.
- I would like to advise all involved parties to assume good faith and tone down some of the rhetoric used.
Thank you for advice :) but I do not advise anybody if the person do not ask for. It is offensive since, it suggest I am wiser than the other is :). It could be doubtful is not it?
- Please remember that Wikipedia works by building consensus.
As you possibly know, a consensus not always is possible. Take for consideration a case when somebody take other prosperity and become accustomed to it. Do you think Poland took something what does not belong to her? Seems to me this could be somebody trouble.
- Unfortunately, I do not speak Polish and have no way to access Dziennik Zachodni.
Well if you have a good will you can at least read one of the publication in English. You could see that I am not only one who says Dzierzon is Polish and his name is Jan Dzierżon. If you want be objective you can found that there is lack of recent German publication saying he was German.
- I did not list [citation needed] to doubt you, but so that a reference can be added to the article. Please see Wikipedia:Citing sources for how and why to cite references. I will incorporate Dziennik Zachodni into a References section to assist you.
Thank you for assistance. I have so many assistances on German Wiki.
- I am not a monarchist or revanchist; I listed both Prussian and German since those were the states he held citizenship with.
Yes. I as told, the true – citizenship will be here as well as the nationality.
- Wikipedia's manual of style explicitly states to mention that. Additionally, including "only" when describing his Prussian Order of the Crown (4th class) is not describing the situation from a neutral point of view.
No it is not neutral. It is totally objective and Dzierżon’s subjective.
- It can be included if there is a published reason why Dzierzon "only" received it in the 4th class, but not just if you are simply of the opinion that he deserved a higher honor.
You can judge yourself. As I mentioned to you this is one of examples how Prussian governors treated Dzierzon and vice versa. Obviously, somebody like Karl Fleischer (NSDAP) pass over these facts. Obviously it would proof Dzierzon did not integrated with Prussia.
- Keep in mind that there is no ownership of articles. It is unusual for my actions to be seen as a "hostile invasion";
You revert the article upside down. You show much of interest in Polish-German affairs. And you did the revert after week (or less) of study only. Conclussion …
- I ask again that you assume good faith.
I do not assume good faith after my German Wiki experience. Are you able to understand this? Andrew--Serafin 21:26, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
- Andrew, I have not made any comments out of a desire to provoke you. I have been editing this article out of a desire to ensure it meets the standards and conventions of the English Wikipedia. I am sorry you had a negative experience with the German Wikipedia, but that is a separate project from this English project. Assuming good faith is a fundamental principle of the English Wikipedia; I advise you to give editors a chance instead of assuming the worst. I inquired about Silesian/Polish because Silesians are sometimes considered a separate ethnic group. I am not sure what you mean by "reverting the article upside down"; my editing has been done to ensure that its formatting and style is consistent with other biographical articles. As I do not anticipate being able to copy-edit the article further, I am removing it from my watchlist. Good luck with the article. Olessi 23:02, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
This discussion reminds me the one about Laurynas Gucevičius. He was born in a Lithuanian family, he was using Polish name Wawrzyniec Gucewicz. The article is protected since July. If Gucewicz is Lithuanian Laurynas Gucevičius, so Jan Dzierżon is Polish and the article should be protected. Xx236 10:13, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
- Where do you mean is the protection at Gucevičius? I found any on En Pl Li or Ge Wiki. I first time hear about Gucevičius anyway.
- Seems to me he was mixed origin. Problem whose origin father or mother should be first (mean Polish-Lithuanian or Lithuanian-Polish). But I am in favor of the individual declaration, if existed. In the case of Lithuanians they very often Polonaised (I would not say Polished :))) freely – even they did not recognized difference between Lithuanian and Polish. I think Mickiewicz would be good exempale, Piłsucki, can be Sienkiewicz - who can count all of them. Any way this is somewhat easier to accept Lithuanian-Polish or even Lithuanian than some other cases. (For modern Lithuanians point of view – they lost intellectual elite)
- What about Mary Curie-Skłodowska? On Fe Wiki seems to me is “French naturalized Polish physicist”, it is not too bad. Chopin is a composer and a Polish pianist. Dzierzon at least on En Wiki is Polish.
- Well, I think most blocks are on Ge Wiki :)))))). If somebody counted? Andrew--Serafin 04:20, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
- The protection was removed just after my comment, En.
Xx236 12:14, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
- "I do not assume good faith after my German Wiki experience." - correction: the german wiki doesn't assume good faith any more after its experience with you ;-) --217.91.17.62 10:20, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
For the ANONIMUS: German Wiki need not assume my good fight. It will be enough if German Wiki will respect true ie. will be objective. After that, you can look for definition of “chauvinism”. Of course, I cannot imagine that you ever will apologize for you errors :)))). This is characteristic of higher culture. Best, Andrew Serafin 06:52, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
- Serafin, please do not attack this anonymous user. no personal attacks are allowed whatsoever on Wikipedia. the anon also bordered on a personal attack, but seeing as he was pointing out a flaw in your logic I do not think it would be a personal attack. I fail to see how you can possibly claim that all of the thousands of German wiki users are wrong, but you are right, especially when you have run into the same objections here, from Polish editors nonetheless, seeing as you have come accross as a polish nationalist so far. I am assuming you are the same editor as this anon
- --Jadger 11:31, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
- Don't assume, here you can read it! --80.133.67.41 12:46, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
Notes to German chauvinists
See [42] —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.104.218.46 (talk) 18:22, 16 December 2006 (UTC).
- please, no personal attacks.
- --Jadger 19:14, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
Anyone who has an opposing view than A.Serafin on Dzierzon, please state it here:
Documents of the the German Family of Johann Dzierzon
I am posting this (temporarily) to show the Dzierzon family menbers in Silesia and Saxony. Website http://www.familysearch.org LDS, Utah (type in Dzierzon)
Johann Dzierzon wrote down his own biography and stated that he lived with his brother's youngest son Franz Dzierzon. There are about 150 Dzierzons in the 2006 German Telephone book, including several Franz Dzierzon.
!31... Andrew Serafin is posting intimidating, attacking messages at EN and DE wikipedia. His insistence on Polish, not backed-up by any factual documents, only by someones book note, are contrary to all documents available including Dzierzon's own family descendends website.
Result from {http://www.familysearch.org LDS ]
search for: Dzierzon
LDS Church Sites | LDS Country Sites
This wass posted temporarily only for viewing. It was removed Labbas 16 December 2006
I hope you will be the person who will change errors on Ge Wiki
Dear Anonimus or 71.159.31.82 go to “Notes to German chauvinists” and link #42. Read there: “This is a note to the primary of Chauvinists” you will find there some sources of informatin which supports my assumption. Your gerealogy certificate prove only the forceful germanizsation in Prussia. If you will enter “Jan” instead “Johann” you will get [43] “Franz” in Polish is “Franciszek”. What is most interesting you have his name in German phonebook and we Polish have his testimonies that Jan was Pole :))). Plese do not ask me to translate all the books about Jan Dzierzon from Polish to English or German.A
- I would not recommend reading the "notes to German chauvinists" as the title obviously shows it is just a personal attack and has no basis in fact. It is best described as user:131.104.218.46's own kind of Mein Kampf, wherein he blames a conspiracy theory on the German wikipedia (and now on the english one) of meddling with his version of history. Why is the fact that his ancestors hundreds of years before were Poles? do his ancestors determine what he does with his life? the answer of course is no, so why does his ancestry matter? it had no impact on his life or why he is notable on a encyclopedia
- --Jadger 23:47, 16 December 2006 (UTC)